• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Americans trust Republicans more on Foreign Polcy

Amadeus

Chews the Cud
DP Veteran
Joined
Apr 29, 2013
Messages
6,081
Reaction score
3,216
Location
Benghazi
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Very Liberal
Edit: I removed the TYT commentary, as it is biased.

And here's the article:

Republicans Have Regained the Foreign Policy Edge | FiveThirtyEight

The rising conflict in Iraq has brought the war-torn country back onto the front pages of Western newspapers. It’s the latest in a series of crises and controversies abroad that focus attention on what has become a weak spot for President Obama: Although Obama’s job approval on foreign policy had once run ahead of his overall job-approval rating, it now runs behind.

But the public hasn’t just soured on the president’s handling of foreign affairs.

For most of the Obama administration, polls showed voters trusted Democrats to direct the U.S. on the international stage more than they trusted the GOP. Not anymore. Republicans are now more trusted on foreign policy than are Democrats.

Here’s which party Americans trust more on foreign policy over the past 20 years (using a local regression):

enten-datalab-forpolicy.png
 
Last edited:
Well what do you expect when a Democrat's foreign policy is thus "Well you know other countries have sovriegnty we have to respect, even the bad guys killing people... so we better do nothing and just focus on social issues at home." Truth....
That's quite the caricature you paint. Thankfully none of our leaders actually hold such a position.
 
Well pity that most Americans dont care about foreign policy or affairs..
 
That's quite the caricature you paint. Thankfully none of our leaders actually hold such a position.

Correction. Thankfully none of our CONSERVATIVE leaders actually hold such a position.
 
Well pity that most Americans dont care about foreign policy or affairs..

Oh indeed they do, until domestic conditions become so bad they shift focus. Same with any EU country's citizens.
 
Oh indeed they do, until domestic conditions become so bad they shift focus. Same with any EU country's citizens.

Thats not what decades of polling and reports state.. but hey if you want to go against facts, then be my guest.
 
Thats not what decades of polling and reports state.. but hey if you want to go against facts, then be my guest.

OR you could try to understand the differences between a nation that is a virtual continent unto itself and smaller nations that are surrounded on all sides by other nations, often with "enemy" nations. Anyone with any understanding would know that individuals comforted with a pollster will often think of what's around them first, and what's far away second. Now, if the domestic is running smoothly in the individual's opinion, and there are troubles far away, that's where the focus goes.
 
Perhaps this is a naive comment, but I find it odd that for the last 20 years no party has been above 50% on the chart provided when in my view both parties should always be well above 50%. Why is it not possible to trust both parties on foreign affairs/policy?

As to Obama's problems in this regard, it's not hard to see an explanation. Clearly, Obama made a name for himself, traveling the world before his election in 2008, claiming that America was neither respected nor liked and that he would affect change in that regard. Clearly, he was wrong on both counts since America's position in the world is less respected and less liked over the past 5 plus years than it was under Bush and it's clear to anyone who follows world events that the world is a far more dangerous and less peaceful place.

Just one more example of the great sales job for a very poor product that America bought in 2008 and re-upped in 2012.
 
they should have offered the poll option of "neither"...

I trust neither Republicans nor Democrats on foreign policy.
 
What's 'funny' is that Republicans offer no foreign policy solutions, and often trip over themselves defending what the Bush Administration did 11 years ago. Obama may be unpopular for his disengagement from the Middle East... but what is the actual alternative? How do you fix the sectarian nightmare that Bush unleashed, besides throwing American bodies and treasure at it?
 
What's 'funny' is that Republicans offer no foreign policy solutions, and often trip over themselves defending what the Bush Administration did 11 years ago. Obama may be unpopular for his disengagement from the Middle East... but what is the actual alternative? How do you fix the sectarian nightmare that Bush unleashed, besides throwing American bodies and treasure at it?

IMO, four big questions should guide American foreign policy in the Middle East.

1. Are the government’s actual and intended policies compatible with U.S. interests and those of U.S. regional allies/is there opportunity to influence them in a favorable direction?
2. Does the government have the potential to be stable or to have sustainable rule?
3. What role does the government play in the region’s balance of power?
4. Will the government treat its people in a reasonable fashion?

The first question determines the direction of U.S. bilateral policy. The second determines whether military or non-military aid is likely to be effective. The third determines how much priority should be given to the relationship. The fourth is of lesser importance, but provides insight into whether the country’s policies are compatible with U.S. values, which can be helpful when advocating a sustained foreign aid or military assistance program. Recent military operations in Libya and appeals for military operations in Syria under the notion of a “responsibility to protect” do not satisfactorily address such questions. Absent true genocide, as defined in the Convention on Genocide, the U.S. should refrain from “responsibility to protect” interventionism. Libya did not meet that standard. Syria does not. Such interventionism is little different from regime change in Iraq on grounds that it would expand the sphere of democracy, one of the number of arguments that were behind the 2003 war.

Regime change in the absence of the necessary ingredients for stable and democratic governance should not be expected to produce stable and liberal democracy. Revolutions are not always democratic in nature. Indeed, more often they are not. The Middle East is filled with complex sectarian fault lines. When an illiberal or authoritarian regime is challenged, often but not always by a repressed majority, it is very likely that the nature of the revolution is not democratic or liberal, even if appeals to democracy and human rights are made to try to secure assistance. Iraq offers one example where democracy failed to take root. Libya offers another. Given the internal factors in both countries, the post-regime change outcomes should not be too surprising. Syria would almost certainly add to that list.

Most of the Middle East’s instability results from authoritarian/illiberal regimes that have underperformed when it comes to achieving high living standards and opportunities for the full range of their citizens (due to their own sectarian biases), sectarian fault lines that divide societies, historic rivalries, ideology, and the region’s shifting balance of power. The Israeli-Palestinian dispute is a minor issue in the scheme of those larger structural drivers. That dispute does not pose significant risks to Israel or other key regional U.S. allies. Disproportionate attention should not be focused on addressing that matter. A more realistic posture would involve standing ready to help mediate the dispute if or when the parties are ready, not trying to rush to a final settlement when the fundamental differences remain enormous. A step-by-step approach with smaller interim agreements would be viable and could pave the way for a future final settlement. Big diplomatic efforts should be focused where larger American interests are at stake. The biggest such regional matter concerns Iran’s nuclear activities. The second includes shoring up American regional allies to assure that the balance of power remains consistent with safeguarding their national security and interests. The third concerns mitigating the risks posed by the broader phenomenon of terrorist organizations ranging from Hezbollah to ISIS.

Finally, it should be noted that neo-isolationism does not provide an effective foreign policy. It represents abdication, even as the U.S. does have substantial interests in the Middle East and a number of strategic allies there.
 
Last edited:
Well pity that most Americans dont care about foreign policy or affairs..

That's it, or else the poll would show that Americans trust neither party, considering that for the past four decades (at least) every administration has supported militant Islamic groups. And advanced policies benificial to big business, though not so much for the citizens of other countries.
 
What's 'funny' is that Republicans offer no foreign policy solutions, and often trip over themselves defending what the Bush Administration did 11 years ago. Obama may be unpopular for his disengagement from the Middle East... but what is the actual alternative? How do you fix the sectarian nightmare that Bush unleashed, besides throwing American bodies and treasure at it?

Bush did unleash it your right, but Obama's illegal toppling of the Libyan government, along with his support of terrorist groups have given rise to more extremism. It's not republican or democrat foreign policy in the ME alone, its decades of bad US foreign policy in the region that's designed to create the very instability we've seen there.
 
... foreign policy is kind of big. It doesn't really change and mostly develops according to its own needs and logic.
 
Democrats and Republicans don't even have *the same* policy. The same foreign policy has both both of them.

Once you dump money on another's country soil or become reliant on their resources, you lose your ability to govern that money or exist *without* those resources. You become reliant on other peoples and their systems of government and have to cooperate with them, or else, beat them into submission. Our historical reliance on Middle Eastern oil -- and the military conflicts it stimulates -- isn't a partisan disagreement, its a fact of our economic existence.

It would take the wilful effort of hundreds of millions of people -- on a scale larger than the Civil Rights Movement -- to make a meaningful change in how our foreign policy works.

Until then, our elected representatives are just like the rest of us: locked into the roller-coaster, screaming their heads off as it plummets to the bottom. Only difference is, they get the front row seat and everybody in back somehow blames them for driving them down the hill. As if the toy steering wheels let them control the mechanisms of a machine that's complexity goes over their heads.

Having a position like "Senator", "Congressmen", or "President" doesn't matter when you are checkmated into irrelevance unless you comply with the plans and schemes of powerful and well connected organizations whose operations and sources of power span entire continents.

If any single person gets uppity and starts acting out against the system Big Money created (which is necessarily an act of betrayal since Big Money is what got them to Congress), then everyone else faces a choice: ally with that rebel and risk Big Money's wrath, or marginalize him out of the committees and groups that exert influence within Congress.

The result is a equilibrium based around with compliance with Big Money. Equilibriums can't be broken from within, they have to be upset from the outside.
 
Last edited:
Fickle and un attentive Americans.
 
Democrats and Republicans don't even have *the same* policy. The same foreign policy has both both of them.

Once you dump money on another's country soil or become reliant on their resources, you lose your ability to govern that money or exist *without* those resources. You become reliant on other peoples and their systems of government and have to cooperate with them, or else, beat them into submission. Our historical reliance on Middle Eastern oil -- and the military conflicts it stimulates -- isn't a partisan disagreement, its a fact of our economic existence.

It would take the wilful effort of hundreds of millions of people -- on a scale larger than the Civil Rights Movement -- to make a meaningful change in how our foreign policy works.

Until then, our elected representatives are just like the rest of us: locked into the roller-coaster, screaming their heads off as it plummets to the bottom. Only difference is, they get the front row seat and everybody in back somehow blames them for driving them down the hill. As if the toy steering wheels let them control the mechanisms of a machine that's complexity goes over their heads.

Having a position like "Senator", "Congressmen", or "President" doesn't matter when you are checkmated into irrelevance unless you comply with the plans and schemes of powerful and well connected organizations whose operations and sources of power span entire continents.

If any single person gets uppity and starts acting out against the system Big Money created (which is necessarily an act of betrayal since Big Money is what got them to Congress), then everyone else faces a choice: ally with that rebel and risk Big Money's wrath, or marginalize him out of the committees and groups that exert influence within Congress.

The result is a equilibrium based around with compliance with Big Money. Equilibriums can't be broken from within, they have to be upset from the outside.

Agreed, though you'll find very little more agreement around here.
 
Of-course they trust Republicans more.

Obama's foreign policy failures are a direct result of the left's tendency to politicize absolutely everything.

How will this next action affect me or my fellow Democrats in the next election.
 
I think Teddy Roosevelt's foreign policy has been the most effective for the USA.

"Speak softly and carry a big stick."

Roosevelt described his style of foreign policy as "the exercise of intelligent forethought and of decisive action sufficiently far in advance of any likely crisis".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Stick_ideology

Reagan was a master of it.
 
Μολὼν λαβέ;1063482927 said:
I think Teddy Roosevelt's foreign policy has been the most effective for the USA.

"Speak softly and carry a big stick."



Big Stick ideology - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Reagan was a master of it.

Oh dear. The Monroe doctrine that Teddy, dusted off and expanded upon didn't much serve the interests of the citizens of Latin America. Reagan supported militant Islamic groups like his predecessor and successors did. Failure.
 
Oh dear. The Monroe doctrine that Teddy, dusted off and expanded upon didn't much serve the interests of the citizens of Latin America. Reagan supported militant Islamic groups like his predecessor and successors did. Failure.

Hint: This is the context of the thread - Americans trust Republicans more on Foreign Policy.

I didn't know TR was president of any Latin American country.

Reagan dissolved the former Soviet Union because of his foreign policy.

It seems to be difficult but try keeping up.
 
Well what do you expect when a Democrat's foreign policy is thus "Well you know other countries have sovriegnty we have to respect, even the bad guys killing people... so we better do nothing and just focus on social issues at home." Truth....

I remember when Obama said that if he had actionable intelligence that Bin Laden was in Pakistan then he would act. McCain and the rest of the Republican establishment said that they would be too cowardly to act and that Obama was a fool.

This bears out because George W. Bush was too scared of the consequences of what would happen if Bin Laden was captured when Bin Laden was cornered at Tora Bora.
 
Back
Top Bottom