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Thread: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched [W:700]

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    I get the feeling that the people who are defending him are applauding him because what he did was essentially an act of revenge. Revenge against your tormentors feels good and that's a normal human human, doubly so if like most people you were one the wrong end of an ass kicking at one point or another in your life. I get that. The problem of course is that revenge killings aren't legal.
    It might be easy to get that feeling. There are a few "Doc Holiday" type posts in the thread but for the most part the man's actions have not been defended but recognized as a possible bad shoot for the police to properly investigate and a jury, if empaneled, to decide any outcome.


    The challenge in this thread as in many others is the devolution into the mucky abyss of those who believe in self defense and those who do not. Therein lies the rub; with bravado and bizarrely extrapolated examples of improprieties oozing from both sides of the equation ( see comments on leaf blower theft and abortion comparisons ).

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by Thom Paine View Post
    My question sir, the one to which you have yet to respond, was/is :

    Two people have proceeded to perform a drum solo akin to the opening of " 2001 " upon your being, a slight break allows you to grab a ball bat and start swinging ... would you hear the statement? would you heed/believe the "statement" or might it be a distraction to allow them to again gain the upper hand ?

    Do you know what you would do when thinking you are defending your life?


    If the question is not too moronic, I'll appreciate your direct response; If it cannot be candidly answered.. so be it.

    Thom Paine
    Well...that would be a different kettle of fish. In a fight for my life, her yelling, "I'm pregnant" wouldn't even slow me down. (I hope.) That's not we have here, though.

    When you think about it, this is a very interesting 80-year-old guy. He apparently got beat up pretty bad...broke his collar bone as I understand it. Seems he started shooting at them while in the house, and they got the hell out of Dodge. Me? I'd be so grateful to see them running away, I think the adrenalin rush would leave, and I'd be a puddle of relief. This guy goes after them, shooting as they flee.

    I've softened in my stance somewhat though. Can we really expect that an 80-year-old man would be thinking clearly after taking a beating, figuring he's probably going to be killed before they leave? Is it fair to impose the "arm-chair self-control" I've applied to this guy? I'm no longer sure it is. There's probably no more vulnerable an adult than an 80-year-old unless it's an 83-year-old. Typically, they're frail; no upper body strength; poor balance; extremely poor reflexes; yada yada yada.

    Do we judge him as we'd judge ourselves? As we might judge a TurtleDude? Or a law enforcement officer? Or do we judge him taking into account the extremely vulnerable position these robbers put him in?

    Hmmmm....maybe I was wrong.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    `
    There is every reason to believe that the woman was lying when she yelled to the man she was robbing, that she was pregnant. While she unfortunately was pregnant, that is not the issue here, which is under California law, did the man have a right to shoot at anyone while they were fleeing.

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by Summerwind View Post
    To anyone who cares, it turns out she wasn't pregnant.

    Suspected burglar shot dead by homeowner was not pregnant, coroner says - LA Times

    That said, if the man was hale enough to chase her down an alley and shoot her in the back, then the "beating" he took wasn't all that bad, and he should be charged with some level of murder.

    His hourglass has about ran out of sand and highly doubtful this woman was about to turn her life around and finish that two year community college degree.

    If he didn't have the gun I think his beating would have been worst. Sorry just can't muster up any empathy for the thieves.

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Well...that would be a different kettle of fish. In a fight for my life, her yelling, "I'm pregnant" wouldn't even slow me down. (I hope.) That's not we have here, though.
    When you think about it, this is a very interesting 80-year-old guy. He apparently got beat up pretty bad...broke his collar bone as I understand it. Seems he started shooting at them while in the house, and they got the hell out of Dodge. Me? I'd be so grateful to see them running away, I think the adrenalin rush would leave, and I'd be a puddle of relief. This guy goes after them, shooting as they flee.
    I've softened in my stance somewhat though. Can we really expect that an 80-year-old man would be thinking clearly after taking a beating, figuring he's probably going to be killed before they leave? Is it fair to impose the "arm-chair self-control" I've applied to this guy? I'm no longer sure it is. There's probably no more vulnerable an adult than an 80-year-old unless it's an 83-year-old. Typically, they're frail; no upper body strength; poor balance; extremely poor reflexes; yada yada yada.
    Do we judge him as we'd judge ourselves? As we might judge a TurtleDude? Or a law enforcement officer? Or do we judge him taking into account the extremely vulnerable position these robbers put him in?

    Hmmmm....maybe I was wrong.
    Ahhh, we agree save for the part about being wrong... maybe you are not wrong; an investigation and maybe a jury will decide. We were not there.

    This type of thread most often skews from the direct situation to a very emotional and assumptive diatribe of a different nature.

    In these situations the press in all it's forms are not reliable. Let the facts come out

    Most agree this is a tragic situation.

    Let the police and jury ascertain their views and make decisions instead of making a mob rule indictment.

    Have a wonderful day Ste Maggie

    Thom Paine
    Remember, on the other side of that screen is a real person. ( Missouri Mule )

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by blarg View Post
    still seems a lot worse then what this guy did espshsily considering that the police told Zimmerman to back off before he initiated his confrontation
    Zimmerman, though he contributed to his predicament (how much is debatable) was being actively attacked when he killed Martin. The other guy, judging from his words, executed the woman. I think there are too many subjective factors to determine who was worse.

    In the end, I think both Zimmerman and this guy were over charged. Rather than Second Degree Murder, the appropriate charges seem to be Criminally Negligent Homicide (Zimmerman) and Manslaughter (California guy).

    In the case of the California shooter, the judge can then use the totality of the circumstances when assigning a penalty- the man had just been beaten and robbed vs "How deliberate was the execution"?

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    Thank you Mr. Limbaugh. Your racist attitude is showing like the ass on a baboon.
    I don't know where you got Limbaugh or racist out of that.

    "The pregnant bitch got everything it deserved" is a disturbing statement, particularly the use of the dehumanizing pronoun "it."

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Sure it is, just because you are 80 doesn't mean you won't get put away for murder.
    Exactly. I'm trying to figure out when age became a determining factor in whether or not to prosecute somebody for murder (or manslaughter, or whatever they charge him with).
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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Well...that would be a different kettle of fish. In a fight for my life, her yelling, "I'm pregnant" wouldn't even slow me down. (I hope.) That's not we have here, though.

    When you think about it, this is a very interesting 80-year-old guy. He apparently got beat up pretty bad...broke his collar bone as I understand it. Seems he started shooting at them while in the house, and they got the hell out of Dodge. Me? I'd be so grateful to see them running away, I think the adrenalin rush would leave, and I'd be a puddle of relief. This guy goes after them, shooting as they flee.

    I've softened in my stance somewhat though. Can we really expect that an 80-year-old man would be thinking clearly after taking a beating, figuring he's probably going to be killed before they leave? Is it fair to impose the "arm-chair self-control" I've applied to this guy? I'm no longer sure it is. There's probably no more vulnerable an adult than an 80-year-old unless it's an 83-year-old. Typically, they're frail; no upper body strength; poor balance; extremely poor reflexes; yada yada yada.

    Do we judge him as we'd judge ourselves? As we might judge a TurtleDude? Or a law enforcement officer? Or do we judge him taking into account the extremely vulnerable position these robbers put him in?

    Hmmmm....maybe I was wrong.
    Remember this was the third time these same 2 have been there to rob him. The fourth time they might have succedded in killing him. They sure tried this time.

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    Re: 80-Year-Old Extremely Pleased About Killing Pregnant Woman Fleeing Botched Robber

    Quote Originally Posted by Paxaeon View Post
    `
    There is every reason to believe that the woman was lying when she yelled to the man she was robbing, that she was pregnant. While she unfortunately was pregnant, that is not the issue here, which is under California law, did the man have a right to shoot at anyone while they were fleeing.
    Surprising enough she was lying when she said she was pregnant.

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