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Thread: Rev. Al Sharpton leads Stand Your Ground rally in Tallahassee

  1. #21
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    Re: New Attack on Stand Your Ground

    Quote Originally Posted by CRUE CAB View Post
    In the act of self defense, its already legal. Or would you rather all of us just be victims?
    Well, in some states it is. I've used this example on DP many times but it's worth repeating. In NJ, someone breaks into your home at 2 am, armed, with intent to rob. I wake up, grab my gun, confront them and shoot them - I will charged with a crime and potentially prosecuted. In NJ many (and yes it depends on which county this happens in and the politics of that county) DA's will levy charges because I have to PROVE that my life was in imminent danger, that the imminent danger was real, and that I had no other alternative - in other words that I could not have jumped out a window, ran out the door, or otherwise escaped or hid. It would also matter what gun I used - and what ammo. If I shot the guy using a registered weapon, but with hollow points or frangible bullets, I will probably be charged and prosecuted. LEO's both State and Local use either 9mmm or .40 cal FMJ. I've been told more than once using JHP or other more deadly ammo can be shown that I wanted to kill an intruder (which I would no matter what) but apparently it would be twisted in court, not in my favor. A shotgun with low brass #8 which is a Dove and Quail load was also recommended if I use a registered shotgun for home defense. 0 buck or 000 buck is again, a no no.

    The TLDR version is, the act of self defense varies by state as to what is legal or potentially illegal.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  2. #22
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    Re: New Attack on Stand Your Ground

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    LOL, I live in Tallahassee. There was a rally? Must have been huge!
    I was only aware of it cause of the news. But they had it.
    The Crowd is not the sum of its parts.

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    Re: New Attack on Stand Your Ground

    Quote Originally Posted by tecoyah View Post
    Regardless of "Who" uses this law....it is a bad one in my opinion. Our society is more than violent enough, without making it legal to shoot someone.
    That is exactly the wrong concept of this law that has been bandied around by left wing media. The same media that thinks this law was relevant in the Trayvon Zimmerman case...and thinks Zimmerman was a white guy. I mean if you want to boil it down to simplicity...any self defense law makes murder legal. But that isn't the case.

    This law removes the "duty to retread." That is not a bad law. Why? Do you want it debated whether or not you could have retreated? Debated by one side who doesn't care if it was a good decision and that there was no chance you could have run...and only cares to make you look like a murdering asshole so their number of win can grow? Or would you rather it be decided that you shouldn't be required to run away from a place you are lawfully in?

    Despite all this hubbub...Florida is not a violent place and this law isn't used often.
    The Crowd is not the sum of its parts.

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    Re: New Attack on Stand Your Ground

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Well, in some states it is. I've used this example on DP many times but it's worth repeating. In NJ, someone breaks into your home at 2 am, armed, with intent to rob. I wake up, grab my gun, confront them and shoot them - I will charged with a crime and potentially prosecuted. In NJ many (and yes it depends on which county this happens in and the politics of that county) DA's will levy charges because I have to PROVE that my life was in imminent danger, that the imminent danger was real, and that I had no other alternative - in other words that I could not have jumped out a window, ran out the door, or otherwise escaped or hid. It would also matter what gun I used - and what ammo. If I shot the guy using a registered weapon, but with hollow points or frangible bullets, I will probably be charged and prosecuted. LEO's both State and Local use either 9mmm or .40 cal FMJ. I've been told more than once using JHP or other more deadly ammo can be shown that I wanted to kill an intruder (which I would no matter what) but apparently it would be twisted in court, not in my favor. A shotgun with low brass #8 which is a Dove and Quail load was also recommended if I use a registered shotgun for home defense. 0 buck or 000 buck is again, a no no.

    The TLDR version is, the act of self defense varies by state as to what is legal or potentially illegal.
    If true, get out of NJ.

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    Re: New Attack on Stand Your Ground

    Quote Originally Posted by ockham View Post

    there more info on this? I'm curious as to where demographically and in which states this has occurred.
    fdle.
    Last edited by CRUE CAB; 03-11-14 at 12:56 PM.

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    Re: New Attack on Stand Your Ground

    It doesn't matter that Z/M had nothing to do with SYG at all. He's a populist, and all that matters is that he appeals to his target audience - moronic as they may be.

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    Re: New Attack on Stand Your Ground

    Quote Originally Posted by stonewall50 View Post
    I was only aware of it cause of the news. But they had it.
    I dont think anyone here noticed.

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    Re: New Attack on Stand Your Ground

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    I dont think anyone here noticed.
    I got family in the area. They saw it and saw the news. But only cause they work near Appalachee lol
    The Crowd is not the sum of its parts.

  9. #29
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    Re: New Attack on Stand Your Ground

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    It takes away a person's duty to retreat. That's all it does. Being found Not Guilty under the stand-your-ground doctrine means you are immune from civil suit.
    Very true, but the Florida version of SYG lacks a direct statement that one cannot provoke or incite the victim. The Texas version has this directly written into it. In short, the problem with Florida's law may not be the concept, but the way it is written.

    It will be interesting to see if the Popcorn guy claims SYG ( I imagine that he will). Under the Texas law, the jury would be allowed to consider if his request (s) / order(s) to stop texting constituted a "provocation" to the victim. This concept in Texas could derail his SYG claim before the reasonable person analysis.

    There are of course, two very different spins on what the shooter said, how many times he said it, and what tone of voice he was using.
    Last edited by Cryptic; 03-11-14 at 01:58 PM.

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    Re: New Attack on Stand Your Ground

    Quote Originally Posted by Cryptic View Post
    Very true, but the Florida version of SYG lacks a direct statement that one cannot provoke or incite the victim. The Texas version has this directly written into it. In short, the problem with Florida's law may not be the concept, but the way it is written.

    It will be interesting to see if the Popcorn guy claims SYG ( I imagine that he will). Under the Texas law, the jury would be allowed to consider if his request (s) / order(s) constituted a "provocation" to the victim.

    There are of course, two very different spins on what the shooter said, and how many times he said it.
    Because "provoke or "incite" is subjective.

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