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Thread: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    I notice the Supreme Court made a point of noting in Hilbel that the Nevada statute it was upholding as constitutional did not require the detainee in a Terry stop to show police a driver's license or other identifying document, but only to tell them his name.

    The Court also said that requirement did not violate the Fifth Amendment because compelling Hilbel to give police his name, by itself, did not expose him to any substantial risk of self-incrimination. The Court recognized, though, that there might be circumstances in which that issue would come up:

    "Still, a case may arise where there is a substantial allegation that furnishing identity at the time of a stop would have given the police a link in the chain of evidence needed to convict the individual of a separate offense. In that case, the court can then consider whether the privilege applies, and, if the Fifth Amendment has been violated, what remedy must follow."

    I don't see how the police did anything unreasonable in this case, or what good reason this woman had not to cooperate with them.
    The incident involving Ms. Watts was not a "Terry Stop". The cop was actively investigating a complaint of a criminal act.

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    The news report from the audio link states quite clearly you are required to show ID on a probable cause stop in CA.
    I'm not sure what a "probable cause stop" is, other than an arrest. Probable cause is what is required for police to make an arrest. A "Terry stop"--i.e. a brief investigatory detention--requires only reasonable suspicion of criminal activity, a lower standard. For Fourth Amendment purposes, both investigatory detentions and arrests
    are "seizures."

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    I notice the Supreme Court made a point of noting in Hilbel that the Nevada statute it was upholding as constitutional did not require the detainee in a Terry stop to show police a driver's license or other identifying document, but only to tell them his name.

    The Court also said that requirement did not violate the Fifth Amendment because compelling Hilbel to give police his name, by itself, did not expose him to any substantial risk of self-incrimination. The Court recognized, though, that there might be circumstances in which that issue would come up:

    "Still, a case may arise where there is a substantial allegation that furnishing identity at the time of a stop would have given the police a link in the chain of evidence needed to convict the individual of a separate offense. In that case, the court can then consider whether the privilege applies, and, if the Fifth Amendment has been violated, what remedy must follow."

    I don't see how the police did anything unreasonable in this case, or what good reason this woman had not to cooperate with them.
    This wasn't a Terry stop

    Context.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    This wasn't a Terry stop

    Context.
    In the article originally referred to, the police stated that they "briefly detained" this woman and then released her. If this was not a brief investigatory detention carried out on reasonable suspicion of criminal activity--often called a Terry stop, or in another variant, a stop-and-frisk--what else was it? If it was an arrest, the police must have had probable cause to believe this woman had committed a crime. And if they did, why did they then quickly release her?

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    In the article originally referred to, the police stated that they "briefly detained" this woman and then released her. If this was not a brief investigatory detention carried out on reasonable suspicion of criminal activity--often called a Terry stop, or in another variant, a stop-and-frisk--what else was it? If it was an arrest, the police must have had probable cause to believe this woman had committed a crime. And if they did, why did they then quickly release her?
    An eyewitness who saw Daniele and Brian as he worked in a nearby office tells TMZ ... Brian was sitting in the passenger seat with his feet on the curb and Daniele was straddling him with her shirt pulled up -- breasts exposed. The eyewitness says she was grinding on top of him, rocking back and forth.

    Someone from the office went down and asked Daniele and Brian to stop because everyone in the office could see them but they continued.
    This was the complaint. Now whether or not you find merit in the complaint - it is what it is and it may mean nothing to you personally. However, ff this behavior is a statutory offense, the police had to deal with it based on the complaints.

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    In the article originally referred to, the police stated that they "briefly detained" this woman and then released her. If this was not a brief investigatory detention carried out on reasonable suspicion of criminal activity--often called a Terry stop, or in another variant, a stop-and-frisk--what else was it? If it was an arrest, the police must have had probable cause to believe this woman had committed a crime. And if they did, why did they then quickly release her?
    Your question assumes that a detainment is for probable cause, or it's a Terry stop. That is not true.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    In the article originally referred to, the police stated that they "briefly detained" this woman and then released her. If this was not a brief investigatory detention carried out on reasonable suspicion of criminal activity--often called a Terry stop, or in another variant, a stop-and-frisk--what else was it? If it was an arrest, the police must have had probable cause to believe this woman had committed a crime. And if they did, why did they then quickly release her?
    A "Terry Stop" is a stop based some kind of articluable reason to investigate the purpose of an individual being in a certain place or acting in a certain manner that is unusual and indicative of the possibility of criminal behavior. For example, 3 guys standing on the corner wearing gang colors might lead to a Terry Stop.

    This stop was predicated on the report of criminal activity taking place. It's a subtle difference but since a crime was actually reported it's no longer a Terry Stop. Since it was an investigation of possible criminal activity the cop had every right (and an obligation) to identify the suspects. If, after investigating, he found no reason for arrest he could let everyone go but while he was investigating any refusal of the suspects to identify themselves should be considered to be obstruction.

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    I have zero sympathy for her. SHE made the big deal about it. Not the cop. She was a suspect in a crime. Innocent or guilty if you are asked for ID, you show it. If you don't, you are still a suspect. You get to go to jail.

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by CRUE CAB View Post
    I have zero sympathy for her. SHE made the big deal about it. Not the cop. She was a suspect in a crime. Innocent or guilty if you are asked for ID, you show it. If you don't, you are still a suspect. You get to go to jail.
    I guess the question is should you have to. Even if you show ID, that doesn't prove guilt or innocence, and if she wasn't driving she's under no obligation to be carrying her license.

    I have a little bit of a problem with becoming the sort of place where a cop can walk up to anybody for any reason and ask to see their "papers." I don't want to live in a police state.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

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    Re: Daniele Watts says she was detained for ‘showing affection’

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    I guess the question is should you have to. Even if you show ID, that doesn't prove guilt or innocence, and if she wasn't driving she's under no obligation to be carrying her license.

    I have a little bit of a problem with becoming the sort of place where a cop can walk up to anybody for any reason and ask to see their "papers." I have a problem with becoming a police state.
    He did "just walk up to her". He was called and there for a specific reason. Trust me we are so far from a real police state its not even funny.

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