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Thread: Retiring NSA chief doesn't understand why people hate the NSA

  1. #21
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    Re: Retiring NSA chief doesn't understand why people hate the NSA

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    Too bad. Frankly you're not informed enough to have an intelligent opinion on national defense, but I do enjoy your taxes paying for my mortgage and car note!
    I'm sure you do. Oppressors love taking things that aren't theirs for their own.

    Frankly, I doubt your informed enough to have an intelligent opinion on national defense. Since your mortgage and car note are tied into this, there is considerable interest in maintaining the process regardless of effect or morality. So someone like you I'd expect to argue as much as possible to keep it up because it's your bread and butter. Biased source, never have you given any rational argument nor proof to the legitimacy and efficiency of the system you support. Such a lazy method of argument. Which would seem to contradict your early statement as well. Hahahah
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Retiring NSA chief doesn't understand why people hate the NSA

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Just so you know, it's people like you that make people hate the government.
    Not only that, but the very essence of their argument is dishonest. It's the China argument. Essentially they will say we don't have the information to make an informed decision, but they also won't give us the information to make an informed decision. They keep everything cloaked, pretending the information is for them and them alone and oh how terrible it would be for us to know what they are doing. They are essentially trying to rig the system to force ignorance upon us and then claim that because we're ignorant we shouldn't be saying anything. It's the Catch 22, and a sign of an oppressive government.

    Too bad some on that side do not have the intelligence to recognize this.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Retiring NSA chief doesn't understand why people hate the NSA

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Just so you know, it's people like you that make people hate the government.
    Okay? What are you going to do about it? If you had an intelligent, valid argument you could sway actual decision/policy makers to your side. But you don't. So...that's that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jango View Post
    I don't hate or dislike the N.S.A. They do serve a vitally important role for the U.S. government, however, I do disagree with the vacuuming up of ALL American data. While some American's data SHOULD be collected (like the Aryan Brotherhood, Bloods & Crypts and Mexican Mafia, among others) but I don't understand why non-criminals and the sort deserve to have their data collected and scrutinized.
    The data wasn't being scrutinized, though. They just kept the metadata, for later scrutinization in the event of something happened.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I'm sure you do. Oppressors love taking things that aren't theirs for their own.
    Awwww, he's so oppressed, everyone!

    Frankly, I doubt your informed enough to have an intelligent opinion on national defense.
    Okay, well I have a Master's Degree in International Relations, ten years in the Army, and nearly 13 now in intelligence. What would your credentials be?

    Since your mortgage and car note are tied into this, there is considerable interest in maintaining the process regardless of effect or morality.
    I don't care about morality. It's all subjective.

    So someone like you I'd expect to argue as much as possible to keep it up because it's your bread and butter. Biased source, never have you given any rational argument nor proof to the legitimacy and efficiency of the system you support. Such a lazy method of argument. Which would seem to contradict your early statement as well. Hahahah
    Ahhh, of course! Anyone with any experience in the field is biased! The real impartial experts are they people with no knowledge or experience of how intelligence works who are virulently anti-government! loool

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Not only that, but the very essence of their argument is dishonest. It's the China argument. Essentially they will say we don't have the information to make an informed decision, but they also won't give us the information to make an informed decision. They keep everything cloaked, pretending the information is for them and them alone and oh how terrible it would be for us to know what they are doing. They are essentially trying to rig the system to force ignorance upon us and then claim that because we're ignorant we shouldn't be saying anything. It's the Catch 22, and a sign of an oppressive government.

    Too bad some on that side do not have the intelligence to recognize this.
    YOU DON'T MAKE ANY DECISIONS!!! This isn't a direct democracy. You vote on representatives who will have the information, and they make an informed decision. Not you. This is American government 101. You're a so-call "patriot" and you didn't know that? You're not going to be told much, if anything. That's it. Deal with it, dude. I'm having Thai delivered tonight, thanks for helping fund my dinner.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

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    Re: Retiring NSA chief doesn't understand why people hate the NSA

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    Okay? What are you going to do about it? If you had an intelligent, valid argument you could sway actual decision/policy makers to your side. But you don't. So...that's that.



    The data wasn't being scrutinized, though. They just kept the metadata, for later scrutinization in the event of something happened.



    Awwww, he's so oppressed, everyone!



    Okay, well I have a Master's Degree in International Relations, ten years in the Army, and nearly 13 now in intelligence. What would your credentials be?



    I don't care about morality. It's all subjective.



    Ahhh, of course! Anyone with any experience in the field is biased! The real impartial experts are they people with no knowledge or experience of how intelligence works who are virulently anti-government! loool



    YOU DON'T MAKE ANY DECISIONS!!! This isn't a direct democracy. You vote on representatives who will have the information, and they make an informed decision. Not you. This is American government 101. You're a so-call "patriot" and you didn't know that? You're not going to be told much, if anything. That's it. Deal with it, dude. I'm having Thai delivered tonight, thanks for helping fund my dinner.
    Funny how despots history renowned sound so similar to you.

    What have you done? What have you "protected me from"? What are the policies, what is being collected, how has this aggregation brought me anymore peace and safety? How are you ensuring that you are not trampling my rights in the process?

    Can you answer? Likely not. But I'm supposed to "trust" you. Is that it? Trust you, you know what you're doing because you can list off a few things and pretend that it means that what you are doing is justified and just. I don't care of your credentials, you are biased source fighting for your bread. Prove it with numbers, with facts, with information. Otherwise, it's just your words, and words are wind. Proof or GTFO.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Retiring NSA chief doesn't understand why people hate the NSA

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Funny how despots history renowned sound so similar to you.
    lol? What do you think you sound like?

    What have you done? What have you "protected me from"? What are the policies, what is being collected, how has this aggregation brought me anymore peace and safety?
    Oh lots of stuff. People like me stopped the guy trying to blow up the van in Times Square, for example. Planned attacks on nuclear power plants. Hijackings. Do you think every attack against US interests is successful? You can't even fathom that there are many attacks thwarted for every one that isn't stopped? Really?

    How are you ensuring that you are not trampling my rights in the process?
    With overly complicated levels upon levels of oversight, the threat of federal prison, and hours upon hours of annual compliance training that I have to do instead of my job.

    Can you answer?
    Yeah. See. Look up. It's right about your question asking if I can answer.

    Likely not.
    It's a good thing you're not a betting man, eh?

    But I'm supposed to "trust" you. Is that it?
    lol no. I don't care. You're not a decision or policy maker. Trust me, don't trust me...I don't care. Makes no difference to me aside from the humor factor.

    Trust you, you know what you're doing because you can list off a few things and pretend that it means that what you are doing is justified and just. I don't care of your credentials, you are biased source fighting for your bread. Prove it with numbers, with facts, with information. Otherwise, it's just your words, and words are wind. Proof or GTFO.
    GTFO? I don't need to. I'm not whining and asking for change. I'm a fan of the way it is. You're...not? I guess? Who cares? You're not important. So it'll just continue on, while you pout about it. Ooooh the Thai is only like 10 minutes away, I think!
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

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    Re: Retiring NSA chief doesn't understand why people hate the NSA

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    lol? What do you think you sound like?



    Oh lots of stuff. People like me stopped the guy trying to blow up the van in Times Square, for example. Planned attacks on nuclear power plants. Hijackings. Do you think every attack against US interests is successful? You can't even fathom that there are many attacks thwarted for every one that isn't stopped? Really?



    With overly complicated levels upon levels of oversight, the threat of federal prison, and hours upon hours of annual compliance training that I have to do instead of my job.



    Yeah. See. Look up. It's right about your question asking if I can answer.



    It's a good thing you're not a betting man, eh?



    lol no. I don't care. You're not a decision or policy maker. Trust me, don't trust me...I don't care. Makes no difference to me aside from the humor factor.



    GTFO? I don't need to. I'm not whining and asking for change. I'm a fan of the way it is. You're...not? I guess? Who cares? You're not important. So it'll just continue on, while you pout about it. Ooooh the Thai is only like 10 minutes away, I think!
    So...you have any evidence that any of that happened? Or are these just claims of a government employee trying to justify his job?

    As I said, prove it with numbers, with facts, with information. Otherwise, it's just your words, and words are wind. Proof or GTFO.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Retiring NSA chief doesn't understand why people hate the NSA

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    So...you have any evidence that any of that happened? Or are these just claims of a government employee trying to justify his job?

    As I said, prove it with numbers, with facts, with information. Otherwise, it's just your words, and words are wind. Proof or GTFO.
    lol what? You don't think a guy tried to blow up a van in Times Square? Ooookay.

    Thankfully, you don't matter. Cause...whew...we'd be in trouble.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

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    Re: Retiring NSA chief doesn't understand why people hate the NSA

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    lol what? You don't think a guy tried to blow up a van in Times Square? Ooookay.

    Thankfully, you don't matter. Cause...whew...we'd be in trouble.
    Do you have evidence of it? Some proof? Or am I only to accept your word that this happened. And that's what, 1? 1 case (if that, since you haven't actually demonstrated this) out of...what? How much information are you collecting, how much spying are you engaging in. And we got 1. I'm not sure that this is a good return on investment.

    Prove it with numbers, with facts, with information. Otherwise, it's just your words, and words are wind. Proof or GTFO.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  9. #29
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    Re: Retiring NSA chief doesn't understand why people hate the NSA

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Do you have evidence of it? Some proof? Or am I only to accept your word that this happened.
    Uhhh? What? Kinda common knowledge, dude: 2010 Times Square car bombing attempt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    And that's what, 1?
    2010 Portland car bomb plot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Hudson River bomb plot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    There's many more. But...you don't know about them. So to you it's not important. Again: uninformed.

    1 case (if that, since you haven't actually demonstrated this) out of...what? How much information are you collecting, how much spying are you engaging in.
    You don't get to know. Sorry.

    And we got 1. I'm not sure that this is a good return on investment.
    Well, this is why I said you're uninformed. You just...proved it. You don't know. That's fine, you don't need to. So...that's that.

    Prove it with numbers, with facts, with information. Otherwise, it's just your words, and words are wind. Proof or GTFO.
    I don't need to. You're not a decision maker. You don't matter. Thai's here!
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

  10. #30
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    Re: Retiring NSA chief doesn't understand why people hate the NSA

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    Uhhh? What? Kinda common knowledge, dude: 2010 Times Square car bombing attempt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



    2010 Portland car bomb plot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Hudson River bomb plot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    There's many more. But...you don't know about them. So to you it's not important. Again: uninformed.



    You don't get to know. Sorry.



    Well, this is why I said you're uninformed. You just...proved it. You don't know. That's fine, you don't need to. So...that's that.



    I don't need to. You're not a decision maker. You don't matter. Thai's here!
    Let's say that these are all true and attributable solely to the expansion of data collection (which is not demonstrated in any of your links, we had a system before and perhaps that system would have also gotten this, so you still have no PROOF that you're doing anything substantial other than spying on everyone, but I'm sure someone of your credentials knows all about statistics and proof) and massive spying against the American People. That's what.....3? 3 given how much? How much bigger is government, how much more are you spying, how much data is collected and sorted. 3 out of what?

    I fear you're trying to hide an embarrisingly low percentage. Which is why I say (yet again) prove it with numbers, with facts, with information. Otherwise, it's just your words, and words are wind. Proof or GTFO. You have provided no evidence nor proof of the efficiency and legitimacy of these massive "Paper's Please" policies.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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