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Ron Paul slams US on Crimea crisis and says Russia sanctions are an 'act of war'

The only thing Ron Paul ever slammed is his thumb up his ass.
 
Being the non-interventionist that he is, should we be really surprised? What type of intervention ISN'T an act of war to him?
 
Robbie Loucks said:
Being the non-interventionist that he is, should we be really surprised? What type of intervention ISN'T an act of war to him?
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Acts of other nations.
 
Robbie Loucks said:
"well then thats okay i guess"
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According to that nutbag, other nations can do anything but if the US so much as sneezes it's an "act of war".

At this point, one would think everyone is aware of his lunacy. Yet, some people still take his comments on foreign policy as legit. :screwy


He and his son exist on the backs of idiots. Obviously, they know it. They're just manipulating stupid gullible people and providing fodder for wannabe jihadists.
 
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RP is right, short of going all out war against Russia there's nothing we can do- let them have Eastern Ukraine, the rest of the country will turn to the West for its future. I think Putin is a thug but half the Ukraine is pretty much Russianized.
 
Someone is going to have to explain this more to me as I don't seem to get it. Crimea voted to leave Ukraine and join Russia. That's their right, no? I am sure there is some behind the scenes going on here, I just don't know enough about the situation I guess.
 
Chaddelamancha said:
Someone is going to have to explain this more to me as I don't seem to get it. Crimea voted to leave Ukraine and join Russia. That's their right, no? I am sure there is some behind the scenes going on here, I just don't know enough about the situation I guess.
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I'll put it in a context for you, closer to home. Here in Canada, the Province of Quebec has been talking separation for a few decades now and actually had several votes on the matter, which failed. Our Supreme Court ruled several years back that a vote on a Province separating now has certain rules that must be followed before it's legit - as well as certain consequences, such as assuming share of the national debt, creation of their own currency, etc.

Now, if the Quebec Provincial government (insert Crimea's Provincial government for context) decided to ignore the federal government and supreme court's rules for a referendum authorizing separation and held such a vote within a week or two, the vote to separate would have no legal basis or grounds for being recognized as legitimate. Add to that, if US militias - quasi US military troops - flooded into the Province of Quebec and managed the vote, threatened the populace, and the US Congress passed a law authorizing US intervention in the vote and the US President talked up Quebec joining the US, you would then have a situation similar to what's happening in Crimea and the Ukraine these days.
 
CanadaJohn said:
I'll put it in a context for you, closer to home. Here in Canada, the Province of Quebec has been talking separation for a few decades now and actually had several votes on the matter, which failed. Our Supreme Court ruled several years back that a vote on a Province separating now has certain rules that must be followed before it's legit - as well as certain consequences, such as assuming share of the national debt, creation of their own currency, etc.Now, if the Quebec Provincial government (insert Crimea's Provincial government for context) decided to ignore the federal government and supreme court's rules for a referendum authorizing separation and held such a vote within a week or two, the vote to separate would have no legal basis or grounds for being recognized as legitimate. Add to that, if US militias - quasi US military troops - flooded into the Province of Quebec and managed the vote, threatened the populace, and the US Congress passed a law authorizing US intervention in the vote and the US President talked up Quebec joining the US, you would then have a situation similar to what's happening in Crimea and the Ukraine these days.
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Pretty crappy analogy...

The USofA hasn't had any sway in Quebec EVER, Russia has in control of the Crimea since the mid 1700's.

The USofA has no basing rights in Quebec, Russia has several bases in the Crimea.

The USofA stations no troops in Quebec, the Russians have a treaty allowing up to 25,000 troops in the Crimea.

Quebec is not a semi-autonomous region with a separate Parliament, the Crimea is.

The majority of citizens in Quebec didn't come from the USofA, the majority of citizens in the Crimea came from Russia.

Other than that, it works for me.... ;)
 
CanadaJohn said:
I'll put it in a context for you, closer to home. Here in Canada, the Province of Quebec has been talking separation for a few decades now and actually had several votes on the matter, which failed. Our Supreme Court ruled several years back that a vote on a Province separating now has certain rules that must be followed before it's legit - as well as certain consequences, such as assuming share of the national debt, creation of their own currency, etc.

Now, if the Quebec Provincial government (insert Crimea's Provincial government for context) decided to ignore the federal government and supreme court's rules for a referendum authorizing separation and held such a vote within a week or two, the vote to separate would have no legal basis or grounds for being recognized as legitimate. Add to that, if US militias - quasi US military troops - flooded into the Province of Quebec and managed the vote, threatened the populace, and the US Congress passed a law authorizing US intervention in the vote and the US President talked up Quebec joining the US, you would then have a situation similar to what's happening in Crimea and the Ukraine these days.
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It is inexcusable for the USA to not place Quebec under USA military control via military invasion to allow Quebec to vote on:

1. Leaving Canada and forming their own country OR

2. Leaving Canada and joining the USA.

However, first 80% of non-French speaking Canadians in Quebec should be deported out of the Province of Quebec, ideally killed.

It would be wrong to allow those remaining in Quebec to vote to stay as they are with Canada.

And THAT is the so-called democracy that is happening in the Crimean region of Ukraine.
 
notquiteright said:
Pretty crappy analogy...

The USofA hasn't had any sway in Quebec EVER, Russia has in control of the Crimea since the mid 1700's.

The USofA has no basing rights in Quebec, Russia has several bases in the Crimea.

The USofA stations no troops in Quebec, the Russians have a treaty allowing up to 25,000 troops in the Crimea.

Quebec is not a semi-autonomous region with a separate Parliament, the Crimea is.

The majority of citizens in Quebec didn't come from the USofA, the majority of citizens in the Crimea came from Russia.

Other than that, it works for me.... ;)
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Just a note. When sarcasm doesn't work, it is called "sarchasm.":The gulf between the author of sarcastic wit and the person who doesn't get it.
I really like Ron Paul and think his thoughts correct and well thought out. They'd never allow an individual with common sense to ascend to the White House.
 
I bet Rand Paul wishes his father would shut the **** up.
 
DaveFagan said:
Just a note. When sarcasm doesn't work, it is called "sarchasm.":The gulf between the author of sarcastic wit and the person who doesn't get it.
I really like Ron Paul and think his thoughts correct and well thought out. They'd never allow an individual with common sense to ascend to the White House.
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It's been many decades at least since a white Southern segregationist bigot had a possibility of gaining the White House.

Oh, and you can stop your fake ranting against corporations or pretending you are green. Ron Paul is against any and all restrictions or regulations against corporations and wants the EPA eliminated.
 
It seems to me that Crimea was mostly pro-Russian before any of the protesting started. If Ukrainians had a problem with the President siding with Russia (and they did) then they took the right route. However, if Crimea wanted to join Russia, they should be allowed to. It's not like Crimea was Pro-European before the protests.
 
notquiteright said:
Pretty crappy analogy...

The USofA hasn't had any sway in Quebec EVER, Russia has in control of the Crimea since the mid 1700's.

The USofA has no basing rights in Quebec, Russia has several bases in the Crimea.

The USofA stations no troops in Quebec, the Russians have a treaty allowing up to 25,000 troops in the Crimea.

Quebec is not a semi-autonomous region with a separate Parliament, the Crimea is.

The majority of citizens in Quebec didn't come from the USofA, the majority of citizens in the Crimea came from Russia.

Other than that, it works for me.... ;)
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It was an example, something folks who don't quite understand the situation taking place in the Ukraine can wrap their minds around since U.S./Canadian relationships hits closer to home. I gave a similar example in this thread http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...ed-annex-crimea-w-153-a-8.html#post1063009090 using the Keystone Pipeline as a central point. CanadaJohn only gave his interpretation based on Canadian secession laws under his country's constitution.

You can relax; neither examples were meant to be taken seriously. They were just given to add alittle perspective to current events in that part of the region.
 
DaveFagan said:
Just a note. When sarcasm doesn't work, it is called "sarchasm.":The gulf between the author of sarcastic wit and the person who doesn't get it. I really like Ron Paul and think his thoughts correct and well thought out. They'd never allow an individual with common sense to ascend to the White House.
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Well I don't know if I'd say Ron Paul is full of common sense. Sanctions are not an act of war. I do agree we tend to find excuses to have a 'national interest' in things that don't concern us, but his call to pack it all up and come home isn't practical.

I don't see sanctions having any real affect on the situation, Putin doesn't need our permission to go anywhere but perhaps the UN. Europe needs Russian NG and we can't replace that energy consumption. it is more a case of our internal politics driving international policies.
 
Objective Voice said:
It was an example, something folks who don't quite understand the situation taking place in the Ukraine can wrap their minds around since U.S./Canadian relationships hits closer to home. I gave a similar example in this thread http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...ed-annex-crimea-w-153-a-8.html#post1063009090 using the Keystone Pipeline as a central point. CanadaJohn only gave his interpretation based on Canadian secession laws under his country's constitution. You can relax; neither examples were meant to be taken seriously. They were just given to add alittle perspective to current events in that part of the region.
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Actually CJ's 'example' is less than useless. The situation isn't close. One area is nooo way close to another... I am VERY relaxed... pointing out total fails in debates is quite relaxing.
 
Robbie Loucks said:
Being the non-interventionist that he is, should we be really surprised? What type of intervention ISN'T an act of war to him?
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Compared to some half a'd sanctioned that amount to, mean and accomplish nothing on one hand, and calls for more war mongering on the other, of course.
 
In regards to Iran,
you're aware the Veteran's bill was filibustered by the Senate GOP due to the unrelated Iran sanctions amendment not getting a vote.
Therefore, Ron Paul would accuse the GOP Senate of an act of war right now on Iran.

Rand Paul is actually being given cover by his Father, who holds together the Amash coalition of TEA/OWS.
Meanwhile, Rand speaks to minority groups such as "Latinos" and the upcoming NAACP, expanding his reach.
He's not sitting on his laurels from CPAC, where he trounced the Canadian Senator 31-11 .
CanadaJohn said:
I believe Ron Paul to be consistent here, if only consistently irrelevant. When in Congress, I believe Ron Paul also characterized sanctions against Iran and North Korea as "acts of war" - does anyone believe that the US is at war with Iran and/or North Korea?
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notquiteright said:
Actually CJ's 'example' is less than useless. The situation isn't close. One area is nooo way close to another... I am VERY relaxed... pointing out total fails in debates is quite relaxing.
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I never claimed the two situations were identical, however, you know nothing about the situation in Ukraine/Crimea nor anything about the situation in Quebec/Canada if you fail to recognize some of the similarities as they relate to the legal process to secede in either country.
 
CanadaJohn said:
I never claimed the two situations were identical, however, you know nothing about the situation in Ukraine/Crimea nor anything about the situation in Quebec/Canada if you fail to recognize some of the similarities as they relate to the legal process to secede in either country.
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Funny you threw in a bunch of BS ontop of the 'legal' BS... like the US sending in military of some flavor.

But back to the legality is Quebec a semi-autonomous region with it's own Parliament? Was it recently attached to the rest of Canada? Does the US have 16,000 troops stationed there? Was the USofA in Quebec for centuries?

The Kurds in Iraq are a better place to try and explain the 'legalities'. Quebec has been part of Canada for centuries, the Crimea has not been part of the Ukraine for centuries.
 
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