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Thread: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on

  1. #71
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    Re: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on

    Quote Originally Posted by Jango View Post
    No & no. But do either one become true if one recognizes that the reality in their country doesn't exactly match up with the language routinely used by politicians or laws of the land? There is no other place on this planet that I'd rather be than here in the U.S. & my home state of Michigan but I identify, acknowledge & accept that things going on here are different than what I (and probably you) was taught in grade school, hear from the media/politicians on a daily basis & read in sanitized history books (I.e. they only tell the story of our triumphs without also mentioning everything else that is involved in our unique & colorful history.)

    Since things are not perfect, the US is not a democracy?

  2. #72
    A Man Without A Country
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    Re: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on

    Quote Originally Posted by Gina View Post
    How? The circus they generated gives cover to those who would rather not see the problem solved. If Greenwald/Snowden had not gleefully made themselves the topic, the media attention would have been on those who should be taken to task and those who should be called upon to fix NSA. It's not now because of this giant media circus.
    Not to be a contrarian, but I seriously doubt that the media would have taken anyone to task. The MSM has a very cozy relationship with the US government and generally wants to maintain access at all costs, even if it means sitting on stories as the NYT did.
    "And in the end, we were all just humans, drunk on the idea that love, only love, could heal our brokenness."

  3. #73
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    Re: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    Spare me the morality play bull**** about how the means justify the ends. You people are sadly misguided.
    But then, doesn't that lead to the question: What justifies the means?
    "And in the end, we were all just humans, drunk on the idea that love, only love, could heal our brokenness."

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    Angry Former GOP Voter
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    Re: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on

    Quote Originally Posted by d0gbreath View Post
    Considering that everyone hates the NSA, John Q. should be safe from retribution. Now if his name is Faisal Israel Mohammad, you may have a valid point. I for one would hate to see peoples killing Sikhs in convenience stores again.
    Not necessarily. While individuals with Islamic backgrounds are more susceptible to public reaction, you have no idea how any person thought domestically-suspicious by the government may be treated by the populace.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

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    Re: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    Spare me the morality play bull**** about how the means justify the ends. You people are sadly misguided.
    You are sadly misguided if you believe that there is any way 'within the law' to get things like this to change. It is in exactly that kind of situation that breaking the law is justified.
    You can never be safe from a government that can keep you completely safe from each other and the world. You must choose.

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    Re: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on

    Quote Originally Posted by Dezaad View Post
    You are sadly misguided if you believe that there is any way 'within the law' to get things like this to change. It is in exactly that kind of situation that breaking the law is justified.
    Vigilante Justice.... from Russia. Yeah.
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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    Re: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Since things are not perfect, the US is not a democracy?
    No, we're still a democracy, a representative one on the surface & a Plutocracy underneath, but we're also not functioning very well democratically on a wide variety of issues, including being represented, which is evidenced by the approval ratings of the POTUS, the SCOTUS & Congress.

  8. #78
    global liberation

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    Re: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on

    Quote Originally Posted by Jango View Post
    No, we're still a democracy,
    Ok, good. I was debating with someone who claims democracy in the US is an illusion. He was Truthin', and basically equating the US with totalitarian regimes, apparently in an attempt to apologize for and support them.

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    Re: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Ok, good. I was debating with someone who claims democracy in the US is an illusion. He was Truthin', and basically equating the US with totalitarian regimes, apparently in an attempt to apologize for and support them.
    Obviously, the U.S. > any totalitarian regime (anyone really). And while I wouldn't say that "democracy in the U.S. is an illusion," I would though, say that the lines are often blurred.

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    Re: Glenn Greenwald to publish list of U.S. citizens that NSA spied on

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    Vigilante Justice.... from Russia. Yeah.
    Whatever. NOT an accurate comparison. This is the government breaking the law, and protecting its own ability through its own lesser laws and institutions to go on breaking that law. No comparison whatsoever to be made to normal and inevitable miscarriages of justice between government and non-government criminals.
    You can never be safe from a government that can keep you completely safe from each other and the world. You must choose.

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