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Pentagon: No evidence of ISIS at border

apdst said:
Ok, so no one from the Pentagon has actually been to the border? See the credibility issue?
Click to expand...

And again, they don't have to! That's why we have a Border Patrol agency and ICE agents and the FBI and a Dept. of Homeland Security - federal agencies working in concert w/local authorities to catch the bad guys. No, it didn't work very well in the lead-up to 9/11, but alot has changed since then and there hasn't been another such event on U.S. soil since. That certainly doesn't mean it couldn't happen, but if every agency from bottom to top and back down again are sharing intelligence information and doing their part to catch the bad guys, we shouldn't have to worry about it.

At this stage, however, I put more of the blame for the holes in our southern border security efforts squarely on Congress, mostly on Republicans. They continue to rant on and on about these illegal alien border crossings, but the moment you ask for federal funds to shore up the leaks, they fall back on "secure the border" first with a fence knowing full well that until you get the manpower behind the surveillance and capture efforts, any attempt to build a fence line will fail. Frankly, I find the idea of a fence along our southern (or northern) border appalling. I mean, how does Reagan get away with demanding that Gorbachev "tear down this wall" but it's just fine for America to build one.
 
TheNextEra said:
As I said before, I recognize the border situation is unacceptable and I don't condone just "blowing it off". I was just saying we have to be careful also when evaluating such data so that people don't freak out and then give the federal government more "Patriot Act" type powers in response to fear is all. Someone could evaluate that map and go "OMG the terrorists are here, we need to give the Federal Government MORE power to act NOW!!!" which would be totally overblown.

We need to remain diligent no matter what, but we need to temper that with reason as well.
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Frankly, I think those who scream loose border security are actually looking for the real Red Dawn to occur just so they can say, "I told you so," and then assert their position of power. Funny thing is, I think if something like that did occur I think the people would rise up faster than our domestic military forces.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Read more: Pentagon: No evidence of ISIS at border | TheHill

Rick Perry recently stated that ISIS might have entered the US through the Mexican border.... Well... It seems to just be more bull**** out of Perry's mouth [/FONT][/COLOR]
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Rick Perry is a complete MORON!

He contends that Arabs have changed their names and are entering the US through the US-Mexican border...

Right...with an exodus of Latinos flooding across the Rio Grande, "Arabs" are going to change their name, learn Spanish well enough to convince an armed immigration officer in order to get into the country legally....

Got it.

Typically, he assumes 'backward' countries like Canada and Mexico have no immigration control and us "mongrels" let anyone in.
 
Objective Voice said:
Frankly, I think those who scream loose border security are actually looking for the real Red Dawn to occur just so they can say, "I told you so," and then assert their position of power. Funny thing is, I think if something like that did occur I think the people would rise up faster than our domestic military forces.
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I suspect the "people" would rise up at the suggestion....

Loose border indeed, there is about 4,000 miles of undefended border to your north much of it in mountainous terrain where hikers follow trails that weave in and out of the US and Canada. Only in the US in many places there are "civilian patrols" with assault rifles "patrolling" that border, presumably to make sure no deadly maple syrup sneaks across.

We sure do feel a friend in Americans when they arm themselves to keep out a people who has never had much of an interest in living there. Shopping, yes, and getting rich in Hollywood like Shatner and Neil Young, but live there?
 
Doppelgangirl said:
The DoD is an organization. Congress is an organization.
These organizations are made up of *individuals.*
Yes, the ruling ranks at the DoD, Pentagon, DIA, CIA, etc are, in fact, politicians. I stand by that statement.
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You go right ahead and do that.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Why in the hell would ISIS members need to pose as Hispanic, payoff Mexican criminal organizations, and sneak across hundreds of miles of desert wasteland to get here via our southern border when easily hundreds of them hold British Passports and could fly here first class if they wanted??
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We've got to beat up Obama for a southern border that's been unsecured, forever.
 
Doppelgangirl said:
I don't think "rag tag fanatic amateurs" would be able to impact a map this way.
The Many Ways to Map the Islamic 'State' - The Atlantic
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Thought I'd help

http://cdn.theatlantic.com/newsroom...n_Shot_2014_08_26_at_3.11.11_PM/2dc9e669a.png
simon-w-moon-albums-pics-picture67172093-economist-isis.jpg




http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...s-conflict-in-maps-photos-and-video.html?_r=1
http://static01.nyt.com/images/2014...s-and-video-1402605847082-articleLarge-v6.png
simon-w-moon-albums-pics-picture67172092-iraq-conflict-maps-photos-and-video-1402605847082-articlelarge-v6.jpg


"The 'caliphate' here is not so much a coherent territorial entity like Jordan or Belgium as a series of spreading cracks in existing states. There is no state-like border corresponding to the Aleppo-Mosul-Falluja perimeter."



http://cdn.theatlantic.com/newsroom/img/posts/2014/08/ISIS_Map_AUG_14/bbf8f007b.png
simon-w-moon-albums-pics-picture67172094-isw-isis.jpg


It's not that maps have an established difficulty per acre.
Different areas require different levels of effort and ability to control.
Iraq and Syria have not had functional governments for quite some time now.
It's not the same as if ISIS had captured pieces of two healthy nations.
These areas are under ISIS control largely because Baghdad and Syria are too feeble to offer resistance.
 
Yep! And China and Russia both warned three years ago that US interference in Syria would cause the crisis to spread throughout the region!
 
Montecresto said:
Yep! And China and Russia both warned three years ago that US interference in Syria would cause the crisis to spread throughout the region!
Click to expand...

Ever wonder if Russia is supplying the Syrian rebels in much the same way the U.S. supplied the Afghan rebels back in the '80s? After all, they learned the hard way that blindly feeding the military industrial complex on a never-ending war effort was the surest way of kill a nation's economy.
 
EnigmaO01 said:
Not all missions are successful. You win some you lose some. And considering how scare intelligence in that area of the world is...

I'd believe the pentagon over governor oops anyday.
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Considering how emasculated our military has become, i think i'll stick to believing Perry.
 
Objective Voice said:
Ever wonder if Russia is supplying the Syrian rebels in much the same way the U.S. supplied the Afghan rebels back in the '80s? After all, they learned the hard way that blindly feeding the military industrial complex on a never-ending war effort was the surest way of kill a nation's economy.
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I'm pretty sure that Russia is supporting president Assad, not the terrorists who along with US support have been working to overthrow him.
 
Roadvirus said:
Considering how emasculated our military has become, i think i'll stick to believing Perry.
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Our military budget dwarfs the nearest competitor, not to worry.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
Thought I'd help
Click to expand...

Thanks. I'm still fairly new, and have been wondering how to format images like that in a post. Now I know.



It's not that maps have an established difficulty per acre.
Different areas require different levels of effort and ability to control.
Iraq and Syria have not had functional governments for quite some time now.
It's not the same as if ISIS had captured pieces of two healthy nations.
These areas are under ISIS control largely because Baghdad and Syria are too feeble to offer resistance.
Click to expand...

I agree with that.

I've never argued they have the capability of the former-USSR.

It can be damn funny watching people *overreact* and take to their Doomsday bunkers -- in an effort to flee the onslaught of Sharia Law... and being overrun by camels. :roll:

I just don't think they should be dismissed offhand in the same manner a king might dismiss a village-crowd armed with pitchforks. They're probably closer to the equivalent of the French Army... around the time of the French Revolution. :lol:
 
Objective Voice said:
And again, they don't have to! That's why we have a Border Patrol agency and ICE agents and the FBI and a Dept. of Homeland Security - federal agencies working in concert w/local authorities to catch the bad guys. No, it didn't work very well in the lead-up to 9/11, but alot has changed since then and there hasn't been another such event on U.S. soil since. That certainly doesn't mean it couldn't happen, but if every agency from bottom to top and back down again are sharing intelligence information and doing their part to catch the bad guys, we shouldn't have to worry about it.

At this stage, however, I put more of the blame for the holes in our southern border security efforts squarely on Congress, mostly on Republicans. They continue to rant on and on about these illegal alien border crossings, but the moment you ask for federal funds to shore up the leaks, they fall back on "secure the border" first with a fence knowing full well that until you get the manpower behind the surveillance and capture efforts, any attempt to build a fence line will fail. Frankly, I find the idea of a fence along our southern (or northern) border appalling. I mean, how does Reagan get away with demanding that Gorbachev "tear down this wall" but it's just fine for America to build one.
Click to expand...

Without first hand observation, the Pentagon cannot say definitively that the evidence doesn't exist.
 
head asplode for some of you

apdst said:
Without first hand observation, the Pentagon cannot say definitively that the evidence doesn't exist.
Click to expand...
You're adrift.
The DoD was saying that they didn't have evidence of it happening, not that evidence does not exist.
The two statements are not identical nor interchangeable.

"We have no evidence" ≠ "There is no evidence"

You can see the distinction between the two statements when they are laid out side by side, yes?


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Here's some hedasplode for some of you:


So choose either "side" you like. But they're both saying that we have no evidence to support the idea that ISIS is coming across our southern border.

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Doppelgangirl said:
I don't think "rag tag fanatic amateurs" would be able to impact a map this way.

The Many Ways to Map the Islamic 'State' - The Atlantic


While I won't run screaming for the hills just yet, it's clear their control is spreading. I wouldn't call that overrated...
Click to expand...


They will crumble in months up to a year with their psychopath leader killed or captured. Mark my words. They are no match for our firepower and if Iraq finally gets it sheet together. The good part is we will get rid of a good number of terrorist sympathizers once and for all as they are now out in the open and not hiding in our country or other countries.
 
Simon W. Moon said:
Thought I'd help

http://cdn.theatlantic.com/newsroom...n_Shot_2014_08_26_at_3.11.11_PM/2dc9e669a.png
simon-w-moon-albums-pics-picture67172093-economist-isis.jpg




http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...s-conflict-in-maps-photos-and-video.html?_r=1
http://static01.nyt.com/images/2014...s-and-video-1402605847082-articleLarge-v6.png
simon-w-moon-albums-pics-picture67172092-iraq-conflict-maps-photos-and-video-1402605847082-articlelarge-v6.jpg


"The 'caliphate' here is not so much a coherent territorial entity like Jordan or Belgium as a series of spreading cracks in existing states. There is no state-like border corresponding to the Aleppo-Mosul-Falluja perimeter."



http://cdn.theatlantic.com/newsroom/img/posts/2014/08/ISIS_Map_AUG_14/bbf8f007b.png
simon-w-moon-albums-pics-picture67172094-isw-isis.jpg


It's not that maps have an established difficulty per acre.
Different areas require different levels of effort and ability to control.
Iraq and Syria have not had functional governments for quite some time now.
It's not the same as if ISIS had captured pieces of two healthy nations.
These areas are under ISIS control largely because Baghdad and Syria are too feeble to offer resistance.
Click to expand...

Not just too feeble but up until now unwilling to protect the Sunnis and Kurds at their own peril once ISIS comes knocking on Baghdad's door. I sure hope we can fix stupid.
 
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Montecresto said:
Yep! And China and Russia both warned three years ago that US interference in Syria would cause the crisis to spread throughout the region!
Click to expand...

Your point? I don't recall us being eager to interfere and Obama even got flack for not getting involved. In fact I remember we were reluctant due to the fact that very few of the players were on our side even though they were against Assad.
 
WCH said:
As a Texan, I'll go with Perry because I'm aware of the situation on the ground here.

The Pentagon employs my SiL and means little to me otherwise,.
Click to expand...

You should know better living in Texas.
 
Doppelgangirl said:
Thanks. I'm still fairly new, and have been wondering how to format images like that in a post. Now I know.





I agree with that.

I've never argued they have the capability of the former-USSR.

It can be damn funny watching people *overreact* and take to their Doomsday bunkers -- in an effort to flee the onslaught of Sharia Law... and being overrun by camels. :roll:

I just don't think they should be dismissed offhand in the same manner a king might dismiss a village-crowd armed with pitchforks. They're probably closer to the equivalent of the French Army... around the time of the French Revolution. :lol:
Click to expand...

I wasn't totally dismissing them just saying they are overrated.
 
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