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Thread: New York does away with Electoral College

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    Re: New York does away with Electoral College

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    We are no longer a federation of individual States and haven't been for a long long time.
    Wtf?
    The hell we aren't.


    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    We have been doing just that since the 1800's because Democracy makes more sense now than it did when the Constitution was written. Their really had not been any Democracies in the 1700's so the founders chose to use "safety nets" like the electoral college. We have long abandoned the choosing of Senators by State legislatures and the electoral college is not really functional in the way it was envisioned either. It's high time we swept away the last vestiges of the 18th century in our political system.
    Democracy, as in direct democracy, is seen as the same as it was then.
    Inherently flawed.
    Nor is it time to seep anything away.
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    Re: New York does away with Electoral College

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    We are a Republic.
    We were set up that way so their would not be any direct democracy.
    The Electoral College is neither outdated or irrational. It serves its purpose, which apparently idiots wish to undermine with such agreements.
    The delegates in the electoral college don't even have to vote the way the people want then to so it's not really a democracy or a Republic, but rather some oligarchical bastardization.

    Removing another layer between the citizens and the decision makers would be a great step for democracy and an accurate representation of our wants.
    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
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    Re: New York does away with Electoral College

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    The delegates in the electoral college don't even have to vote the way the people want then to so it's not really a democracy or a Republic, but rather some oligarchical bastardization.
    That is indirect.
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    Re: New York does away with Electoral College

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    That is indirect.
    So let me get this straight : when you look at the American political system you think "Man, this is perfect the way it is and the citizens are well represented by their politicians."?

    The rest of us see a major problem that needs fixing and doing the same thing but expecting different results is more optimistic than realist.
    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    I've got to say that it is shadenfreudalicious to see the rich and famous fucquewads on the coast suffering from the fires.

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    Re: New York does away with Electoral College

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    So let me get this straight : when you look at the American political system you think "Man, this is perfect the way it is and the citizens are well represented by their politicians."?
    Either you understand the separation between the governments involved, the Union as it was established and it's purpose, or you don't.
    I happen to see something that works as it is supposed to.
    In addition, I happen to think that indirect representation serves a better purpose than direct.


    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    The rest of us [...]
    The rest of us?

    No, a certain subset of the population sees such. Hardly any of them with a full understanding in the purpose of the EC, and many with just a dislike of the indirect nature of the Electoral College.
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    Re: New York does away with Electoral College

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Video @:[/FONT][/COLOR]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_35DiUNLZI
    More found @: New York joins campaign to end Electoral College role in presidential elections - NY Daily News

    Honestly, I think we should get rid of the electoral college. I believe it only makes sense. If we are a democracy, why not be a democracy that elects its highest leader? I mean it only makes sense.. I mean I know what some people are going to say, "hey we arent a democracy, we are a republic!". But you can be a republic and a democracy at the same time. The electoral college is outdated and irrational with our political climate and system.
    I think this agreement will hold up only so long as the participating states statewide elections match the popular vote. The next time the popular vote goes against NY state they will back out because the citizens of the state will rightly argue that they were not represented.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

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    Re: New York does away with Electoral College

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    One of the main reasons for the electoral college is because information traveled at the speed of horse in 1789. No accurate winner could be selected with any haste and the potential for mistakes was enormous. Putting the election in tiers (electoral district > state > nation) helped ensure an accurate result. In the age of telephones, computers, and the internet, there is no such need.

    The real effect of the electoral college is that presidents have to campaign for states, instead of campaigning for the entire nation. This is horrendously stupid. No single state's interests should hold such a large sway. And even worse, only a few state's interests end up having that sway. Presidents should be concerned with national issues, not state ones. And everyone's vote should count the same, not strengthened or weakened based on the completely fictional concern that large states vote homogeneously and can run the entire nation.
    It seems to me that the exact opposite is true.

    If we were to do away with the electoral college there would be no need for a candidate to go to places like Wisconsin, New Mexico, or Nevada.(aka swing states) Instead, the focus would shift towards large population centers and those places would then hold even more "sway" than they do now. The "effect" that you think would be negated by doing away with the electoral college would actually be magnified.

    And we should also stop pretending and just call this thing what it really is. It's partisan Democrats trying to gain an advantage. They know that by doing away with the electoral college they only need to focus their efforts on large urban centers... areas that they have historically done very well in anyway. While the Republicans would be busy trying to cover nearly every square inch of rural America, the Democrats could focus their efforts into a select few regions. It's a "bang for the buck" thing along the same lines as gerrymandering.

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    Re: New York does away with Electoral College

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    So we direclty elect our senators and representative but if we elect the POTUS, the oh Christ we are on our way to totalitarianism! Please Lutherf with our separation of power and checks and balances in place, please explain how you reach this conclusion...
    What i means is that your state no longer elects the president. It means another state elects the president. if you vote for your candidate you vote has no say whatsoever.
    the electorials are going to go to whoever wins the popular vote.

    so while the majority of people could vote for person A it won't matter if person B has more votes across the nation. it means that smaller states don't get a say at all.
    if we switched to a popular vote then CA, TX, PA, FL, NY decide who the president is because they contain >50% of the nations populations.
    so all i need to do is try and campaign in those states.

    This was a reason the that the electorial college was implimented to begin with. States in the south complained that they wouldn't get a voice or vote for president due to the heavily populated north.

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    Re: New York does away with Electoral College

    The electoral college isn't going anywhere. Any state that joins this compact can easily withdraw. When the majority in a state goes for candidate D and their electoral votes go to candidate R, there will be serious howling.

    There is still nothing to prevent faithless electors so put that in your pipe and smoke it.
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    Re: New York does away with Electoral College

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    I mean the founders were not perfect by anyway, why is it so shocking to get rid of something that is ineffective and outdated?
    What is ineffective about it?


    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post

    So if a POTUS is elected by popular vote that means "socialism is going to come!" I wish! In my dreams! In reality it means Al Gore would of been elected.. Ohh what a "socialist!" Get ****ing real!
    Direct democracy is mob rule, which is fine and dandy if you happen to be in the mob. If you're not a member of the majority mob, then you are essentially ****ed. The system we have was formed to prevent the mob from ruling, and that is a desirable thing. Mob mentality is ugly, and mob power is even worse.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
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