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Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW[W:28]

Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

US Conservative said:
As stated, he exposed much more than just illegal govt activities, and whats more he didn't even screen the data, he let the press do that.
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This is a lie. He was highly selective of what he took with him and what he has released.

Still, it doesn't excuse your advocacy of rape.
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

Henry David said:
In the traditional American scheme of things, do you see the media (journalists) as having a role in keeping the government playing honestly? Is the Fourth Estate really necessary, and what role should it play in our form of government?
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Most mainstream American media has proven it is not adversarial and certainly not unbiased, especially under this administration.

They never to their job, but this is where they decide to get tough? Please.
 
TheDemSocialist said:
God bless this man. God bless him. Its a shame that people view this man as a traitor and not as a hero in our country.
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Seriously. Why do people confuse their personal opposition to the PRISM program with a need to lionize the scumbag who revealed it?
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

Geoist said:
Probably not. But I doubt he would want to come back except to see family. He will probably end up moving to a more democratic nation as he intended once our govt gets the stick out of its butt.
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Govt doesn't forget things like this. He might be able to disappear. But otherwise his existence will get more and more unpleasant.
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

Geoist said:
Because he was in transit. It was one of the few places that would take him at the time. If he truly wanted to stay in Russia he wouldn't be seeking asylum in the EU now would he?



Secrets that were illegally obtained in the first place. You conservatives are supposed to defend the Constitution, not defend constitutional violations.



Yet, you and others in the "Snowden Is a Traitor!" camp keep bringing up Russia as if it was his first choice of countries to seek asylum in.
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Like I said, even IF he exposed some things that may or may not be illegal (the govt would argue it is, and frankly we dont know the full extend of these measures) that doesn't change what he did.
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

Geoist said:
This is a lie. He was highly selective of what he took with him and what he has released.
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That is false. He loaded terabytes of data onto those laptops - assuming he worked literally 24 hours a day non stop the entire time he was in Hawaii, he didn't have the physical ability to be "highly selective" or screen what he took and what he didn't. At best he just grabbed the best stuff he could find, and stuffed as much of it as he could into the laptops before taking off to China.
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

Geoist said:
This is a lie. He was highly selective of what he took with him and what he has released.

Still, it doesn't excuse your advocacy of rape.
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If you watched the interview, and read the NBC transcripts you would know he stole far too many documents to know what was and wasn't "releasable", and he let journalists dig through what he released. This is in his own words.

And no, Im not a rape advocate.
 
cpwill said:
Seriously. Why do people confuse their personal opposition to the PRISM program with a need to lionize the scumbag who revealed it?
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So you think its justifiable all the **** the NSA is doing?
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

Geoist said:
Secrets that were illegally obtained in the first place
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Really. Here is a very short list of some of the crap that Snowden has released:

...The classified portions of the U.S. intelligence budget, detailing how much we spend and where on efforts to spy on terror groups and foreign states, doesn’t deal with Americans’ privacy. This leak revealed the intelligence community’s self-assessment in 50 major areas of counterterrorism, and that “blank spots include questions about the security of Pakistan’s nuclear components when they are being transported, the capabilities of China’s next-generation fighter aircraft, and how Russia’s government leaders are likely to respond to ‘potentially destabilizing events in Moscow, such as large protests and terrorist attacks.’” The Pakistani, Chinese, and Russian intelligence agencies surely appreciate the status report.

Our cyber-warfare capabilities and targets don’t deal with Americans’ privacy. The revelation that the U.S. launched 231 cyber-attacks against “top-priority targets, which former officials say includes adversaries such as Iran, Russia, China and North Korea and activities such as nuclear proliferation” in 2011 has nothing to do with Americans’ privacy.

The extent and methods of our spying on China have nothing to do with Americans’ privacy.

British surveillance of South African and Turkish diplomats has nothing to do with Americans’ privacy.

The NSA’s successful interceptions of communications of Russian President Dimitri Medvedev has nothing to do with Americans’ privacy. This is not a scandal; it is literally the NSA’s job, and now the Russians have a better idea of what messages were intercepted and when.

Revealing NSA intercepts and CIA stations in Latin America — again, nothing to do with U.S. citizens.

Revealing a U.K. secret internet-monitoring station in the Middle East — nothing to do with U.S. citizens.

The extent and range of NSA communications monitoring in India. . . .

The fact that the United States has “ramped up its surveillance of Pakistan’s nuclear arms,” has “previously undisclosed concerns about biological and chemical sites there,” and details of “efforts to assess the loyalties of counterterrorism sources recruited by the CIA” . . .

The U.S.’s spying on Al-Jazeera’s internal communication system. . . .

What we know about al-Qaeda efforts to hack our drones. . . .

The NSA’s ability to intercept the e-mail of al-Qaeda operative Hassan Ghul. . . .

The NSA’s ability to read the e-mail of the Mexican president. . . .

The U.S.’s electronic intercepts of communications to French consulates and embassies in New York and Washington. . . .

The existence of NSA surveillance teams in 80 U.S. embassies around the globe . . .

NSA’s spying on OPEC . . .

NSA’s collecting data on the porn habits of Muslim extremist leaders in order to discredit them . . .
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Etc. so on and so forth. Perhaps you could tell me how these were all the result of unconstitutional collection, or why Snowden had to reveal them?
 
TheDemSocialist said:
So you think its justifiable all the **** the NSA is doing?
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Now that's interesting. I point out that the "NSA is bad so Snowden is Good" formulation is a false binary, and your response is to demand if I therefore think that all the stuff the NSA was doing is justifiable.

Are you okay with Snowden revealing our intelligence gaps, our cyber capabilities, disrupting the US/EU relationship right before Russia went into Ukraine, and helping Taliban fighters avoid our collection, thereby putting our soldiers sailors and Marines into greater danger? Do you have a good reason for why he would release not the PRISM program, but all the other crap that he has?
 
cpwill said:
Are you okay with Snowden revealing our intelligence gaps, our cyber capabilities, disrupting the US/EU relationship right before Russia went into Ukraine, and helping Taliban fighters avoid our collection, thereby putting our soldiers sailors and Marines into greater danger?
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Yes. But is there actually any proof that "sailors and Marines were put into greater danger"? We heard the same thing about the Wikileaks Afghanistan leaks, but yet they were not put into greate danger.

Do you have a good reason for why he would release not the PRISM program, but all the other crap that he has?
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I do. 1.)It proves are worldly "big brother" status
2.)It reveals way more than the PRISM collection system
3.)Shows the corruption and the negligence in the NSA itself
4.)Shows that we are collected way more data and information that we can handle
 
TheDemSocialist said:
Yes. But is there actually any proof that "sailors and Marines were put into greater danger"?
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Yes. We lost collect capability because the Taliban switched communications methodology, meaning that we weren't able to anticipate and prepare for attacks as well as we were before.

To put it in an analogy, if you are boxing a dude, and then your coach slips a very thin blindfold over you, one you can sort of kind of see dim outlines of people through, has he helped you? Or the person you are boxing.

We heard the same thing about the Wikileaks Afghanistan leaks, but yet they were not put into greate danger.
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that is incorrect.

I do. 1.)It proves are worldly "big brother" status
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A) How in the world is the Intelligence Community identifying it's own gaps with regards to the Pakistani nuclear program proving a worldly Big Brother status
B) Knowing what is going on in the world and informing the President and other senior decision makers is the Intelligence Community's job. That's why we set them up in the first place.

2.)It reveals way more than the PRISM collection system
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You are damn right it did. The vast majority of Snowden's leaks have nothing whatsoever to do with collect against US persons or data.

3.)Shows the corruption and the negligence in the NSA itself
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Actually those leaks demonstrate that the NSA is (was) doing it's job, in collecting against foreign targets.

4.)Shows that we are collected way more data and information that we can handle
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Um. How in the world does it do that.



We depend upon our cyber capabilities to protect critical US infrastructure and information. Snowden gave that up to the Chinese and the Russians. We depend on the ability to collect against the Taliban and associates in order to forestall or minimize the damage of their attacks. Snowden dramatically reduced our ability to do that. There isn't a good excuse for that from an American.
 
cpwill said:
Yes. We lost collect capability because the Taliban switched communications methodology, meaning that we weren't able to anticipate and prepare for attacks as well as we were before.

To put it in an analogy, if you are boxing a dude, and then your coach slips a very thin blindfold over you, one you can sort of kind of see dim outlines of people through, has he helped you? Or the person you are boxing.
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I have heard this claim but have not seen a document to prove this claim, especially since US deployment forces are (for the most part) leaving Afghanistan...

that is incorrect.
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http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/20...said-wikileaks-revelations-were-not-damaging/
Pentagon says WikiLeaks war logs don’t harm national security - Salon.com
Review of WikiLeaks docs sees no smoking gun - World news - South and Central Asia | NBC News
https://pressfreedomfoundation.org/blog/2013/08/bradley-manning-did-not-hurt-united-states

A) How in the world is the Intelligence Community identifying it's own gaps with regards to the Pakistani nuclear program proving a worldly Big Brother status
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So we should collect Polish documents? Allies documents? We collected porn habits for god sakes.

B) Knowing what is going on in the world and informing the President and other senior decision makers is the Intelligence Community's job. That's why we set them up in the first place.
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To trace everything? Even innocent peoples!?


You are damn right it did. The vast majority of Snowden's leaks have nothing whatsoever to do with collect against US persons or data.
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So as a person who upholds the founding fathers you do so many times here, you are ok with 1 government doing a global spying effort that makes George Orwell's book look like a playbook?



Actually those leaks demonstrate that the NSA is (was) doing it's job, in collecting against foreign targets.
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Collected porn habits of Professors and activists is "its job"? Really!?


Um. How in the world does it do that.
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NSA Struggles to Make Sense of Flood of Surveillance Data - WSJ

We depend upon our cyber capabilities to protect critical US infrastructure and information. Snowden gave that up to the Chinese and the Russians. We depend on the ability to collect against the Taliban and associates in order to forestall or minimize the damage of their attacks. Snowden dramatically reduced our ability to do that. There isn't a good excuse for that from an American.
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Hmmm: NSA program stopped no terror attacks, says White House panel member - NBC News
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

Northern Light said:
^ What are you talking about? Data mining is a marketing tool. People's activities get monitored by private websites who then use the anonymous data for marketing purposes. That's not the same thing a the government collecting info about your relationships, bank transactions, digital communications, etc... to build a profile on you when you haven't even committed a crime.

Snowden is right. Our government (Republican and then Democrat) rode the 9/11 tragedy all the way to bank. We do not have the level of freedom from government intrusion that we had even back then, and anyone who thinks otherwise is delusional.
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Personally I support Snowden's decision to blow the whistle. He's technically a traitor by law, but so was Washington. Great men taking huge risks is what created the great country the world (and America) used to revere. It will require the same great men and risky deeds to restore it to that state.

Watch the documentary Terms and Conditions May Apply. There is wording in "Privacy" policies and Terms of Use documents that states any information and content surrendered to the services becomes property of the service and can use it for whatever they like. They also share this information with federal agencies. If you search for a string of keywords that might lead someone to believe you're planning a murder, you're probably going to either get a call, a knock on the door, or at the very least be place under additional surveillance. There really is not much limitation to what information is not available to the government. You can thank the patriot act for a lot of this.

Edit:

Additionally, as a software engineer, I can tell you data mining is not used exclusively for marketing. The whole premise behind data mining is to find trends in data that can be used to project an outcome, regardless of the kind of outcome. This is most widely recognized through marketing, but it can just as easily be adapted to other things as well. You can be sure that there are mining algorithms looking for specific things related to "national security". I don't see many terrorists being caught though.
 
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Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

US Conservative said:
Most mainstream American media has proven it is not adversarial and certainly not unbiased, especially under this administration.

They never to their job, but this is where they decide to get tough? Please.
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Thanks for the straight answer! ;)
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

US Conservative said:
Govt doesn't forget things like this. He might be able to disappear. But otherwise his existence will get more and more unpleasant.
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You're right. Much of the government consists of arrogant children who froth at the mouth whenever anyone challenges them. This has nothing to do with national security and you know it. Just look what happens when the president or a politician reveals truly sensitive information and compare that to how they are treating Snowden.
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

US Conservative said:
Like I said, even IF he exposed some things that may or may not be illegal (the govt would argue it is, and frankly we dont know the full extend of these measures) that doesn't change what he did.
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...And what he did was defend the original American law: the US Constitution. But of course, that document has better use as toilet paper nowadays.
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

cpwill said:
That is false. He loaded terabytes of data onto those laptops - assuming he worked literally 24 hours a day non stop the entire time he was in Hawaii, he didn't have the physical ability to be "highly selective" or screen what he took and what he didn't. At best he just grabbed the best stuff he could find, and stuffed as much of it as he could into the laptops before taking off to China.
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I am talking about what he released.
 
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Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

US Conservative said:
If you watched the interview, and read the NBC transcripts you would know he stole far too many documents to know what was and wasn't "releasable", and he let journalists dig through what he released. This is in his own words.
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You are implying that he released everything he took. He did not.

And no, Im not a rape advocate.
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Then there is no reason to joke about it, especially when the victim is a defender of the US Constitution.
 
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Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

Did I mention he is a hero?

Well, just in case I did not mention he is a hero...he is a hero.

Btw, we all know who I am saying is a hero right?

Well, just in case...Edward Smowden is a hero.

So, to sum up...Edward Enowdrn is a hero.




'hero  

he·ro [heer-oh] Show IPA
noun, plural he·roes; for 5 also he·ros.
1.
a man of distinguished courage or ability, admired for his brave deeds and noble qualities.
2.
a person who, in the opinion of others, has heroic qualities or has performed a heroic act and is regarded as a model or ideal: He was a local hero when he saved the drowning child.'

Hero | Define Hero at Dictionary.com
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

Geoist said:
I am talking about what he released.
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Ah. Then I think you meant to say has thus far had published; because he released all that crap, it's simply not currently available open-source, but on whatever networks the Chinese, Russians, and whomever they have decided to share it with have.
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

Geoist said:
Then there is no reason to joke about it, especially when the victim is a defender of the US Constitution.
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No he's frigging not. He poses that way so that useful fools will rush to defend him and he can be effective on the world stage as a spoiler for US foreign diplomacy, but if he was merely a defender of the US Constitution then he would not have made public many of the things that he has.
 
Re: Edward Snowden NBC NEWS FULL INTERVIEW

DA60 said:
Did I mention he is a hero?

Well, just in case I did not mention he is a hero...he is a hero.

Btw, we all know who I am saying is a hero right?

Well, just in case...Edward Smowden is a hero.

So, to sum up...Edward Enowdrn is a hero.




'hero  

he·ro [heer-oh] Show IPA
noun, plural he·roes; for 5 also he·ros.
1.
a man of distinguished courage or ability, admired for his brave deeds and noble qualities.
2.
a person who, in the opinion of others, has heroic qualities or has performed a heroic act and is regarded as a model or ideal: He was a local hero when he saved the drowning child.'

Hero | Define Hero at Dictionary.com
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:shrug: if you have to dumb-down your definition of "hero" to the point where any traitor or terrorist fits the bill in order to include Snowden, that ought to tell you something.
 
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