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Thread: House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

  1. #31
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    Re: House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    Quote Originally Posted by Verax View Post
    I don't know much about law from a technical standpoint. It just seems unreasonable and un-American that the government can search and spy on everything we do digitally just because its easy for them to do so.
    I get that it seems that way. But metadata storage isn't spying. If companies will keep it, that's good enough. But a record needs to be available, one way or another, to piece things together after the fact. If security organizations knew it was possible to keep these records but didn't attempt to have them preserved, they'd be in dereliction of their duties.

    This is also a slippery slope. I read not too long ago about how they're using this spying for the war on drugs as well. Once we get used to all this, how long until the local police get to use this as a standard investigation tool? How long until corporations get to use this technology? They're already benefiting from its foreign use, how long until they're doing that here in America? Are they already doing it? I'm sure what we know is only the tip of the iceberg.
    Well, it's always a slippery slope, isn't it? Fire in a crowded theater? We can both make appeals to emotionality- I could talk about attacks possible simply because someone is in the US when they send a text as a means for much more than metadata collection- but I'm not sure these appeals mean much.

    This is far too much power and it will be severely and abundantly abused in the future if we don't stop it now. They can find other ways to fight terrorism.
    WHAT is far too much power? Have you ever read the user's agreement on Gmail? I'm sure lots of people can find lots of ways to do lots of things. But ignoring effective ways is only interesting to people who have no responsibility for ensuring the job is done. I'll venture to say you have no background or experience in national security, so of course it's easy for you to say "find other ways". Most people who do, though, want these things in place. And national level legislators happened to listen to them today. I'm glad they decided to listen to them, but frankly that was never in doubt anyway.
    Last edited by OldWorldOrder; 05-24-14 at 02:07 AM.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
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  2. #32
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    Re: House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigfoot 88 View Post
    I never said they belong to the Libertarian party. Neither did the article. We are talking about ideology.

    I know a ton about Amash, Massie, and Sanford. I have followed their careers closely; Amash and Massie from the beginning; and Sanford for a few years, the rest I researched. All are strongly supported by Ron Paul for a reason, and not just because they all supported him.
    And I am talking about frauds who do not even have the courage of their supposed convictions. Ron Paul included.
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    Re: House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    This thread and the story behind it is based on a LIE. There are no House Libertarians. The people named are Republicans and that is how they were elected and that is their party identification.
    small l libertarians there bud...Not big L...

    it's small in the title and in the opening...

    House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    "The three most libertarian members of the House want nothing to do with the so-called USA Freedom Act.

  4. #34
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    Re: House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    I get that it seems that way. But metadata storage isn't spying.
    Sure it is. They collect data to spy at their leisure sometime in the future.

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    WHAT is far too much power?
    Power that is not explicitly provided for in the Constitution.

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    Have you ever read the user's agreement on Gmail?
    Sure. It's why I don't use Google searches any more nor GMail.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post

    Sure. It's why I don't use Google searches any more nor GMail.
    Long live Bing.

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    Re: House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    Quote Originally Posted by fmw View Post
    Long live Bing.
    7 alternative search sites that respect your privacy
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Sure it is. They collect data to spy at their leisure sometime in the future.
    Ahahahaha. Depending on your definition of leisure, sure. At my leisure in the future, I'll buy a Lamborghini.

    Power that is not explicitly provided for in the Constitution.
    I guess that depends on how you want to look at it. Is the power to promote Staff Sergeants to Sergeants First Class specifically in the constitution? Same general idea.

    Sure. It's why I don't use Google searches any more nor GMail.
    So you're aware that you have no expectation of privacy in emails? Excellent!
    Last edited by OldWorldOrder; 05-24-14 at 10:18 AM.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

  8. #38
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    Re: House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    Quote Originally Posted by ChezC3 View Post
    small l libertarians there bud...Not big L...

    it's small in the title and in the opening...

    House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    "The three most libertarian members of the House want nothing to do with the so-called “USA Freedom Act.”
    I will NOT dignify the Halloween costumed right wingers who pretend to be something they are not with a title they reject for themselves.
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    Re: House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    Ahahahaha. Depending in your definition of leisure, sure. At my leisure in the future, I'll buy a Lamborghini.
    You're analogy would be correct if you're constantly collecting large sums of money from every American every day.

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    I guess that depends on how you want to look at it. Is the power to promote Staff Sergeants to Sergeants First Class specifically in the constitution? Same general idea.
    Did you just compare executive governmental powers to military promotions? What a truly dizzying intellect.

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    So you're aware that you have no expectation of privacy in emails? Excellent!
    Duh. You're mixing governmental spying with private corporation policy. I assume you were taught authoritarianism and privacy were necessary - your aware you were lied to?
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  10. #40
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    Re: House libertarians blast USA Freedom Act

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    You're analogy would be correct if you're constantly collecting large sums of money from every American every day.
    No, it wouldn't. What a truly dizzying intellect.

    Did you just compare executive governmental powers to military promotions? What a truly dizzying intellect.
    I just pointed out something that's not explicitly in the constitution that the federal government does. You didn't get that. What a truly dizzying intellect.

    Duh. You're mixing governmental spying with private corporation policy. I assume you were taught authoritarianism and privacy were necessary - your aware you were lied to?
    You don't understand what the phrase expectation of privacy has to do with this, do you? What a truly dizzying intellect.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

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