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Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

The warning shot in the video was warranted and effective.
No one was killed.
You have been arguing that a couple of rounds between the eyes would be the only solution because the laws says you can.
That is the solution of a psychopath.
Warning shots are not advisable.
 
......................

I'm endorsing a just world.
Exactly how is this young girl being shot in the head because she "pounded" on someones door in the middle of the night justice?

simply approaching a strangers house is fine... it's not an action that can justifiably get you shot.
The problem is that as these laws are written in some states, they can and have been used to get people off the hook for shooting someone for no reason other than they were scared
 
Yup. Never said otherwise.


But if I end up having to confront thieves, rest assured I will be armed and primed to shoot if need be.... because stealing is not an indication of character which makes me feel that they will respect my right to life and the integrity of my person.
You're assuming the person is actually a threat. That's not what's being discussed. It's the discretion given to the armed. This girl posed no real threat. This homeowner was empowered to act with deadly force on an irrational fear because of the reputation of SYG laws and the way they are written in some states.
 
It's not ridiculous at all. It's common sense. Your life is not threatened until your life is threatened. Plain and simple.

Plain, simple and wholly incorrect where the law is concerned. You can use deadly force if you reasonably believe that deadly force is about to be used on you. Someone raises what appears to be a gun (that turns out to be a toy) and you blow them away, it's still self defense even though your life was not in danger.
 
Second-degree murder is not the same as manslaughter.
I stand corrected.
Theodore Wafer, 54, is charged with second degree murder, manslaughter and committing a felony with a firearm for the fatal shooting of Renisha McBride, who showed up on his porch hours after being involved in a car accident, according to Wayne County prosecutor, Kym Worthy.
I did not realize that one could be charged with 2nd degree murder AND manslaughter in the same killing.
Could he be found guilty on both charges?
I hope so.
 
As long as it is a white guy shooting anyone black and un-armed, it is OK with you eh excon?
You are un****ingbelievable.:roll:

I see straw men walking. that's almost as stupid as "gun fetishist" nonsense.
 
I stand corrected.

I did not realize that one could be charged with 2nd degree murder AND manslaughter in the same killing.
Could he be found guilty on both charges?
I hope so.


yes

No

manslaughter is usually a Lesser included offense

its like charging someone with felonious assault and simple assault for the same attack

or DUI and having a BOAC >.08
 
Warning shots are not advisable.
Sure ...Why scare someone off when the law says it's OK to blow them away?
That would be a wasted opportunity to murder with immunity.
Who the **** would advise that?

/sarc
 
Sure ...Why scare someone off when the law says it's OK to blow them away?
That would be a wasted opportunity to murder with immunity.
Who the **** would advise that?

/sarc


you don't really have much understanding of self defense do you

warning shots

a) can harm others

b) leave you with less ammunition

c) did I say can HARM OTHERS
 
Why yes, I do know from the reported evidence. Why don't you?

I know what I read in the OP's article. He was charged with murder for shooting a woman in the head who, police believe, knocked on his door for help after a car accident. I know the defense attorney claimed he shot her because he was afraid. So, according to the prosecution, he shot her because she knocked on his door and was on his porch.

Yeah, that's justifiable.

Not in my world. Not with those facts. Unfortunately, we won't know any more facts for a while. And we won't know what really happened. And we don't know the outcome of the trial. *shrug*
 
you don't really have much understanding of self defense do you

warning shots

a) can harm others

b) leave you with less ammunition

c) did I say can HARM OTHERS
Wouldn't want to squander an opportunity to murder with immunity would we?
Goodness there's a one in a million chance that we might hurt someone ...
Much smarter to kill on purpose because you have the excuse.
How ****ing warped is that logic?
You people seem to just be waiting watching and searching for an excuse and a chance to kill someone ...anyone, with your precious ****ing guns.
It's like all you think about.
I'm sorry ...I just don't get it...
 
You're assuming the person is actually a threat. That's not what's being discussed. It's the discretion given to the armed. This girl posed no real threat. This homeowner was empowered to act with deadly force on an irrational fear because of the reputation of SYG laws and the way they are written in some states.

How do you know that McBride posed no threat? What was she doing between the time she was last seen after the car accident and when she showed up at Wafer's house?

Nobody knows, and according to the NY Times, maybe nobody ever will.

I want to know about the muddy footprint on the a/c unit, which, according to the article, might have been hers and might mean that she was trying to get in the man's bedroom window. Maybe McBride was injured and seeking help, as her family has suggested, or maybe in those missing hours she hooked up with more booze and drugs and was out of her head.
 
Wouldn't want to squander an opportunity to murder with immunity would we?
Goodness there's a one in a million chance that we might hurt someone ...
Much smarter to kill on purpose because you have the excuse.
How ****ing warped is that logic?
You people seem to just be waiting watching and searching for an excuse and a chance to kill someone ...anyone, with your precious ****ing guns.
It's like all you think about.
I'm sorry ...I just don't get it...

that you call a self defensive situation "murder' pretty much relegates your comments on this issue as to the permanent list of "Never to be taken seriously" which is where your comments on gun issues are currently on with your "gun fetishist" nonsense.

What you don't get is making our own personal safety an individual duty. That sort of attitude scares the crap out of many left-wingers who want to outsource all personal responsibility and risk to the government.

We don't get your fear
 
that you call a self defensive situation "murder' pretty much relegates your comments on this issue as to the permanent list of "Never to be taken seriously" which is where your comments on gun issues are currently on with your "gun fetishist" nonsense.

What you don't get is making our own personal safety an individual duty. That sort of attitude scares the crap out of many left-wingers who want to outsource all personal responsibility and risk to the government.

We don't get your fear
This was not a self defense situation.
The girl was UNARMED, intoxicated and injured on the other side of a locked door, seeking help.
The "self defense situation" was entirely in Wafer's frightened half asleep mind.
...and yours.
 
. Maybe McBride was injured and seeking help, as her family has suggested, or maybe in those missing hours she hooked up with more booze and drugs and was out of her head.
Or maybe she was unconscious in her car wreck ...
You might make up anything to try to justify a killing in the name of SYG right?
 
Wouldn't want to squander an opportunity to murder with immunity would we?
Goodness there's a one in a million chance that we might hurt someone ...
Much smarter to kill on purpose because you have the excuse.
How ****ing warped is that logic?
You people seem to just be waiting watching and searching for an excuse and a chance to kill someone ...anyone, with your precious ****ing guns.
It's like all you think about.
I'm sorry ...I just don't get it...

For someone who CLAIMS they care about life, you sure are callous about ya know, gun safety.

See, in the movies, the warning shot never hits anyone. In the movies, and on TV the shooter is acting, it's all scripted.

In real life, you have seconds to decide "Shoot/don't shoot" Aim is crap, adrenaline is flowing and you lose sight of everything around you. You don't have time to think, you react. "Bad guy, threat, aim center mass, put down threat, scan for other threats" And you have to do that in less time it took for me to write it. Now you want that same judgement level to take eyes OFF the threat, really a dumb move, and fire a "warning shot"?

Nope, if I have my weapon drawn, it's not to wound, it's not for fun, it's not for kicks. It's because my life, liberty or property by another human being. That human has placed their life, in my gun sights. If they do stupid things, disobey commands, make fast moves, appear to be armed the gun fires. I do not sleep over "my life or yours" situations.
 
This was not a self defense situation.
The girl was UNARMED, intoxicated and injured on the other side of a locked door, seeking help.
The "self defense situation" was entirely in Wafer's frightened half asleep mind.
...and yours.

Yes, it's soooo easy to this call make after the fact. People like you think think hindsight is wisdom and gives you some moral ground to chastise others.
Center for Problem-Oriented Policing | Problem Guides | Home Invasion Robbery
Here's an example of home invasions.

Finally, Snopes says you need to realize life, is full of bad people.

DO NOT OPEN YOUR DOOR FOR STRANGERS

This happened to me last night, September 29, 2008 at approx. 10:15pm. I was sitting in my living room watching t.v. when a female began to angrily bang on my front door. She was demanding me to open the door. Her knock was so loud that I thought it was a gunshot. She was hollering, "OPEN THE DOOR, OPEN THE DOOR!" I heard her telling someone, "No stay right there, stay right there" as if she was getting ready to prove a point. It sounded as if she was angry; as if she was coming to find something out.

I had no idea who this female was. She continued to bang as if she knew someone was home. All of the lights were off in my house except for the t.v. in the living room. Finally, I yelled WHO IS IT! When she knew she had my attention, she changed from the angry tone to saying "Open the door this guy is trying to beat me up." Her demands and knocks became even more persistent and determined. I heard a male in the near distance but his voice wasn't threatening and he wasn't yelling.

She never said, Call the police. Neither did she sound genuinely threatened. Her demands were just. LET ME IN LET ME IN. She covered the peep-hole. I peeped out my window. I didn't see the male but I heard him talking in a low voice. However, I saw a glimpse of her on my porch. She had on all black. I DID NOT open the door. I called the police. And as quickly as the commotion began, when they realized I wasn't going to open the door, they disappeared into the night and it was dead silence again.

-0-0-
An April 2002 home invasion took place in Lawrenceville, Georgia, in which a couple was robbed and the woman raped; the crime was kicked off by two teen boys who showed up at the couple's door claiming they had been attacked nearby. When the couple opened the door to give the lads a cordless phone with which to call 911, the two teens entered the home, then let two of their friends in the back door.
Read more at snopes.com: Don't Open the Door to Strangers

Please read the whole article.
 
For someone who CLAIMS they care about life, you sure are callous about ya know, gun safety.

See, in the movies, the warning shot never hits anyone. In the movies, and on TV the shooter is acting, it's all scripted.

In real life, you have seconds to decide "Shoot/don't shoot" Aim is crap, adrenaline is flowing and you lose sight of everything around you. You don't have time to think, you react. "Bad guy, threat, aim center mass, put down threat, scan for other threats" And you have to do that in less time it took for me to write it. Now you want that same judgement level to take eyes OFF the threat, really a dumb move, and fire a "warning shot"?

Nope, if I have my weapon drawn, it's not to wound, it's not for fun, it's not for kicks. It's because my life, liberty or property by another human being. That human has placed their life, in my gun sights. If they do stupid things, disobey commands, make fast moves, appear to be armed the gun fires. I do not sleep over "my life or yours" situations.
Ooooo I am so impressed with your faux-macho, big talk, lethal decisiveness... what are you, 12?
No drunken injured teen aged girl better come a knockin' or your door for help... MrVicchio knows just what to do and nothing will stop him... Once he draws his precious weapon someone's gonna DIE!
You must be so ****ing proud of yourself...
 
Ooooo I am so impressed with your faux-macho, big talk, lethal decisiveness... what are you, 12?
No drunken injured teen aged girl better come a knockin' or your door for help... MrVicchio knows just what to do and nothing will stop him... Once he draws his precious weapon someone's gonna DIE!
You must be so ****ing proud of yourself...

It's not macho bull****, it's how you handle weapons. You don't have the luxury of time, something you fail to acknowledge. Also, people have opened their doors to the "drunk teen" and ended up DEAD.

You'd rather homeowners die, then criminals. That's why your position, is immoral and wrong. Heaven forbid some criminal read your posts, figure out where you live. "Hey all I gotta do is pretend I'm in danger and this fools gonna open the door for me! Easy money baby!"
 
Yup ...you changed my mind...
Anyone crazy enough to knock on my door for help, for now on, is gonna get blown away.
Seek help from me with a knock on my front door and you are gonna get a face full of 00 buckshot right through the ****in' door. Snopes said that's what I should do...it must be right...
Thank you so much MrVicchio ... You're my hero.
/sarc

You can ask for help, I'll ask that you stop banging on my door. I'll dial 911. If you act in a strange manner, beat on my door, attempt to forcefully gain entry to my home, I'm going to take the measures I feel meet the moment. That includes shooting you. BTW, I wouldn't use buckshot. I have slugs for my 12 gauge for those "through the door, wall, car, body" moments.
 
You can ask for help, I'll ask that you stop banging on my door. I'll dial 911. If you act in a strange manner, beat on my door, attempt to forcefully gain entry to my home, I'm going to take the measures I feel meet the moment. That includes shooting you. BTW, I wouldn't use buckshot. I have slugs for my 12 gauge for those "through the door, wall, car, body" moments.
Gee whiz MrVicchio ...How many people have you had to kill for knocking on your door?
Tell us all how clever and macho you are and all the people you have blown away...
We are dying to know...
Thanks for the tip about slugs for my 12 gauge. I'm such a novice when it comes to blasting through door, wall and car bodies to kill people i don't know.
Any more of those pearls of wisdom that will make me a better more efficient killer?
/sarc
 
As long as it is a white guy shooting anyone black and un-armed, it is OK with you eh excon?
You are un****ingbelievable.:roll:
WTF? :doh
Is that what I said? No it wasn't, was it?

I was pointing out your racism and what you ignored in your zeal to cast such aspersion.
The racist shoe is clearly on your foot.


I stand corrected.
Yes you do.


I did not realize that one could be charged with 2nd degree murder AND manslaughter in the same killing.
Could he be found guilty on both charges?
You had to go outside of the provided article to find that. :lamo
Some States have to charge lesser included offenses. He can not be found guilty of both.
He is over charged as I pointed out earlier.


I hope so.
How idiotically absurd a thing to say. Especially since it is claimed as an accidental discharge.
 
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I know what I read in the OP's article. He was charged with murder for shooting a woman in the head who, police believe, knocked on his door for help after a car accident. I know the defense attorney claimed he shot her because he was afraid. So, according to the prosecution, he shot her because she knocked on his door and was on his porch.

Yeah, that's justifiable.

Not in my world. Not with those facts. Unfortunately, we won't know any more facts for a while. And we won't know what really happened. And we don't know the outcome of the trial. *shrug*
Damn Maggie. The story included other links to what is known.
And no, the police do not know that. It is nothing more than speculation on their part and is not evidence. The only evidence of such, is that she was offered help by others earlier and refused it. You know - being offered is different that seeking it out - right?

And no we know she wasn't knocking. She was pounding and creating such a racket that it woke him and caused him to believe someone was trying to break in.



And finally, what I find most amazing... Your; "I know what I read in the OP's article."
You have been involved in the discussion of this case previously, in at least two different threads and you supposedly do not know the reported evidence by now, and instead make statements in contradiction to that which is already known. :shrug:
 
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