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Thread: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched [W:700]

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing his assailant

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    No, it shows the ridiculousness of your argument.
    He was not sending any message. That exist solely in your mind.
    And yet you have no valid response as to the motivation? Occams razor.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    What is absolute nonsense, is you replying while not understanding what is being spoken to.
    Do try to keep up.
    And at least bother to note what my position is regarding the shooting.
    The old man is a murderer and there is no changing his mind on that. Age and mental condition at the time means nothing to him. He must have been on great cop.

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Right...I get it. You like to judge others without perspective. God Bless America...or wherever you are from.
    Riiiiight, sell that to someone who buys it. You judge Obama and others all the time. Yes, God Bless America, now don't hit your head getting off your soapbox.

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    What is absolute nonsense, is you replying while not understanding what is being spoken to.
    Do try to keep up.
    And at least bother to note what my position is regarding the shooting.
    I understood what you said... Nice dodge tough. Fact: you think civilians should be held to less of a standard than police.

    That is what I responded to and I say again... absolute nonsense.

    Now prove it is viable and not nonsense.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon W. Moon View Post
    Civilians should have the same immunity from prosecution as cops?
    Civilians should be able to forcibly detain one another and not be held liable for the use of violence if the other civilian resists?

    On its face, that does not sound workable. But perhaps I am missing something which would make that make sense.

    In any case, current conditions are that police have special protections which go along with their job--part of which is catching criminals.
    Greer was not trying to apprehend Miller, btw. He was trying to kill her.
    So even if Greer had been a cop, Greer still would be a murderer.

    This whole TNvGarner business is a red herring.
    What did you not understand about the following?
    "as they are not trained as an Officer is."
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle
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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by CRUE CAB View Post
    The old man is a murderer and there is no changing his mind on that. Age and mental condition at the time means nothing to him. He must have been on great cop.
    Is there a special set of laws for octogenarians?

    "mental condition"?
    Are you arguing that Greer was mentally deficient, unable to distinguish between right and wrong?
    I may be wrong.

  7. #647
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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon W. Moon View Post
    Idk, but the case you cite is the case which ruled that particular law to be unconstitutional.
    TNvG provides a two part test for when it is okay to shoot a fleeing suspect.
    The suspect must present and "immediate" danger sufficient to warrant seizing that person's life.
    Shooting the suspect must be the only available method for seizing the suspect.
    Greer shooting Miller failed on both counts.
    Greer's case fails most egregiously in the second case in that Greer was not trying to apprehend Miller at all.
    He was trying to kill her not capture her.

    So in addition to Greer not being a cop, neither he nor the community at large was in immediate danger from Miller, nor was Greer attempting to arrest Miller at all.

    TNvG has zero bearing on Greer's case.


    Even though Greer's situation would fail the TNvG test were Greer a cop, I'd like to point out a couple of things.

    We give police leeway in these matter which we don't give to civilians.
    If a cop arrests you and it's a mistake the cop is protected even if he has to use physical force to effect the arrest.
    If a citizen tries the same crap--tries to arrest you and gets violent--the citizen is open to criminal charges as well as civil suits.
    It is entirely reasonable for civilians to be held to a higher standard that cops.

    Second, Greer is not being held to a higher standard than is indicated by TNvG.
    Dont you think thats a bit bassackwards giving cops leeway you wouldnt give a civilian? And the Tennessee case is merely one case where law enforcement personnel have shot fleeing unarmed suspects. Pittsburgh, Albuquerque...lots of others. Relevant point still in play. Cops are intervening. They typically arent the 80 year old victim getting his ass beat down.

    Similar recent case in Chicago involving an 86 year old shooting at a fleeing (armed) suspect. He wont be charged as it is determined he was "an 86-year-old law-abiding individual who comes across a forcible felony in progress … and helped others avoid being victims." Same goes with this 80 year old shooter.
    86-year-old won't be charged in concealed carry shooting, prosecutors say - Chicago Tribune

  8. #648
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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    What did you not understand about the following?
    "as they are not trained as an Officer is."
    Why you think that changes anything about how the world is.
    I may be wrong.

  9. #649
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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by CRUE CAB View Post
    The old man is a murderer and there is no changing his mind on that. Age and mental condition at the time means nothing to him. He must have been on great cop.
    I was, thanks.

    He is a murderer. He shot a woman in the back who was running away. You seem to feel theft and assault are enough to execute someone. Last time I looked they are not forcible felonies in any state in the union. You would probably be much happier living in Somalia or an Islamic state.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  10. #650
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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by Black Dog View Post
    I understood what you said... Nice dodge tough. Fact: you think civilians should be held to less of a standard than police.
    Dodge?
    You are confused.
    You clearly did not understand what was being spoken to, which is why I told you such.


    Quote Originally Posted by Black Dog View Post
    That is what I responded to and I say again... absolute nonsense.
    And?
    That was not what I addressed. So that is your failure.
    So again. Why don't you at least try to learn what my position on this case is before you again open your moth and insert your foot.


    Quote Originally Posted by Black Dog View Post
    Now prove it is viable and not nonsense.
    I do not have to disprove your claim, especially as you did not understand what was being spoken to. That is on you.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle
    (≚ᄌ≚)

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