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CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

Hicup said:
Oh no don't get me wrong we should certainly privatize the whole torture thing, but since no one is clamoring for privatization I have to work with what I got. ;)

Tim-
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Yeah, because out of control government has never backfired on a people :roll:
 
Ikari said:
Yeah, because out of control government has never backfired on a people :roll:
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Out of control? What, torturing bad guys is out of control, and leads to government torturing good Americans? They get away with it precisely because the vast majority of American's actually like the idea of killing the bad guys. If there's a little information gathering in the process, it's not enough to turn most American's or for that matter western culture's attitudes against it. If it were otherwise, regardless of what average American's thought, if I were in charge, I'd continue, JUST LIKE WE STILL ARE!


Tim-
 
ecofarm said:
That does not qualify as verifiable information.
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Then perhaps you could explain what it is you think "verifiable information" means, exactly? Thanks!
 
Hicup said:
Out of control? What, torturing bad guys is out of control, and leads to government torturing good Americans?
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If they break rules, they break rules. What makes you think they'll mind the rules for you once they've demonstrated willingness to ignore them?
 
DaveFagan said:
Let's just eliminate the CIA, just like flushing the toilet. Problem solved. It appeared that when Jimmy Carter tried to shut them down, they sold out to the Saudis. You know, got the Saudis to pay the bills. Now, who would that imply loyalty to?
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Who's going to conduct spy operations?
 
tlmorg02 said:
The CIA should not be engaged in torture because it tarnishes the US image abroad and undermines our proclaimed values. Such actions have contributed to the diminishing of US influence in the world and give ammunition to dictators and tyrants, who are then able to say "well the US does it, how can they condemn us for it."

The United States must not engage in torture. We must reclaim our values of supporting human rights and liberty across the globe and not being hypocritical in how we deal with the international community. Enough with the "do as we say, not as we do."
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Besides that, too many people enjoy torturing their enemies and it quickly gets out of hand with more and more people getting tortured and the severity increasing. (ask the Argentinians)
 
ecofarm said:
I have logic and reason. When the answer is checked and not true, the torture gets worse. Eventually, the real answer comes out.

Claims of torture not working are regarding confessions, not verifiable information.
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In many cases the facts can not be checked promptly.
 
Binary_Digit said:
Then perhaps you could explain what it is you think "verifiable information" means, exactly? Thanks!
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Information that can be verified. Not information that we will find out, some day, if it's true.

You know, verify it and, if not true, up the discomfort. For example: the location of a bomb.
 
Hicup said:
Out of control? What, torturing bad guys is out of control, and leads to government torturing good Americans? They get away with it precisely because the vast majority of American's actually like the idea of killing the bad guys. If there's a little information gathering in the process, it's not enough to turn most American's or for that matter western culture's attitudes against it. If it were otherwise, regardless of what average American's thought, if I were in charge, I'd continue, JUST LIKE WE STILL ARE!


Tim-
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You are wrongly assuming that the torture victims are all guilty "bad guys."
 
Hicup said:
LOL, the CIA's "code" is only for feel good types like maybe you. The CIA is tasked with the responsibility of protecting American interests, and learning about potential danger, and every American President likes that idea, and secretly doesn't give a damn about how they go about doing it. Sure they'd like to keep the gory details from the American people and people like you, but that's because those who enjoy freedom and yet forget how we keep it that way are often uncomfortable with the knowledge that we actually do bite down hard every once in a while, and that people like me are under no illusions that we need to bite really hard, and IMO we need to do it more often.

If we gain actionable intelligence, great. If not, so what!

Tim-
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so why do you ignore the fact that the CIA ignored USA, and its own rules?
 
 
Here we see a plain gift of how the Democratic Party roles. Treat someone harshly in defense of our nation and we spend $44 million tax dollars documenting and criticizing. Get an ambassador killed, three fine other Americans, and lie about it without even an apology or single termination of employment.....


TheDemSocialist said:
Read more @: [/FONT][/COLOR]CIA's 'Harsh Interrogations' Exceeded Legal Authority, Report Finds

Criminals. Thats what they are, plain and simple. The CIA is filled of many criminals. War criminals. Torture. Lying to the American public, hell even to themselves.
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CalGun said:
Here we see a plain gift of how the Democratic Party roles. Treat someone harshly in defense of our nation and we spend $44 million tax dollars documenting and criticizing. Get an ambassador killed, three fine other Americans, and lie about it without even an apology or single termination of employment.....
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Uhh what in the flying **** are you talking about. This happened under the Bush administration. What the **** are you talking about?
 
Hicup said:
Who cares? It could work, and I'm pretty sure I could get information from just about anyone, but in the event it doesn't, so what? One less bad guy to worry about.


Tim-
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So in other words, it's less about getting information and more about revenge.

The U.S. position to not engage in torture is not intended to protect the humanity of those on the receiving end, it's to protect ours. Or are you saying that you have no problem with us sinking to their level?
 
CalGun said:
Here we see a plain gift of how the Democratic Party roles. Treat someone harshly in defense of our nation and we spend $44 million tax dollars documenting and criticizing. Get an ambassador killed, three fine other Americans, and lie about it without even an apology or single termination of employment.....
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The Democratic Party "got an ambassador killed"? That's an interesting spin on Benghazi.
 
 
ecofarm said:
Torture always works when done for verifiable information, as opposed to confession.
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If the information is already verified then you do not need torture. If you have a hunch and want the suspect to admit it then you are asking for confession. Under torture people can say/confess whatever you want. Thereby it does not work.
 
ecofarm said:
I have logic and reason. When the answer is checked and not true, the torture gets worse. Eventually, the real answer comes out.

Claims of torture not working are regarding confessions, not verifiable information.
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Assuming that one knows anything. What if they do not? They will tell you what you need to hear even though it ma bring them demise.
 
ecofarm said:
Information that can be verified. Not information that we will find out, some day, if it's true.

You know, verify it and, if not true, up the discomfort. For example: the location of a bomb.
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Again you assume that the suspect knows where the bomb is. If they do not and would speak of a place just to stop torture you could verify it and come back to some more torture for no good reason.
 
Plus the Geneva Convention was set up for a reason you know.
 
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