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Thread: ISIS in Iraq seizes control of Saddam Hussein’s chemical weapons facility

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    re: ISIL seizes Saddam's chemical weapons plant

    and what about the aluminum tubes?

    Former secretary of state colin Powell specifically mentioned in a 2002 interveiw that iraq was in the process of acquiring aluminum tubes as a component to be used in a nuclear weapons program.

    here is the transcript


    https://www.mtholyoke.edu/acad/intrel/bush/fox.htm
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    re: ISIL seizes Saddam's chemical weapons plant

    This thread confuses me. Are people here actually trying to justify the invasion now, or is this about trying to say it was justified in 2003?

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    re: ISIL seizes Saddam's chemical weapons plant

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    and what about the aluminum tubes?

    Former secretary of state colin Powell specifically mentioned in a 2002 interveiw that iraq was in the process of acquiring aluminum tubes as a component to be used in a nuclear weapons program.

    here is the transcript


    https://www.mtholyoke.edu/acad/intrel/bush/fox.htm
    Bottom line, they were many many years away from constructing any weapons with the yellowcake... if that was their intention.
    “No men are anywhere, and I’m allowed to go in, because I’m the owner of the pageant and therefore I’m inspecting it,” Trump said... “‘Is everyone OK’? You know, they’re standing there with no clothes. ‘Is everybody OK?’ And you see these incredible looking women, and so I sort of get away with things like that.”

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    re: ISIL seizes Saddam's chemical weapons plant

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    I don't know who Mail Online is, but I'm not buying it.
    It's bull****. In the 1980s the Anthrax vaccine still had minute amounts of active anthrax. Not enough to be deadly, but it could be used to grow anthrax in a lab.

    This fact lead criminally dishonest journalists to claim that selling anthrax vaccine to Iraq was equivalent to selling militarized anthrax.

    It doesn't help that the idiotic author of that Mail Online article seems to think Pharmaceutical companies sell chemical weapons.
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    re: ISIL seizes Saddam's chemical weapons plant

    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus View Post
    I have stuff in my fridge that's 'very dangerous'. Is that how low the bar is set to justify an invasion?
    I'll play devil's advocate here... but what exactly do you have in your fridge that is... comparable to sarin gas.... and why?
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    re: ISIL seizes Saddam's chemical weapons plant

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Apparently....:

    Subject: STABILITY OF IRAQ'S CW STOCKPILE
    Apparently Iraq's capabilities for sarin gas storage were only a few weeks at best. All I could find.
    Ah, no. You will note the critical word there, "some". When they detonated in 2004, for example, having been on the shelf for probably about two decades, they still hit our guys, whom we had to treat.

    As your second source says

    CIA HOLDS THAT THE STOCKS OF SARIN MAY

    REMAIN VIABLE WELL BEYOND MARCH. CIA

    ANALYSTS BELIEVE THAT THE SHELF LIFE PROBLEM

    WAS ONLY TEMPORARY AND THAT THE IRAQIS

    CAN NOW PRODUCE UNITARY AGENTS OF

    SUFFICIENT QUALITY BY ADDING A STABILIZER OR

    IMPROVING THE PRODUCTION PROCESS.
    Iraqi's weren't stupid, and they had the ability to adjust their programs.

    DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE
    WASHINGTON, DC 20511
    The Honorable Peter Hoekstra Chairman Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence House of Representatives Washington, DC. 20515

    Dear Chairman Hoekstra: Thank you for your letter of June 19, 2006, requesting that we declassify “key points”from a National Ground Intelligence Center report on the recovery of chemical munitions in Iraq.Attached please find the requested paper.

    Sincerely,
    44
    John D. Negroponte

    UNCLASSIFIED Subject: lraqi Chemical Munitions 21June 2006 Purpose: This summary provides an unclassified overview of chemical munitions recovered in lraq since May 2004.

    Key Points:
    -- Since 2003 Coalition forces have recovered approximately 500 weapons munitions which contain degraded mustard or sarin nerve agent.
    -- Despite many efforts to locate and destroy lraq's pre-Gulf War chemical munitions, filled and unfilled pre-Gulf War chemical munitions are assessed to still exist.

    -- Pre-Gulf War Iraqi chemical weapons could be sold on the black market. Use of these weapons by terrorists or insurgent groups would have implications for Coalition forces in Iraq. The possibility of use outside lraq cannot be ruled out.
    -- The most likely munitions remaining are sarin and mustard-filled projectiles.
    -- The purity of the agent inside the munitions depends on many factors,including the manufacturing process, potential additives, and environmental storage conditions. While agents degrade over time, chemical warfare agents remain hazardous and potentially lethal.
    -~ It has been reported in open press that insurgents and lraqi groups desire to acquire and use chemical weapons

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    re: ISIL seizes Saddam's chemical weapons plant

    Quote Originally Posted by Middleground View Post
    Bottom line, they were many many years away from constructing any weapons with the yellowcake... if that was their intention.
    A nuclear weapon, yes. A dirty bomb they already had all the materials necessary for.

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    re: ISIL seizes Saddam's chemical weapons plant

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Apparently....:

    Subject: STABILITY OF IRAQ'S CW STOCKPILE

    Apparently Iraq's capabilities for sarin gas storage were only a few weeks at best. All I could find.

    You took the statement "SOME SARIN HAD A SHELF LIFE OF ONLY A FEW WEEKS"

    And changed it to "Apparently Iraq's capabilities for sarin gas storage were only a few weeks at best."

    Essentially the opposite meaning of the actual quote. That is dishonest.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

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    re: ISIL seizes Saddam's chemical weapons plant

    These weapons were found shortly after the US invasion of Iraq by US troops.

    They were old soviet 1970s rubbish that wasnt capable of being used as the Bush administration had announced.

    I recall from the 2006 report by the Bush administration which I read that

    "Coalition forces have recovered approximately 500 weapons munitions which contain degraded mustard or sarin nerve agent."
    Which were all built pre first gulf war and were therefor not the threat that Bush and Blair had warned everyone about.

    Some of them were actualy so unstable that the Saddam regime had them stored in Bunkers for safety of the Iraqi army.

    The facilities which were used in Iraq were also all destroyed in the 1990 gulf war.

    So this story can only mean 5 things:

    It`s an overhyped piece of media garbage.

    ISIS has seized a useless facility

    ISIS has seized weapons that are potentialy more harmfull to them than to any enemy of theirs

    The post 2003 Iraq government had built it`s own chemical weapons program.

    The Bush administration were dumb enought to leave those chemical agents that they found behind.


    Pick yourself.
    Last edited by The German; 06-19-14 at 11:24 PM.

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    re: ISIL seizes Saddam's chemical weapons plant

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    even though chemical weapons are WMDS by definition, the medias framing of the argument was that the administration was talking about iraq possessing a specific kind of Weapon of mass destruction. the kind of weapon of mass destruction whose defining characteristic is that upon detonation it creates a giant mushroom cloud.
    The administration claimed that Iraq had an ongoing Biological production program, an ongoing Chemical production program, and was seeking to establish a nuclear production program. What we found was no biological program at all, legacy chemical weapons, and enriched uranium and radioactive materials that could be used in dirty bombs. The big mushroom cloud may have been the item that captured everyone's attention (or yours, for me it was the bio stuff), but it was hardly the extent of the Administrations' WMD argument.

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