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Thread: Paul: US has been arming ISIS in Syria

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    Re: Paul: US has been arming ISIS in Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Do you read what you post?



    So, basically, we didn't attack Qatar, and you are trying to spin that as us supporting Al Qaeda. Well done.
    Yes, and it would advance our discussion if you would too! Before you respond.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Paul: US has been arming ISIS in Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Is there any evidence that Paul is right?
    Yes there is. We know for a fact that the US has been arming the rebels for quite some time ('US arming Syrian rebels forces Iran to bleed resources' | JPost | Israel News) (US to start arming Syrian rebels, but will it make much difference? - CSMonitor.com), we also know that the Islamist groups do most of the fighting in Syria (Al-Qaeda Jihadists Are The Best Fighters Among The Syria Rebels - Worldnews.com).

    It is impossible to keep track of these weapons once they get into the country and on top of that, the weapons would possibly go to the best fighters, the jihadists, so it is quite likely that the US has been arming groups like ISIS, albeit inadvertently.
    "And in the end, we were all just humans, drunk on the idea that love, only love, could heal our brokenness."

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    Re: Paul: US has been arming ISIS in Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Yes, and it would advance our discussion if you would too! Before you respond.


    I did read your sources, which is why I knew that the first thing you posted had confused the Free Syrian Army with ISIL and the second thing you posted had a headline you liked, but the body which completely failed to support your contention.

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    Re: Paul: US has been arming ISIS in Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    coming from the guy who didn't even know that ISIS and ISIL were the same organization.

    reading back through the thread, I've done more to break out ISIL and the personalities involved than anyone else.

    For example, when I pointed out the example of Maqdisi critiquing the declaration of the caliphate.
    what you have done, is ignore a substantial point of Paul's.

    Quick, without google, can you even begin to describe that?
    what are you, 12? put your little willy away, this isn't a pissing contest.

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    Re: Paul: US has been arming ISIS in Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post


    I did read your sources, which is why I knew that the first thing you posted had confused the Free Syrian Army with ISIL and the second thing you posted had a headline you liked, but the body which completely failed to support your contention.
    The FSA has morphed many times, but I really think your splitting hairs, and that its not completely known where each and every jihadist in Syria has been or is going. Far more important than this technical diatribe of yours, is that as a matter of policy the US has supported these factions in one configuration or another for these last three years, and in some fashion, militant Islamic groups that have committed terrorist acts for past decades and it hasn't done a damn thing to bring stability to the region, has actually had the opposite effect and logically one should acknowledge that instability is indeed the policy, or successive incompetent administrations. Either way we have sucked at the ME and should get the hell out, and for a long time. As a note of encouragement, recent polls show that more and more Americans are taking the more isolationist view, so perhaps our foreign policy will be given to people who think more like at least, Rand Paul in the future.


    The group, in its original form, was composed of and supported by a variety of Sunni insurgent groups, including its predecessor organizations, the Mujahideen Shura Council, the Islamic State of Iraq (ISI) and Al-Qaeda in Iraq (AQI), the insurgent groups Jaysh al-Fatiheen, Jund al-Sahaba, Katbiyan Ansar Al-Tawhid wal Sunnah and Jeish al-Taiifa al-Mansoura, and a number of Iraqi tribes that profess Sunni Islam.
    Last edited by Montecresto; 07-22-14 at 09:59 PM.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Paul: US has been arming ISIS in Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    The FSA has morphed many times, but I really think your splitting hairs, and that its not completely known where each and every jihadist in Syria has been or is going.
    the leadership of ISIL has been known for years and never involved these guys. In fact the basic ideals of these guys are anathema to the ideals of ISIL.

    It's like claiming that because membership if the Communist part is fluid, some of their leadership also did stints in charge of the Libertarian party.

    Far more important than this technical diatribe of yours
    You mean the facts.

    is that as a matter of policy the US has supported these factions in one configuration or another for these last three years, and in some fashion, militant Islamic groups that have committed terrorist acts for past decades and it hasn't done a damn thing to bring stability to the region, has actually had the opposite effect and logically one should acknowledge that instability is indeed the policy, or successive incompetent administrations. Either way we have sucked at the ME and should get the hell out, and for a long time.
    On the contrary, what we are seeing now is the result of a lack of US involvement. We've gone passive in the last 5 years or so. Welcome to what the world looks like without America. The Middle East is in flames, so is half of North Africa, Central Asia is about to descend back into civil war, and Central Africa isn't looking so hot, either.

    As a note of encouragement, recent polls show that more and more Americans are taking the more isolationist view, so perhaps our foreign policy will be given to people who think more like at least, Rand Paul in the future.
    God I hope not. The last thing we need to do is double down on awful.

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    Re: Paul: US has been arming ISIS in Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    what you have done, is ignore a substantial point of Paul's.
    No, I have ignored the attempt to insert a strawman argument into Pauls' (false) statement.

    what are you, 12? put your little willy away, this isn't a pissing contest.
    No, it is a debate. A conflict of knowledge in which you are unarmed.

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    Re: Paul: US has been arming ISIS in Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    the leadership of ISIL has been known for years and never involved these guys. In fact the basic ideals of these guys are anathema to the ideals of ISIL.

    It's like claiming that because membership if the Communist part is fluid, some of their leadership also did stints in charge of the Libertarian party.



    You mean the facts.



    On the contrary, what we are seeing now is the result of a lack of US involvement. We've gone passive in the last 5 years or so. Welcome to what the world looks like without America. The Middle East is in flames, so is half of North Africa, Central Asia is about to descend back into civil war, and Central Africa isn't looking so hot, either.



    God I hope not. The last thing we need to do is double down on awful.
    Now move the goal post to just IS leadership. There is no way of knowing with any certainty, who their ranks are, where they've been, (AQ, al Nusra, MB etc.) or where they're going, and frankly, this technicality your arguing distracts from the larger and more important point that US policy is helping to drown the ME in sectarian violence, sorry but that's my concern, and its my belief that Rand and his father have and are shinning light on this, hopefully the new polls on the subject mean that Americans are thinking about it.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Paul: US has been arming ISIS in Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Now move the goal post to just IS leadership.
    YOUR SOURCE IS THE ONE THAT MADE THAT ARGUMENT. Seriously. Do you read what you cite?

    the larger and more important point that US policy is helping to drown the ME in sectarian violence, sorry but that's my concern, and its my belief that Rand and his father have and are shinning light on this, hopefully the new polls on the subject mean that Americans are thinking about it.
    If Rand wanted to argue that point then he should have argued that point, instead of making the blatantly false claim that we were arming ISIL. That he made the latter indicates that he doesn't have a terribly good argument for the former, which isn't surprising given that it would be false. The U.S. has expended quite a lot of blood and treasure trying to keep the Fitna under wraps.

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    Re: Paul: US has been arming ISIS in Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    YOUR SOURCE IS THE ONE THAT MADE THAT ARGUMENT. Seriously. Do you read what you cite?



    If Rand wanted to argue that point then he should have argued that point, instead of making the blatantly false claim that we were arming ISIL. That he made the latter indicates that he doesn't have a terribly good argument for the former, which isn't surprising given that it would be false. The U.S. has expended quite a lot of blood and treasure trying to keep the Fitna under wraps.
    My source argues rank and file. And you've pushed the two of us even farther apart with your declaration that we've had a policy of inaction in the ME! That's totally a strange way to describe action that you disagree with. I'm exhausted with our discussion, and can't seem to narrow the ground between us, sorry cp, I'm out of here. Now don't talk bad about me behind my back
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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