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Thread: Anti-Redskins ad airing during NBA Finals[W:125]

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    Re: Tonighjt June 11 Watch The NBA Half Time For A Redskins Protest of Racism

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    The "I have a black friend" argument is attempting to excuse ones action towards the whole because of treatment of a single.

    The argument that women should be subservient because a few individual women on this forum have expressed they felt that way is attempting to suggest the majority should act in the way a minority wants.

    The argument that the vast MAJORITY of native americans don't believe the name needs to change is not "like" either of those. In both of those you're referencing a small minority as justification for action towards the majority.

    If anything, pointing at a random individual native american saying it should change and using that as justification that it needs to change because it's offensive "to native americans" is closer to "I have a black friend" then the other way around.

    The words origin is not that of a slur. The words history is not singularly that of a slur. The words use as the name of a team is not meant as a slur. The majority of native americans don't view the name as something that needs to change. The majority of americans don't view the name as something that needs to change. But SIMPLY because a small minority claim they're offended by it then we're told it must change becuase it's "racism" and damaging society.

    And pointing that out is the thing that's supposed to be like saying "I've got a black friend"?
    I have a very good friend that is native American Indian. Its true.

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    Re: Tonighjt June 11 Watch The NBA Half Time For A Redskins Protest of Racism

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    At that point, Illinois should change it's name too, it is after all named for the Illinois Indian tribe, Montauk New York must change, Baton Rouge on a technicality because the French named it so after seeing a red stick which the natives used to denote a territorial marker(Baton(stick) Rouge(red)). In fact, Saginaw Michigan and the steering parts they manufacture would have to go, as would Milwuakee Wisconsin. Hell, I like this idea, take it to the absolute extreme to show just how silly this crap really is.
    Exactly right. Out of respect...we should completely eliminate all references to Indians. No more exploiting them.

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    Re: Anti-Redskins ad airing during NBA Finals[W:125]

    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    That's not the same thing. The Redskins aren't named that because they want their team to have a denigrating, offensive name. They're named that to honor Native American heritage. A team wouldn't call themselves something that they hate and that people hate.
    He typed:
    'People need to grow up and stop concerning themselves with what teams are named.'

    So, I wanted to see whether he meant it or not.

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    Re: Tonighjt June 11 Watch The NBA Half Time For A Redskins Protest of Racism

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Redskin as a derogatory term is nothing made up or new.
    Anyone who suggests that Redskins can't BE a derogatory term is being ridiculous in my mind.

    HOWEVER...

    Anyone suggesting it simply IS a derogatory word is also being ridiculous. In some instances it is, in some instances it's not.

    It's origins are not derogatory in nature. It's use at predominantly native american high schools is not derogatory in nature. Native Americans who refer to native americans by that term is not derogatory in nature. It's use as a sports franchise is not derogatory in nature.

    When it's being used as a perjorative term for native americans it's being used as a derogatory term. That's not the only method in which the word is used however.

    But I don't think that the poster was suggesting it's "made up" that Redskins CAN be derogatory. I believe he's suggesting that it's made up that the Washington Redskins use of the word is derogatory in nature.

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    Re: Anti-Redskins ad airing during NBA Finals[W:125]

    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    That's not the same thing. The Redskins aren't named that because they want their team to have a denigrating, offensive name. They're named that to honor Native American heritage. A team wouldn't call themselves something that they hate and that people hate.
    .... How do you honor something by calling it a derogatory name? ... Wait.. let's just look at the BS story by the Washington organization:

    Washington Redskins name controversy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Snyder also states that the name was chosen in 1933 to honor Native Americans in general and the coach and four players at that time who were Native American; and that in 1971 the then coach George Allen consulted with the Red Cloud Indian Fund on the Pine Ridge reservation when designing the logo.[34] However the Red Cloud Athletic Fund sent a letter to the Washington Post stating that "As an organization, Red Cloud Indian School has never—and will never—endorse the use of the name “Redskins.” Like many Native American organizations across the country, members of our staff and extended community find the name offensive."[
    Redskin (slang) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Some accounts state that the name "Redskins" was chosen to honor William "Lone Star" Dietz, who began coaching in 1933, because his mother was Sioux. Dietz's true heritage has been questioned by some scholars, citing a birth certificate and census records that his parents were white.[50] There were four Native Americans on the original Redskins team of 1933.[51]
    In short: The people who supposedly came up with the name, have distanced themselves from it. The guy it was named after wasn't even Native. The name picked was derogatory as far back as the 1900s.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Anti-Redskins ad airing during NBA Finals[W:125]

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    He typed:
    'People need to grow up and stop concerning themselves with what teams are named.'

    So, I wanted to see whether he meant it or not.
    You went ridiculous. He knows, you know and all of us know that a team would never call themselves that.

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    Anti-Redskins ad airing during NBA Finals[W:125]

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    .... How do you honor something by calling it a derogatory name? ... Wait.. let's just look at the BS story by the Washington organization:

    Washington Redskins name controversy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



    Redskin (slang) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



    In short: The people who supposedly came up with the name, have distanced themselves from it. The guy it was named after wasn't even Native. The name picked was derogatory as far back as the 1900s.
    So if the team owner changes the name, who compensates him the hundreds of millions of dollars that the brand name is worth? Perhaps the people who think it should be changed should come up with the cash?

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    Re: Anti-Redskins ad airing during NBA Finals[W:125]

    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    You went ridiculous. He knows, you know and all of us know that a team would never call themselves that.
    Well duh.

    He made a ridiculous statement and I called him on it.

    Still waiting for his answer.


    Your opinion on this means nothing to me as I was not talking to you.

    Good day.

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    Re: Anti-Redskins ad airing during NBA Finals[W:125]

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    Well duh.

    He made a ridiculous statement and I called him on it.

    Still waiting for his answer.


    Your opinion on this means nothing to me as I was not talking to you.

    Good day.
    So you come up with a complete strawman to address his statement, when you knew damn well what he meant. Nice!

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    Re: Tonighjt June 11 Watch The NBA Half Time For A Redskins Protest of Racism

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Anyone who suggests that Redskins can't BE a derogatory term is being ridiculous in my mind.

    HOWEVER...

    Anyone suggesting it simply IS a derogatory word is also being ridiculous. In some instances it is, in some instances it's not.

    It's origins are not derogatory in nature. It's use at predominantly native american high schools is not derogatory in nature. Native Americans who refer to native americans by that term is not derogatory in nature. It's use as a sports franchise is not derogatory in nature.

    When it's being used as a perjorative term for native americans it's being used as a derogatory term. That's not the only method in which the word is used however.

    But I don't think that the poster was suggesting it's "made up" that Redskins CAN be derogatory. I believe he's suggesting that it's made up that the Washington Redskins use of the word is derogatory in nature.
    When you refer to a person by the color of their skin you are in fact drawing a distinct line between that which is proper and normal (your society) and that which isn't. Whether or not you find some uses of the word acceptable, the very nature by which slurs are conceived makes it clear that these words are meant to isolate and discriminate against the group. The fact that redskin was in and of itself a slang term and not an officially sanctioned use of the word (as opposed to Africans and Indians) proves that at no point was this word meant to do anything other than single out Native Americans on basis of their color. Similarly, there simply isn't a context in which calling someone a kike or a wop would be anything more than a slur used to single out Native Americans as different and unlike the rest. In short, it's a racist word that revisionists have given new meaning to. However, this new meaning doesn't change the fact that it's a historically racist word.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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