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Thread: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

  1. #131
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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    I won't contest that there have been cases where cops have unfairly targeted blacks. I won't even contest that there have been situations where that abuse was systemic. Heck, I had this conversation with a client from Detroit who made a pretty good case about cops targeting blacks in the 50's and 60's because the unions didn't want any blacks in representative positions and if you had a record you couldn't be a representative. That being said, because it happened before or is happening in some places doesn't mean that it's happening everywhere or happening all that often.
    That is not an answer to my question.

    Furthermore, if we look at a lot of these cases where there is an accusation of racial bias we'll most often find that the initial contact was due to a criminal act or a lawful investigation.
    I think you'll find that a great deal of those initial contacts were the result of the police who were not investigating a report of crime and who initiated contact with people who gave them no reasonable suspicion. You're aware that many police depts have a policy of stopping random people in specific neighborhoods, aren't you? Do you suppose being stopped by the police when you've done nothing wrong might contribute a little towards the animosity?
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  2. #132
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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    That is not an answer to my question.



    I think you'll find that a great deal of those initial contacts were the result of the police who were not investigating a report of crime and who initiated contact with people who gave them no reasonable suspicion. You're aware that many police depts have a policy of stopping random people in specific neighborhoods, aren't you? Do you suppose being stopped by the police when you've done nothing wrong might contribute a little towards the animosity?
    I think the definition of "nothing wrong" is going to be different between parties.

    If, for example, my beat is a particular neighborhood that has a reputation for drugs and I see the same kid hanging out on the same corner every day it might just occur to me that he's a spotter for the dealer a block down. I might also take a second look at the brand new BMW M5 that just came rolling down the street with two kids from the "good side of the tracks". Now I'll grant you that neither party in these scenarios is "doing something wrong" but in both cases it's worth making a casual stop even if the only reason I'm doing so is to let them know that I've got my eye on them. That isn't a racial issue at all. It's a crime prevention issue.

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by shavingcollywob View Post
    I think this general scenario is really problematic of today's police force.

    It seems to me that the "investigation" really began and ended with checking this woman's ID, which is to say there really wasn't an investigation. The officers should up to a complaint, there was no evidence one way or the other, but the woman didn't show the officers enough respect so they hassled her a little bit. I'm generally a polite person but I think everyone should be uncomfortable with the idea that if you don't show the police enough respect that they can hassle you. There was no real reason for them to slap the cuffs on this woman then stuff her in a squad car. They just didn't like her attitude.

    But then why should I have to show respect for people who behave that way?

    If they behaved that way in any other profession we would be calling them assholes.
    There's a large difference here between being an innocent bystander who gets hassled and a suspect who refuses to cooperate with a simple request. Police have two choices when they need to question someone - they can do it at the scene, with cooperation, or they can haul your ass to the precinct and do it there - choice is usually up to the person being questioned. If you think police have nothing better to do than waste their time with some dick with an attitude, you don't know modern day policing.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Reports they were boinking in a car.
    Pic too. I saw it at the New York Daily News, but TMZ scored it. She's straddling her boyfriend. Looks pretty obvious what they're up to.

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    SC: Promoting the majority's view that an act involving sex as immoral or unacceptable s not the legitimate interest of government. Okay.

    The SCOTUS may not have an interest in issues like gender related sex or what sex act is moral or immoral.

    As far as I'm concerned, if one is going to do their neighbor's goat. I don't personally care. But I might add...just don't get caught doing it in a public place.

    However....

    When did the S.C. rule that states can't make laws regarding sexual conduct in public places like in cars in the view of others, on park benches, at public swimming pools, inside a state capitol building, etc?

    New York court has ruled that sex in a car was not sex in a public place unless the act could be readily seen by passers-by. (People v. McNamara, 585 N.E.2nd 788 (1991).)

    I think that you'll find this to be the case in most states. And most laws are considered to be misdemeanor type laws. How exactly are these types of laws unconstitutional?
    I don't think laws like that are unconstitutional. But a majority of the Supreme Court doesn't seem very sure about it.

    The Court said this in Lawrence v. Texas: "The fact that the governing majority in a State has traditionally viewed a particular practice as immoral is not a sufficient reason for upholding a law prohibiting the practice."

    In Lawrence, the Court held a state law under which two men had been convicted of homosexual sodomy unconstitutional for just that reason--that the fact most people in the state considered that form of sexual behavior immoral and unacceptable was not a good enough reason to make it a crime. But if that's true, why is it any better a reason just because the act is performed in public? Is adult incest, for example, less immoral just because it takes place in a car that's not open to plain view, instead of a car that is?

    Did what the two people in this incident did somehow harm the people who were watching them? I don't see why it was necessarily more harmful because it took place in a car with the door open than it would have if done in a motel room with the door closed. I think the real reason for making certain sex acts crimes when done publicly is just that most people consider it immoral. But if that's the only reason, why is the act less immoral if done in private? After all, prostitution is no less a crime in most states just because the sex takes place in a room, rather than in the city park.

  6. #136
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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    I don't think laws like that are unconstitutional. But a majority of the Supreme Court doesn't seem very sure about it.

    The Court said this in Lawrence v. Texas: "The fact that the governing majority in a State has traditionally viewed a particular practice as immoral is not a sufficient reason for upholding a law prohibiting the practice."

    In Lawrence, the Court held a state law under which two men had been convicted of homosexual sodomy unconstitutional for just that reason--that the fact most people in the state considered that form of sexual behavior immoral and unacceptable was not a good enough reason to make it a crime. But if that's true, why is it any better a reason just because the act is performed in public? Is adult incest, for example, less immoral just because it takes place in a car that's not open to plain view, instead of a car that is?

    Did what the two people in this incident did somehow harm the people who were watching them? I don't see why it was necessarily more harmful because it took place in a car with the door open than it would have if done in a motel room with the door closed. I think the real reason for making certain sex acts crimes when done publicly is just that most people consider it immoral. But if that's the only reason, why is the act less immoral if done in private? After all, prostitution is no less a crime in most states just because the sex takes place in a room, rather than in the city park.
    Lawrence v. Texas was based on same gender sex - way more than where the sex acts occurred.

    If a man and woman goes into a "public restroom facility" and has sex behind the doors of a toilet stall...in most states it's against the law.

    Again, there's a big difference about how people perceived various types of sexual acts in terms of morality vs "where people have sex".

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Do you have a point?
    You just made it for me. This is not the first thread where I've seen you pretend to know the law on a subject, but then come up short when challenged to prove it. You don't know a Terry stop from a door stop.

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    I think the definition of "nothing wrong" is going to be different between parties.

    If, for example, my beat is a particular neighborhood that has a reputation for drugs and I see the same kid hanging out on the same corner every day it might just occur to me that he's a spotter for the dealer a block down. I might also take a second look at the brand new BMW M5 that just came rolling down the street with two kids from the "good side of the tracks". Now I'll grant you that neither party in these scenarios is "doing something wrong" but in both cases it's worth making a casual stop even if the only reason I'm doing so is to let them know that I've got my eye on them. That isn't a racial issue at all. It's a crime prevention issue.
    You're talking about reasonable suspicion. In most of the cases I'm referring to, a judge has determined that there was no reasonable suspicion

    BTW, since you're piling on the stereotypes, could you add in that they were eating fried chicken or watermelon?
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    You just made it for me. This is not the first thread where I've seen you pretend to know the law on a subject, but then come up short when challenged to prove it. You don't know a Terry stop from a door stop.
    So your objective is to find some niggling point to quibble about.

    That's what I thought.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    You don't have to show your ID to a cop at all unless you're being arrested for a crime, and no, not showing your ID is not a crime, and neither is making out in the car.
    When police are called in on something like this they have the right to interrogate people and ask for an ID. If they don't get an ID they can detain people until they get one. This is all without accusing anyone of a crime.

    They have video now of what Weeks and her bf were doing. They were ****ing, not just making out.

    The claims Weeks made about police conduct are falling apart.

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." --HL Mencken

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