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Thread: Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

  1. #191
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    Re: Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you don't really have much understanding of self defense do you

    warning shots

    a) can harm others

    b) leave you with less ammunition

    c) did I say can HARM OTHERS
    Also depending on where you live they are illegal.

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    Re: Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

    Quote Originally Posted by Buck Ewer View Post
    Or maybe she was unconscious in her car wreck ...
    You might make up anything to try to justify a killing in the name of SYG right?
    Now you just hold on there a minute. You have absolutely no idea what my view of SYG is because I've never posted about it. And I haven't posted about it on this thread either.

    You clearly haven't read what I sourced from the NY Time's article I linked. Eyewitnesses say that McBride was out of the car and that they asked if she needed help. To repeat[bolding mine]: "Neighbors along the street testified that they had offered assistance to the young woman, who appeared to be injured and seemed disoriented, but that Ms. McBride had refused help and wandered away. Several hours later, and six blocks from the crash site, Ms. McBride appeared on Mr. Wafer’s front porch."

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    Re: Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    He claimed the gun accidentally discharged. That is nothing more than manslaughter.
    I had forgotten that. If that turns out to be true then you're right, it's manslaughter and not murder.
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    Re: Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

    Quote Originally Posted by opendebate View Post
    I think these laws are dangerous and empower people to act on irrational fears. Irrational fears that seem to consistently provoke them to shoot black people. IMHO, unless they consider that sector of our population dispensable these laws need to be changed in consideration of these real world outcomes.
    Yep. These laws leave too much discretion in the hands of gun owners. And there are too many gun owners whose discretion is based in irrationality. Beyond that, such gun owners believe that their irrational worldview is an accurate worldview which makes reasoning with them nearly impossible. That's why it's up to the rest of us to get these laws off the books. They can keep their irrational views of the world, but their desire to act on those beliefs violently should not be allowed by law. They don't get that privilege anymore.

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    Re: Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Yep. These laws leave too much discretion in the hands of gun owners. And there are too many gun owners whose discretion is based in irrationality. Beyond that, such gun owners believe that their irrational worldview is an accurate worldview which makes reasoning with them nearly impossible. That's why it's up to the rest of us to get these laws off the books. They can keep their irrational views of the world, but their desire to act on those beliefs violently should not be allowed by law. They don't get that privilege anymore.
    You're right. Let's just do away with the concept of self defense completely. From now on, you always have a duty to cower and retreat. Not all of us want to be like you, TPD.

    Good luck getting the 2nd A repealed.
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  6. #196
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    Re: Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    She was causing such a ruckus that it was believed she was trying to break in.
    As to the underlined. You do not know that. She had already turned down help down. So to say she was seeking help flies in the face of the evidence.
    For all you know she thought she was breaking into her drug dealer house. Or her friends house.

    But what is known, is that she caused enough ruckus on the outside of a persons home to cause that person to think she was trying to break in, which is a threat.
    I was staying in a drive-up motel with my 74-year-old mom (at the time). The manager didn't stay on property overnight. They didn't have phones in the rooms. My cell couldn't get a signal in the mountains. This was in a little coal town called Manchester, KY. Population? One McDonald's. I was awakened at 2 AM in the morning to some jamoke banging on the door yelling, "Open this ****ing door!!!" Bang-bang-bang-bang-bang!!!! "****ing hell. Open the God-damned door, bitch!!!!" More banging. I had a loaded .38 on the nightstand.

    So I opened the door and shot him in the head. I was scared.. Oh, wait, or was it I opened the door and damn! My gun accidentally shot her in the head. Yeah, that's it. My gun did it.

    Not.

    Hell, I could even imagine the conversation with the sheriff when he finally came: "Sheriff!! I was scared to death!!! So I threw open the door and shot him. Anybody would have done it. Are you nutz??

    What did I do? I shook off the cobwebs, figured he was drunk, turned on the light, picked UP my gun and yelled, "YOU'VE GOT THE WRONG ****IN' ROOM. GET THE **** OUT OF HERE."

    My reasoning? Even scared and half asleep? I've got all the power in my hand here. There's one of you, drunk. And one of me, armed. Come thru that door and you're dead. Open the door to him? Really???? Not on his life.

    Please to tell me how a gun accidentally discharges unless there's a struggle for it. I think that tactic is a mistake. He'll still go to jail. We don't get to kill someone and say "Oops." So, was he afraid and shot her in self-defense? Or did the gun go off by itself? Or is he throwing **** against the wall to see what sticks?

    No, by the accounting we had thus far, this lady would want to find him guilty of something. He hadn't called the cops; he opened the door to what he perceived as a threat; he shot her in the head. He's going to jail. I hope.

    How many people reading this have accidentally discharged their gun? And then add, "and killed someone in the process?" That'd be an interesting statistic.

    People who think as you do shouldn't own guns. You're a menace.
    Last edited by MaggieD; 07-24-14 at 09:45 AM.
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    Re: Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

    Actually this cannot both be an accident and self defense. Self defense is, "yes I did it intentionally but here's why it's justified". The defense trying to claim both makes me believe it was neither.
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    Re: Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

    It is her fault she is dead. Drunk, too drunk to figure where she was. He should have called the cops simply because he had the shotgun in hand he had little to fear, but it all boils down to her being out of control. He may do time but hopefully not much because if she had not been a loser he would not be in this predicament.
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    Re: Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

    Quote Originally Posted by Buck Ewer View Post
    The warning shot in the video was warranted and effective.
    No one was killed.
    You have been arguing that a couple of rounds between the eyes would be the only solution because the laws says you can.
    That is the solution of a psychopath.

    The warning shot ?

    First there were SHOT(S ), not shot and second a warning shot isnt typically aimed directly at the bad guys through a window.

    Those were NOT warning shotS, they were meant to hit the goons trying to break through the window.

    So again, was the homeowner justified in doing what he did ?

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    Re: Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week

    Quote Originally Posted by opendebate View Post
    Homeowner Who Shot Dead A Teen Girl On His Porch Faces Murder Charges This Week | ThinkProgress

    Remember this story? From the article

    ..... latest trial to test the role of expansive self-defense laws in racially charged deaths by gunfire.

    In statements to the press, he called the shooting “justified” and “reasonable,” invoking language from Michigan’s “Shoot First” laws that allow immunity for some self-defense shootings.

    ....in announcing she would charge Wafer with second-degree murder, Wayne County Prosecutor Kym Worthy said her office determined that Wafer “did not act in lawful self-defense.”

    Wafer’s lawyer Cheryl Carpenter argued in opening statements Wednesday morning that Wafer shot McBride out of fear. To bolster that argument with legal support, she will have two options under Michigan’s expanded self-defense laws that grew out of NRA lobbying. In addition to passing a “Stand Your Ground” law in 2006 that expands the sanctioned use of deadly force outside the home, Michigan also expanded the so-called “Castle Doctrine,” which allows deadly force to protect one’s dwelling, to include areas around the home such as a yard or porch.

    For Wafer to successfully invoke the “Castle Doctrine,” he would have to show that McBride was “in the process of breaking and entering a dwelling.” Prosecutors said there no evidence of forced entry. And the autopsy report shows McBride was not shot at close range.

    Wafer could also use the state’s Stand Your Ground law to show that he reasonably believed force was necessary to prevent death or great bodily harm.


    I think these laws are dangerous and empower people to act on irrational fears. Irrational fears that seem to consistently provoke them to shoot black people. IMHO, unless they consider that sector of our population dispensable these laws need to be changed in consideration of these real world outcomes.
    These self defense laws have a far greater effect on black people, who more often find themselves in the position of having to defend their own lives. The situation of white people defending themselves from black people is relatively uncommon, and you could probably count the instances in which these self defense laws are evoked in such a situation on one hand. But if any group needs the right to defend themselves from black people it's black people.

    Good luck convincing people that a person who is defending himself from a violent attack is acting irrationally.

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." --HL Mencken

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