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Thread: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘promiscu

  1. #61
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    Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Actually, that defense could fly. The jury could well nullify a case like this if they believe the evidence yet say they don't care and walk the guy. Still find nullification to be a good thing?
    Despite trying to emotionalize it in this context, in general nullification is necessary.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

    Quote Originally Posted by Paxaeon View Post
    `
    `

    There are more than a few issues here; 1) The persistent rape culture amongst some men and the 2) proliferation of privileged and coddled life of star athletes in college who assume rape is a benefit. However, what I find offensive is the assumption that supposed promiscuity and drinking makes rape justifiable.
    `
    Well, he may want that, but TN has a rape shield law that, with one narrow exception, prevents the victims sexual history from being brought up in court as a defense.
    Redneck, hillbilly, fundie, Bible thumper, cracker, split tails, geezer, loon, xenophobe, islamaphobe, and homophobe are not words of tolerance.

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    Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

    1-If the victim was unconscious, there is no excuse regardless of the victims history.
    2-There IS A general attitude of sex and violence against women in every aspect of our society from advertising to television to video games.
    3-This isnt about sports or athletes. If you dont think this happens in college dorms or house parties across the country on a regular basis, you arent looking.

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    Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    1-If the victim was unconscious, there is no excuse regardless of the victims history.
    2-There IS A general attitude of sex and violence against women in every aspect of our society from advertising to television to video games.
    3-This isnt about sports or athletes. If you dont think this happens in college dorms or house parties across the country on a regular basis, you arent looking.
    Yes, this is a cultural issue first and foremost, and the celebrity factor does nothing to mitigate it.
    Redneck, hillbilly, fundie, Bible thumper, cracker, split tails, geezer, loon, xenophobe, islamaphobe, and homophobe are not words of tolerance.

  5. #65
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    Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Despite trying to emotionalize it in this context, in general nullification is necessary.
    Actually, I'm not trying to "emotionalize" (is that a real word?) anything. I just don't think everyone understands what it is and think it's just someone not being convicted because the proof was lacking. That's not nullification, that's what juries are supposed to do.

    Nullification means that, despite taking an oath to render a verdict based on the law and the evidence, jurors will still walk a guy despite the case being proven beyond a reasonable doubt based on their own personal agenda. I don't care if you support it, but if you do, you have to support the jury's decision to do so, even if you disagree with the agenda. It's that that I keep testing.
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    Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

    Quote Originally Posted by CycloneWanderer View Post
    A couple of points:

    1) Why do you focus on the issue of a supposed "rape culture?" It seems like alcohol/drug culture would fit just as well. Wouldn't it better to advise young people to not drink so much that they lose control of themselves (passing out or losing the ability to inhibit primitive urges). It seems like every time one of these stories pops up alcohol/drug use is a common theme. You can rail all you want about how men should control themselves, but if you have a culture that promotes situations where both people greatly diminish their ability to inhibit the undesired behavior you are setting yourself up for failure.

    2) I'm pretty sure the only thing that is proliferating is the media reports of such behaviors. These behaviors have been going on for a long time for a variety of reasons.

    3) I don't think the defense attorney is actually making the assumption that this alleged rape was justified. I think they are presenting the only credible reasoning for the behavior: the logic of a horny, drunk adolescent.
    `
    1) I don't focus on it but it sure does seem to bother you. At any rate, it's my opinion and not part of the article.

    2) I'm glad the media is reporting such things. There used to be a time and a place such things were totally ignored by the media.

    3) Your opinion...which may or may not be true. What is a fact is that is that they are using that defense and that the woman was also "unconscious".

    `

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    Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Actually, I'm not trying to "emotionalize" (is that a real word?) anything. I just don't think everyone understands what it is and think it's just someone not being convicted because the proof was lacking. That's not nullification, that's what juries are supposed to do.

    Nullification means that, despite taking an oath to render a verdict based on the law and the evidence, jurors will still walk a guy despite the case being proven beyond a reasonable doubt based on their own personal agenda. I don't care if you support it, but if you do, you have to support the jury's decision to do so, even if you disagree with the agenda. It's that that I keep testing.
    Yes, I understand what nullification is.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    In which case, you were not just pushing the gender war notion in your OP, but you were redundantly pushing it
    `
    Again, not a fact....your opinion.

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    Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

    Quote Originally Posted by Paxaeon View Post
    `
    1) I don't focus on it but it sure does seem to bother you. At any rate, it's my opinion and not part of the article.

    2) I'm glad the media is reporting such things. There used to be a time and a place such things were totally ignored by the media.

    3) Your opinion...which may or may not be true. What is a fact is that is that they are using that defense and that the woman was also "unconscious".

    `
    Awesome, no need for a trial then, since you know the facts without one.
    The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
    Mahatma Gandhi


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    Re: TN football player wants rape case dismissed because unconscious victim was ‘prom

    Quote Originally Posted by ludin View Post
    prove there is a rape culture amongst men first off. feminist myths and opinions are not facts.quite frankly i find this offensive.
    `
    Deal with it.

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