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Thread: CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

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    Re: CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    We won't know what he knows, until we smack him around a little.
    That is the point.

    Since you do not know whether he knows or not you are risking persecution by the Geneva convention all the while the person may tell you whatever you want to hear just to stop you from smacking him. It is risking persecution on a wild guess.
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    Re: CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

    I personally find it nauseating that anyone who claims to be an American justifies torture and other human rights atrocities. That's the mentality of mentally deranged neanderthals. And unfortunately, it's also the mentality of many in our hijacked government, all 3 branches.

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    Re: CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by DDD View Post
    That is the point.

    Since you do not know whether he knows or not you are risking persecution by the Geneva convention all the while the person may tell you whatever you want to hear just to stop you from smacking him. It is risking persecution on a wild guess.
    You exhibit your lack of knowledge of both the GC and interrogation techniques.

    The GC prohibits ANY coersion. Literally anything more than asking questions is illegal according to the GC.

    Second, physical violence is always the last resort. There are other approaches that you want to attempt first.

    And sure, the prisoner can lie, which is why you verify the information he gives you and if he is lying, you punish him for it.

    "Torture", is thousands of years old. Its been perfected. If it was really as ineffective as some folks like to claim, it would have stopped being used centuries ago.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob0627 View Post
    I personally find it nauseating that anyone who claims to be an American justifies torture and other human rights atrocities. That's the mentality of mentally deranged neanderthals. And unfortunately, it's also the mentality of many in our hijacked government, all 3 branches.
    I find it nauseating that someone would put the welfare of a terrorist ahead of the lives of his countrymen.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I find it nauseating that someone would put the welfare of a terrorist ahead of the lives of his countrymen.
    I agree but that doesn't justify committing torture or any other human rights atrocity. Torture ALWAYS involves committing an atrocity on an innocent person. Why? Because as an American, one espouses the common law ideology that a person is innocent unless and until proven guilty by a proper court. Those who don't agree with that basic American concept are not real Americans.

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    Re: CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Nothing is 100%
    Yet our constitution is based on the notion of innocent until proven guilty. Torture assumes guilty until proven innocent (if extremely lucky) or dead.

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    Re: CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by Jango View Post
    I don't get why people continually dog the C.I.A. and U.S. for having previously used torture when there are plenty of other offenders that seemingly skate by without a single condemnation.

    Russia, Libya, Syria, China (who also has slaves), Brazil, India (who also has slaves), Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iran, North Korea, South Africa, Saudi Arabia, Israel, Iraq, Lebanon, Ethiopia, Mexico, Philippines…

    They *all* torture, and there are *more* that can be listed. Where's the outrage?
    I have been a member of Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch and the ACLU for decades because I and the other members of those groups do not tolerate torture and we are willing to put money and effort behind our principals.

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    Re: CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

    Here's the outrage and a chance to do something:
    "Our strength lies in collective action. With over 3 million Amnesty members and supporters, we help individuals around the world whose human rights are being violated.

    Here are 10 ways you can make a difference:

    1.Take action right now! With so many issues happening all around the world, sign a petition on one of the many human rights issues facing our communities around the world.

    2.Attend an event. Events are a great way to get to educate yourself and others about human rights and meet other like minded people in your community who want to take action together.

    3.Become a member. We are a movement of people. Each time a new person joins, Amnesty’s light shines brighter on the injustices occurring at different places around the world. Join today.

    4.Donate. Your gift helps keep our movement free from corporate influence and independent from government agendas. Donate now!

    5.Volunteer. Our network of volunteers have the chance to try almost anything—from phone banking, writing letters and organizing a group to responding to a crisis, leading a lobby effort or carrying out our campaigns—we invite you to explore the diverse volunteer opportunities available to you around the country.

    6.Join a Group. Together, the members of our groups take action, reach out to new communities and educate the public about how they can make human rights a reality for all.

    7.Follow a Campaign. Are you passionate about a certain issue? Join a network of activists around the country who are using campaigns to teach communities about torture, abolition of the death penalty, ending poverty and more.

    8.Shop for a Cause. At our online store you can shop t-shirts and a variety of gifts with a purpose.

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    10.Partner with us. Through collaborations, partnerships and collective action, we can improve the state of human rights here and abroad. If you represent a university, association or agency, explore the ways you can support Amnesty International."
    Get Involved for Human Rights | Amnesty International USA

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    Re: CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    .."Torture", is thousands of years old. Its been perfected. If it was really as ineffective as some folks like to claim, it would have stopped being used centuries ago.
    1. Many experienced professionals in the business of obtaining information from suspects etc. disagree with the claim that torture is effective.

    2. Torture continues because people enjoy it, it creates the impression that something is being done, it is a way to express anger and hatred, and it is a form of terrorism against opponents.

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    Re: CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

    Quote Originally Posted by Jango View Post
    I don't get why people continually dog the C.I.A. and U.S. for having previously used torture when there are plenty of other offenders that seemingly skate by without a single condemnation.

    Russia, Libya, Syria, China (who also has slaves), Brazil, India (who also has slaves), Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iran, North Korea, South Africa, Saudi Arabia, Israel, Iraq, Lebanon, Ethiopia, Mexico, Philippines…

    They *all* torture, and there are *more* that can be listed. Where's the outrage?
    Your point is valid, but the outrage comes from the hypocrisy involved, at least as much as against the crimes themselves. The US lectures the rest of the world about human rights violations, imposes sanctions and otherwise pounds its chest, when the reality is that the US had the best organized torture system that the world has ever seen. Subjects being flown here and there in Gulfstreams is pretty damn sophisticated IMO. Broad daylight captures on the streets of Italy is pretty bold, eh?

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