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Thread: Fischer: God ‘designed’ women to be secretaries so it’s OK to discriminate on gender

  1. #91
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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    L
    eaving out the first clause of the amendment does not a compelling argument make.

    Exempting the law to accommodate one groups dogmatic conviction over the dogmatic convictions of all others is tantamount to the establishment of a state condoned religious dogma and applying said dogma to those who do not hold those convictions.
    Except, yet again, there is no "dogma" being applied by Hobby Lobby (or for that matter, those Conestoga folks).

    However, based upon some of the comments made by other posters in this thread, there is a definite anti-religion dogma attempted to be pushed down upon HL & Co.

  2. #92
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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    It would be really cool if Christians ever actually lived up to that ideal, but they kinda never do. But no, it's not Christian morality. It's much older than that. It's human morality. It's the original human morality for us all to help each other and not succumb to avarice. It predates faith and religion, too. Religion is just a bad method for transmitting otherwise sensible morality or economics. It just muddies the water, because there's weird superstition and dogma involved, and really easy appeals to authority that people abuse really easily. Take out the gods and magic and there's no room for people to claim that the gods told them this or that or ordained them to rule everyone else.
    Well, I will have to disagree with that. It seems to me that basic evolutionary biology supports the idea of survival and natural selection. There is the Hamiltonian evolution idea about helping other people who are like you as that aids in your individual survival. But it seems to me that all morality and thoughts of social justice are simply religiously based and should not be used by an objective society. If people can't pull their weight they are of no use and hurt the group, objectively. They should just be allowed to live or die as they are able.
    Contrary to what so many think in our Judeo-Christian culture, religion does not have to have a god or mystical beliefs-it must only contain elements that are based on faith and can not be objectified. Unitarianism, Buddhism, Confuscianism, etc. are considered religions without any belief in god or magic.
    When you say that helping others predate religions I wonder why no other religion is as concerned about the poor as Christianity. Moslems are content with 2.5% going to charity. Buddhists think that it is karma and if a person is poor it has something to do with karma in a previous life and therefore has some responsibility. Hindus tend to believe that money is rather unimportant in the issues of life and other things have priority. But the Bible tells people to help the poor, that the wealthy die and go to hell while the poor go to heaven, and that the fisherman should give 50% of his catch to the poor. The most religious countries in Europe are precisely the countries that are suffering from an overly charitable social welfare network, PIIGS (Portugal, Italy, Ireland, Greece, and Spain). All Christian. The Germanic and Nordic countries tend to be more objective and expect people to work.
    A country should not put its people at risk subsidizing the undeserving-that is a religious idea that has no place in objective society.

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyO View Post
    Sure it was.
    Then it would be easy for you to quote it.

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyO View Post
    I am sorry Glen, there is simply no way in the world that the First Amendment takes such a hostile view of religion.
    This is what happens when those on the far wrong are allowed to “interpret” the Constitution. Compare to their treatment of the Second, Fourth, Fifth, and Tenth Amendments. What was clearly written to protect the people from an overbearing, out-of-control government, becomes the excuse for the very abuses that were intended to be forbidden.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    Then it would be easy for you to quote it.
    Its easier to direct you to the posts-- on this thread:

    #'s 3, 23, 31, 43, 51,62, 65 (especially), 78, 79,82 and 87.
    They all argued, in varying ways, that free exercise of religion is what happens on Sunday in church, saturday in a temple and Friday in a mosque.

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyO View Post
    Its easier to direct you to the posts-- on this thread:

    #'s 3, 23, 31, 43, 51,62, 65 (especially), 78, 79,82 and 87.
    They all argued, in varying ways, that free exercise of religion is what happens on Sunday in church, saturday in a temple and Friday in a mosque.
    Post #3

    The argument that destroys the "religious rights" claim is that if one will check these religious groups or families who own these businesses, NONE of their religions require them to open businesses...so having a business is not a requirement, but a SECULAR OPTION. If they open businesses, since those businesses are not a part of their religion, then they have a duty to run those businesses in accordance with the laws of the state and the nation.

    What's more, what if their 'religion' says "thou shalt not allow blacks to enter your place of business"? If a black person then enters their place of business, then the owners would call the police to evict the black guy for the crime of being black...and at that moment we once more have government-ENFORCED racial discrimination.
    Post # 23

    Not religion based rules.
    Since you got the first two wrong I will not bother with the rest, but it is clear that no such arguments were made.

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyO View Post
    Freedom of religion means just that-- freedom of religion.
    And no individual, who's right it is to exercise said religion has been stopped from exercising it.

    I am sorry Glen, there is simply no way in the world that the First Amendment takes such a hostile view of religion.
    It is not a hostile view, quite the contrary and that is a good thing. Any and everyone should be able to exercise their religion as they please.

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    And no individual, who's right it is to exercise said religion has been stopped from exercising it.

    It is not a hostile view, quite the contrary and that is a good thing. Any and everyone should be able to exercise their religion as they please.
    Sure they have-- or at least the ACA would thus require. Objection to supporting abortion.

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    This is what happens when those on the far wrong are allowed to “interpret” the Constitution.
    Except when the interpretation is convenient to you? Why the hypocrisy?

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    Re: Religious Objection to Minimum Wage

    Quote Originally Posted by prometeus View Post
    Post #3



    Post # 23



    Since you got the first two wrong I will not bother with the rest, but it is clear that no such arguments were made.
    Its quite clear they were-- freedom of religion is being claimed only exists within those sacred parameters of churches, synagogues or mosques.

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