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TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘promiscu

Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

MaggieD said:
I'll speak to your question, though not answering for Pantheoen's thought process.

I think too many young men think it's just fine to have sex with a drunk. I can almost hear the process:

"She asked for it."
"What did she think was going to happen?"
"She's the football team's blow-up doll."

Now obviously it's not always wrong to have sex with a drunk. But there's a line; and one's conduct defines where the line is. Taking videos and stills; passing them from phone to phone; multiple partners; and, the most important of all, was she freakin' conscious? All tell a story.

In this case, we're only hearing what the newspaper chose to print and how they chose to slant the story. Always dangerous. Many of us jump to the conclusion the media expects us to jump to. Some of us stand back and say, "Let's wait for more information." (See the thread on the little girl supposedly thrown out of a KFC for her disturbing facial appearance.) In defense of those who jump, what fun would the site be if we all said, "Hey! We don't have enough information. You're just hearing one side of the story." ;)

And, too, let's face it. "No" does not always mean "no," ladies. Guys have it tough, in my opinion. We really hold their feet to the fire now days. Guys have got to realize they're playing with fire in these instances. It's no laughing matter. It's "the rest of your life."
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Much of what you say may well be true and is very logical.

However you ( unlike others ) accurately describe this as a way of thinking for some individuals.

It is not a culture.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

X Factor said:
Ok, so if the jury were to nullify based on this guy being a football hero, that would be all good with you?
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i think there needs to be a trial. football players are not and should not be excempt from prosecution.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

X Factor said:
Ok, so if the jury were to nullify based on this guy being a football hero, that would be all good with you?
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Really, X? You're going there? :rofl !!! 'Lil brat! No, it wasn't. ;)
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

MrVicchio said:
Remember the Duke Lacrosse case? Let's wait for the trial before getting too excited.
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So one false accusation of rape means that all accusations are false?
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

MaggieD said:
I don't disagree with you. But it's the nature of this site. Remember, though, that the facts as presented state that the victim was unconscious. Given that information, who among us would say, "Oh, okay then, it's fine"?
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Well according to you, all (or most) men would say that, y'know being part of the rape culture we are. ;) Let me know when false allegations of rape are something that concerns you or you'd be wiling to speak out as strongly against.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Thom Paine said:
inre: boldWe agree with "justifiable" ( it is BS ); though the phrasing seems to automatically assume the accusation is correct without seeing the "facts". The attorney's motion is reasonable sabre rattling in defense of his client. It lets the plaintiff know she will be thoroughly investigated to establish the reliability of her testimony. If you were accused of a crime and responded with "WTH ? .. that is NOT what happened", it would be appropriate for your attorney to follow the same or similar path. There may be much to shout when this is over but we should not "put the cart in front of the horse". Have a good day Pax :peace Thom Paine
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Ummm, keep your day job. Unless the laws of evidence has changed, ALL cases of any crimes are thoroughly investigated...or should be and adjudicated thusly. That's what police do.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

X Factor said:
That's what nullification is. It's the jury accepting that the case has been proven yet walks the guy anyway based on some other agenda. If you support nullification, that is what you're supporting. Can't just support it in the cases you agree with.
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One would assume that agenda, in this case, would be that it's OK to have nonconsensual sex with a "slut". Would it be equally OK to take her money and car as well?
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Paucity of evidence in the article. However, I would posit that evidence of the accusers promiscuity does not mean that she consented to this sexual encounter. In other words if a girl says yes to everyone else, and no to you....that's still a no.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

ludin said:
fact one there is no rape culture among men. this is a simple false hood.
this is 2 people stupid drunk that have no clue about what they are doing or what they agree to.

unless they slipped her a mickey then it is going to be a he said she said.
if she was that drunk she can't remember then i would have a hard time saying that the boys did anything wrong.

unless there is video tape or some record of what was done.
then it changes.

this isn't a defense of the boys but if you can't remember what you do or do not agree to and then pass out later and forget you can't really accuse someone of rape.
you should never be that drunk to begin with.
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You're saying that a defendant in a rape case should enjoy constitutional protections and actually require a case be proven beyond a reasonable doubt before they're convicted? What the matter with you? Clearly you're an apologist for the rape culture. ;)
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Paxaeon said:
`
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Persistent Rape Culture.
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I don't need your dictionary definitions. I am very much aware of the meanings of the words when they are divided up.

I'm asking YOU what you meant by that, and what evidence you have to back up your claim?
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

ttwtt78640 said:
One would assume that agenda, in this case, would be that it's OK to have nonconsensual sex with a "slut". Would it be equally OK to take her money and car as well?
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I'm not the one arguing that a guy should walk if he's been proven guilty according to the law and the evidence because the jury just feels like it.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Paxaeon said:
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There are more than a few issues here; 1) The persistent rape culture amongst some men and the 2) proliferation of privileged and coddled life of star athletes in college who assume rape is a benefit. However, what I find offensive is the assumption that supposed promiscuity and drinking makes rape justifiable.
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Really? Cause what I'm seeing is a guy who is charged with a crime scrambling to attempt to put forward any kind of defense possible because he doesn't want to go up and go "Yep, guilty, throw the book at me" and because he likely has very little to stand on falls back on such a pathetic and unlikely to succeed argument.

But I guess that wouldn't lend itself to the ever present need to polticize everything into a "womyns" issue from people like you desperate to always paint individual action as an immediete indictment on society at large.

If this guy gets off on the basis that she's "promiscuous" then there's something to legitimately be angery about in terms of a failure in our court system. But people accused of crimes cobble together ****tastic long shot attempts at defenses all the time because its a better option than just walking into prison.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Paxaeon said:
`
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Persistent Rape Culture.
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The Wiki definition you link to states that it is a concept.


Rape culture is a concept and essentially a myth dreamed up by radical feminists.

The crime of rape is only commited by a few people which does not support the idea of a culture
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Paxaeon said:
`
Ummm, keep your day job. Unless the laws of evidence has changed, ALL cases of any crimes are thoroughly investigated...or should be and adjudicated thusly. That's what police do.
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:shrug: Civility in reasonable and earnest discourse does not always occur.

Adieu

Thom Paine
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Soupnazi630 said:
The Wiki definition you link to states that it is a concept.


Rape culture is a concept and essentially a myth dreamed up by radical feminists.

The crime of rape is only commited by a few people which does not support the idea of a culture
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One might as well refer to a "persistant child molestation culture".



oops -- I think I might have just given her some ideas...........
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

mtm1963 said:
University of Tennessee fan here. this is a Vanderbilt football player. poor title!!
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True. However the rules here state I must post the headline and actual article verbatim.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Paxaeon said:
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True. However the rules here state I must post the headline and actual article verbatim.
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yes, the rules do state that.

another case of bad journalism.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

X Factor said:
You're saying that a defendant in a rape case should enjoy constitutional protections and actually require a case be proven beyond a reasonable doubt before they're convicted? What the matter with you? Clearly you're an apologist for the rape culture. ;)
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i know i should be ashamed i will go lash myself 50 times with a wet noodle.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Zyphlin said:
1) Really? Cause what I'm seeing is a guy who is charged with a crime scrambling to attempt to put forward any kind of defense possible because he doesn't want to go up and go "Yep, guilty, throw the book at me" and because he likely has very little to stand on falls back on such a pathetic and unlikely to succeed argument.
2) But I guess that wouldn't lend itself to the ever present need to polticize everything into a "womyns" issue from people like you desperate to always paint individual action as an immediete indictment on society at large.
3) If this guy gets off on the basis that she's "promiscuous" then there's something to legitimately be angery about in terms of a failure in our court system. But people accused of crimes cobble together ****tastic long shot attempts at defenses all the time because its a better option than just walking into prison.
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1) Yes...really. A good defense lawyer can and should use every tactic that is legally available in defense of their client. However, that does not preclude the idea that the jurisprudence the defense is using has been already been overturned.

2) Insofar that nothing in the article or my replies makes this a gender war as you claim, your reaction is a red herring and overstated.

3) You disagree with my opinion, fair enough, but nonetheless, this forum allows for such things, if I am not mistaken. I happen to reject your opinion. Horse a-piece.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

ludin said:
i know i should be ashamed i will go lash myself 50 times with a wet noodle.
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If that isn't evidence of a persistant masochistapasta culture, I don't know what is!
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Gardener said:
If that isn't evidence of a persistant masochistapasta culture, I don't know what is!
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ok i will make it 100 times to make up for it as well. :lamo
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Thom Paine said:
:shrug: Civility in reasonable and earnest discourse does not always occur. Adieu Thom Paine
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I apologize that you find a humorous idiom offensive.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Paxaeon said:
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You better read up on the Duke lacrosse case. Apples and oranges due to mitigating circumstances.
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Wtf ever. The point was wait for more details till you get all pissy or you end up a fool like Nancy grace.
 
Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

Paxaeon said:
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1) Yes...really. A good defense lawyer can and should use every tactic that is legally available in defense of their client. However, that does not preclude the idea that the jurisprudence the defense is using has been already been overturned.
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Exactly. I think the defense is laughable and the idea behind it dispicable...but ultimately that is the justice system we have created in this country and how defense lawyers make their money and how people who pretty much are likely guilty but are seeking to beat the system are going to act. It's similar to the notion of having to deal with the Westboro jackasses as it relates to the first amendment. Is it annoying? Yes. Are they themselves worthy of condemnation? Yes. Is it right to attack SOCIETY as a whole because of it? No.

2) Insofar that nothing in the article or my replies makes this a gender war as you claim, your reaction is a red herring and overstated.
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You did the moment you blamed this on the "rape culture" of "some men"...YOU interjected the notion of an "us vs them" gender war thing. There is no more reason to believe that this defense is being put forth because "some men" are into "rape culture" than it is because there are so few arguments available to them for his defense that they had to grasp one as poor as this.

3) You disagree with my opinion, fair enough, but nonetheless, this forum allows for such things, if I am not mistaken. I happen to reject your opinion. Horse a-piece.
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Yes, you're allowed to post your opinion. I'm allowed to express why I disagree with your opinion. That's how this works.
 
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