"The end of democracy and the defeat of the American Revolution will occur when government falls into the hands of lending institutions and moneyed incorporations." `Thomas Jefferson
It takes but a minute to find DOZENS of Faith-based funds to invest in. Even the secular 'Business Week' discusses the Faith Based mutual funds. Difficult to believe the supposedly very devout Leadership of Hobby Lobby was so unaware of the alternative to secular funds. It would be a strange 'job creator' who doesn't keep a sharp eye to investment strategies...
So the CON game continues. It appears the Leadership of Hobby Lobby has ZERO problems with MAKING money from non Christian sources- it is only when it comes to SPENDING money to care of it's employees when the Good Book is held high.
This continues to be the mantra of rightiecons lately on dp, attack the web-site with as much vitriol as the actual political position.
Didn't Romney have this problem with dispensers of Aborted fetuses?
I found that terribly disgusting, considering his flip-flop on the issue from being "left" of Sen. Kennedy .
Chemists Have Solutions .
401(k) are accounts held by the employee, not the employer. Individuals make contributions and in some cases the company will make some type of match (usually not that much in the grand scheme of things but every little bit helps). Even if match does occur, that amount goes to the employee who then selects from the available list of funds which they should chose based on the need for diversity and their individual risk assessment.
Hobby Lobby doesn't own those accounts - the individual employees do.
Hobby Lobby isn't selecting the fund profile - the individual employees do.
Hobby Lobby doesn't select the portfolio investments - the Fund managers in the investment firm do.
This is a little different then Hobby Lobby paying (directly) the bulk of an insurance premiums.
An employer makes arrangements with a fund management company, in my case it's ING. My money is deducted from my paycheck through an automatic deduction. That money is transferred from me to ING and deposited in my account where ING they distributes it into the mutual funds that I as an individual have selected.
☮★★☮ Just a democratic-socialist in the heartland of America.CHECK OUT MY TUMBLR(BLOG)HERE "Life is beautiful. Let the future generations cleanse it of all evil, oppression, and violence, and enjoy it to the full."
The premise of this thread may well be the most ridiculous overreach I have seen on this site (note that I don't frequent the conspiracy forum).
29 CFR 2550.404c-5 covers the requirements for funds a 401(k) can be invested in. While the reg doesn't specify particular financial instruments it does require 'pooled funds' and also requires diversified investment managed in such a way as to minimize risk. It would be INCREDIBLY difficult for a fund manager to fulfill the obligations of this regulation without investing in certain instruments that are, in turn, invested in some form of medical research or manufacturing.
For these reasons it behooves an employer to hire a management firm to handle their 401(k). The employer will generally not interfere with the fund manager because to do so might create a violation of the aforementioned regulation.
Furthermore, the employer is not allowed to direct the employee's investment choices but is (if they provide matching funds) required to meet their contribution requirements as defined by the written agreement. If the employee opts for a fund that is partially invested in medical and pharmaceutical businesses (as many funds are) then they have no choice but to match those contributions.
Finally, when the employer (or you) buy the stock of a pharmaceutical corporation you ARE NOT making a cash payment to that corporation. All you are doing is purchasing the right to a certain percentage of the equity in that corporation. In some cases you might have voting rights but that's about it.
a 401(k) is PROVIDED by the EMPLOYER sometimes with a match fund. a Health care plan is PROVIDED by the EMPLOYER. The EMPLOYER offers the plans in BOTH cases to pick from. There are many 'Faith Based' companies that offer 'Blessed' funds for the employee to select from for retirement. In Hobby Lobby's case they wouldn't use ING as the fund account company. Your attempt to claim otherwise is false. The EMPLOYER selects the company from which funds are made available to the employee- not the other way round. The family that runs Hobby Lobby are employees as well... both directly as 401(K) holders and as employers using the 401(K) as a hiring tool benefit- they profit from the 401(K). I can't imagine the folks running Hobby Lobby failing to do their religious homework on 401(K)s but so strict on the tiny amount of money going to BC compared to everything else covered by the healthcare plan.
To use your CONvoluted 'logic' Hobby Lobby's contribution to the Healthcare care plan has a fractional amount of their profits POTENTIALLY for use in Birth Control and CONTRACEPTION (it seems the Religious Right is trying to throw the baby out with the bathwater), just like a fractional amount of their profit gets diverted to help invest in Big Pharma companies making so E-Vile a product that a huge percentage of American women are quite alright with.
But like I said, one is Mammon coming in and one is it going out...
You are contending that Hobby Lobby should be aware of what funds the 401(k) offers and, based on their principles, opt out of those funds or else they're hypocrites.
Every April I send the IRS a check that goes to fund a whole bunch of crap I would like to opt out of so am I also a hypocrite for funding Planned Parenthood through my taxes? Should I be eligible to make a discretionary adjustment to my tax payment to avoid funding an organization I dislike?
Last edited by Lutherf; 04-01-14 at 08:48 PM.