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Thread: Fischer: God ‘designed’ women to be secretaries so it’s OK to discriminate on gender

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    You've called my attention to a rather vital point that I have missed.

    Mr. Contrarian does not seem to make a distinction between the free market determining how a business may fail or succeed by offering or failing to offer what its customers want; and government arbitrarily imposing a gratuitous and irrelevant restriction and dictating that one must submit to that restriction—even where it violates one's moral and ethical values—as a condition of being allowed to run a business.
    That is the main point that many of us have been making over several thread in regards to various specific actions. The best part is that I would guess about 90% or more of us that make the argument would not frequent the stores that use such discriminatory practices and might even actively protest them even while we fight to maintain their right to perform said practices.
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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    How nice of you to decide how other's religions work. By my choice of religion, I am not allowed to work magic (your personal belief in the existence or non-existence of magic is irrelevant). However, I have no issue if others wish to work magic, or even work it on my behalf. Since I hold respect for their religion, even as I do not accept it, I am doing nothing towards them committing sins. For their religion it is not a sin, and if indeed mine is the true religion then they are already far gone past simple spellcraft. That is how my religion works, and if you feel otherwise, that is your problem.
    Then you don't know your own religion, then...because to help others to do what you believe to be a sin is a sin in and of itself.
    “To do evil, a human being must first of all believe that what he’s doing is good" - Solzhenitsyn

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    You've called my attention to a rather vital point that I have missed.

    Mr. Contrarian does not seem to make a distinction between the free market determining how a business may fail or succeed by offering or failing to offer what its customers want; and government arbitrarily imposing a gratuitous and irrelevant restriction and dictating that one must submit to that restriction—even where it violates one's moral and ethical values—as a condition of being allowed to run a business.
    If the government decides that a regulation or a law is necessary to preserve the health and/or general welfare of the public, there's no requirement that the government must make special allowances for every religion that comes along.
    “To do evil, a human being must first of all believe that what he’s doing is good" - Solzhenitsyn

    "...with the terrorists, you have to take out their families." - Donald Trump

  4. #164
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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    Then you don't know your own religion, then…
    Perhaps you should leave it to someone who is a practicing member of a religion about which you obviously know nothing at all, to say what that religion does or does not expect of its members.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    Then you don't know your own religion, then...because to help others to do what you believe to be a sin is a sin in and of itself.
    You see right there is your problem. You don't get to tell me how my religion works. You can tell me how yours works and that's fine. You can say that mine doesn't make sense to you, and that is also fine. But you don't get to set the rules of my religion. Now if I were to claim a specific organized denomination/movement such as United Methodist or Neolog, you would have more of an argument. But sadly for you I don't claim one. Welcome to America where there is religious freedom and one can worship God or the Goddess or Zeus or Thor or whomever, singularly or as a pantheon, as they wish. We are allowed to hold our own relationship with our deity and not go against our conscious because some other human claims to know the word of our deity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    If the government decides that a regulation or a law is necessary to preserve the health and/or general welfare of the public, there's no requirement that the government must make special allowances for every religion that comes along.
    Yet it cannot be shown where forcing a business owner, either as a direct proprietor or the collective ownership of a corporation (which could still be an individual), to offer something that is already being freely offered by others, is preserving health and/or general welfare of the public.
    Bi, Poly, Switch. I'm not indecisive, I'm greedy!

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    Perhaps you should leave it to someone who is a practicing member of a religion about which you obviously know nothing at all, to say what that religion does or does not expect of its members.
    Guy, there's many, many examples of people not knowing everything that their own religion preaches...and you appear to be one such example. For instance, how many Catholics realize that their own religion admits that Baal was part of a trinity?

    While you obviously know more about Mormonism than I do, that does not mean that you know everything about Mormonism that I do.
    “To do evil, a human being must first of all believe that what he’s doing is good" - Solzhenitsyn

    "...with the terrorists, you have to take out their families." - Donald Trump

  7. #167
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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    You see right there is your problem. You don't get to tell me how my religion works. You can tell me how yours works and that's fine. You can say that mine doesn't make sense to you, and that is also fine. But you don't get to set the rules of my religion. Now if I were to claim a specific organized denomination/movement such as United Methodist or Neolog, you would have more of an argument. But sadly for you I don't claim one. Welcome to America where there is religious freedom and one can worship God or the Goddess or Zeus or Thor or whomever, singularly or as a pantheon, as they wish. We are allowed to hold our own relationship with our deity and not go against our conscious because some other human claims to know the word of our deity.



    Yet it cannot be shown where forcing a business owner, either as a direct proprietor or the collective ownership of a corporation (which could still be an individual), to offer something that is already being freely offered by others, is preserving health and/or general welfare of the public.
    Guy, I'm not setting the rules of your religion. I'm simply pointing out that I'm pretty doggone sure that if a Mormon truly believes that drinking alcohol, coffee, or tea (and perhaps soda, too - I'm not sure of your beliefs on that one) is a sin, then it is a sin to serve such to others.

    If you'll remember, part of Mormon belief is that there is no conflict between the Bible and the book of Mormon, and it would be pretty hard to find a preacher of any religion that claims to be Christian who would think that if doing a thing is a sin, that it somehow wouldn't be a sin to help enable others to commit that sin.
    “To do evil, a human being must first of all believe that what he’s doing is good" - Solzhenitsyn

    "...with the terrorists, you have to take out their families." - Donald Trump

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Article 4, Section 2 is more supreme than "original sinners" without a morals test regardless of any drug tests.

    The citizens of each state shall be entitled to all privileges and immunities of citizens in the several states.

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    While you obviously know more about Mormonism than I do, that does not mean that you know everything about Mormonism that I do.
    Given how obvious it is that you know nearly nothing about Mormonism that is correct, I think it is safe to claim that you do not, in fact, know anything about Mormonism that is true and that is not known to me or to nearly every other actual Mormon.

    You only make yourself look all the more foolish and dishonest by trying to claim any expertise on this subject.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  10. #170
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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    If the government decides that a regulation or a law is necessary to preserve the health and/or general welfare of the public, there's no requirement that the government must make special allowances for every religion that comes along.
    This is fair enough.

    However, from a strictly theological view, you have already indicated that religion must be subordinate to the state. Having to meet in secret is acceptable to attend church.

    This has never been the American political tradition though. Respecting the religious differences amongst the population, and accommodating for them when possible has been the tradition.

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