• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Iraq receives fighter jets from Russia

24107

24107

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jul 6, 2010
Messages
2,809
Reaction score
824
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Iraq receives fighter jets from Russia | Veooz 360
Do you think this will help turn the tide on ISIS?
The first ten Russian Sukhoi (Su-24) fighter jets arrived in Iraq on Saturday, the country's Defense Ministry said. At the same time, Maliki criticized the US for taking too long to deliver on its own contract after Iraq purchased F-16 jets from America. The radical Sunni Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant (ISIS or ISIL) has taken large parts of the country's north from the Shia government.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Gonna take more than a couple dozen 1960s-era fighters to make the difference.
 
Deuce said:
Gonna take more than a couple dozen 1960s-era fighters to make the difference.
Click to expand...

Yet this is Russian influence. Russia wants a cake from Iraq also. USA may not be the only one monopolizing the Iraqi resources.

This is more of an influence issue I think.
 
It is a religious civil war. It won't end until Iraq is settled down after being carved up by the various opponents. We, the Russians and everyone else just need to let it settle.
 
24107 said:
Iraq receives fighter jets from Russia | Veooz 360
Do you think this will help turn the tide on ISIS?
Click to expand...

No. Once ISIS is entrenched in cities and villages, the Iraqi air force needs to be careful who and where they bomb or strafe. It'll be urban combat for sure. You can't fly a jet down main street. well, you can, and you can strafe and drop bombs, but you'll kill everyone. Why doesn't Russia send troops and equipment? :roll:
 
Iraq
Seems Iraqi Christians are happy about this move.
 
Obama really gave the whole show away and here's the proof.
 
Good for Russia...let them get involved in that quagmire and let America get the heck out and stay out.
 
DA60 said:
Good for Russia...let them get involved in that quagmire and let America get the heck out and stay out.
Click to expand...

That's all we need; the Russians get a foothold in the Middle East.
 
apdst said:
That's all we need; the Russians get a foothold in the Middle East.
Click to expand...

What difference does it make?

Of America's total oil imports, less then 1/4 comes from the ENTIRE Persian Gulf (Canada alone exports almost twice as much oil to America as Saudi Arabia).

U.S. Total Crude Oil and Products Imports


And China has no problems getting enough imported oil and they have ZERO troops on the ground outside of their borders.

Why?

Because the Persian Gulf states will sell to virtually anyone as long as they pay...which is exactly the way it should be.

America, imo, could import just as much oil from that region - and at a far lower cost in taxpayer money and American lives - if they just left it alone.

The Persian Gulf needs western money a WHOLE lot more then we need their oil.
 
Last edited:
DA60 said:
What difference does it make? Of America's total oil imports, less then 1/4 comes from the ENTIRE Persian Gulf (Canada alone exports almost twice as much oil to America as Saudi Arabia). And China has no problems getting enough imported oil and they have ZERO troops on the ground outside of their borders. Why? Because the Persian Gulf states will sell to virtually anyone as long as they pay...which is exactly the way it should be. America, imo, could import just as much oil from that region - and at a far lower cost in taxpayer money and American lives - if they just left it alone. The Persian Gulf needs western money a WHOLE lot more then we need their oil.
Click to expand...

Ahhh but American Big Oil needs that oil, and it doesn't matter who uses it. Running the oil production of the ME is HUGE Business and our oil companies have the might of the USofA Military to 'stabilize' the region. American tax payers subsidize over seas oil production in many ways, the lives of a few thousand soldiers every so often doesn't show up on the stockholder's annual report now does it?

OPEC will sell to anyone but the real struggle is who gets the contract to produce that oil...

I for one would hate to see big oil CEOs on street corners holding up signs- "Will drill for food"- kinda wimpy compared to "DRILL BABY DRILL!"... :3oops:
 
AJiveMan said:
No. Once ISIS is entrenched in cities and villages, the Iraqi air force needs to be careful who and where they bomb or strafe. It'll be urban combat for sure. You can't fly a jet down main street. well, you can, and you can strafe and drop bombs, but you'll kill everyone. Why doesn't Russia send troops and equipment?
Click to expand...

Well another point is the time lag between receiving planes and effectively using them. I remember a poster who is extremely fond of scuttlebutt, claiming expert knowledge that just the slowdown in training would 'gut' the Navy's squadrons as the curve to get back to proficiency would be long and slow. Imagine having to start from scratch... :shock:

I suppose Russian 'volunteers' could fly them, it does seem like Western Powers can't stop from taking turns doing stupid stuff in the ME- from the Suez Intervention of the 50's to BushII's attempt to garden in the desert. The Soviets and now the Russians have tried to dominate the ME for decades- and done a miserable job of it.

Let's not hog the grief that is attempting to control the world, let the Russians pour some down the rat hole too.... :peace
 
shrubnose said:
In a word,no.

The Shia government in Iraq will need a lot more than a little military hardware to turn the tide against the Sunni insurgency that it created with its poor treatment of Iraq citizens who are not Shia Muslims.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Having an army actually willing to fight would be a good start.
 
As usual, the media gets it wrong...apparently they are used Su-25 (NATO code name Frogfoot).

They are ground attack aircraft, sort of like less capable A-10 Warthogs.

Definitely NOT fighters.

Belarus_Air_Force_Sukhoi_Su-25_Pichugin-1.jpg
 
Deuce said:
Gonna take more than a couple dozen 1960s-era fighters to make the difference.
Click to expand...

The best CAS aircraft to ever fly were of the 1940's, 50's and 60's era.

The A-10 is the best CAS aircraft flying today but not the best that have ever flown.

The Douglas A-1 Skyraider is #1 with no argument. The old Navy/Marine Corps A-4 Skyhawk is up there. Even the Navy's A-7 and soon adopted by the Air Force during the Vietnam War was pretty good at strafing enemy troops on the ground.

The Sukhoi (Su-24) isn't really good at CAS but good at tactical air support missions on the battlefield. That's how it will probably be used.

The thing is, Obama said that Al Qaeda was being decimated and was on the run. The truth is, Al Qaeda now has a real army that seems to be able to perform on the battlefield, to take ground and hold it.

Lets just hope Al Qaeda doesn't have an air force before our community organiser term in the White House expires in 2017.
 
APACHERAT said:
The best CAS aircraft to ever fly were of the 1940's, 50's and 60's era.

The A-10 is the best CAS aircraft flying today but not the best that have ever flown.

The Douglas A-1 Skyraider is #1 with no argument. The old Navy/Marine Corps A-4 Skyhawk is up there. Even the Navy's A-7 and soon adopted by the Air Force during the Vietnam War was pretty good at strafing enemy troops on the ground.

The Sukhoi (Su-24) isn't really good at CAS but good at tactical air support missions on the battlefield. That's how it will probably be used.

The thing is, Obama said that Al Qaeda was being decimated and was on the run. The truth is, Al Qaeda now has a real army that seems to be able to perform on the battlefield, to take ground and hold it.

Lets just hope Al Qaeda doesn't have an air force before our community organiser term in the White House expires in 2017.
Click to expand...
I don't know much about military aircraft compared to you, but I did a basic wiki search about this particular plane. It says even though the plane itself is old, they are usually updated with better electronics and are even able to be fitted with laser guided munitions.
 
DA60 said:
As usual, the media gets it wrong...apparently they are used Su-25 (NATO code name Frogfoot).

They are ground attack aircraft, sort of like less capable A-10 Warthogs.

Definitely NOT fighters.

Belarus_Air_Force_Sukhoi_Su-25_Pichugin-1.jpg
Click to expand...

What's intertesting and what was common during the Cold War, the Soviets had a good espionage and spy ring established and copied our ****.

One was the Air Forces CAS aircraft. The flyoff was between the Republic A-10 Warthog and Northropes A-9.
Notice anything ?

northrop_a-9.jpg

northrop_a-9.gif

Northrop A-9 - attack

But there's more to the story. A better CAS aircraft. But it didn't have a jet engine and it was a drag tail :eek: Pilots hate drag trails while on the tarmac. It was an upgraded P-51 Mustang with a turboprop engine.
piper_pa-48.jpg

Piper PA-48 Enforcer - close support aircraft Read the comments.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom