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Thread: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended [W:148:245]

  1. #301
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    some believe that you should never make your own safety a personal responsibility. People who do are less likely to cede their rights to a nanny state and vote for nanny type government. Those who want to turn the USA into a nanny state socialist dictatorship are against this sort of personal action against a threat
    Usually for one of very few reasons…

    • They are or wish to be the threat against which they don't want anyone to stand up.
    • They are on the side of those who are or wish to be that threat.
      …or…
    • They hope that by grovelling before the one who wishes to be that threat, they can convince the threat not to pick on them.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  2. #302
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Rules that YOU consider as idiotic. The school does not consider them as idiotic but rather as essential to the safety and security of the population they have been entrusted with.

    If you do not like the school rules - you can
    1- lobby the school to change them
    2- lobby the school board to change them
    3- find a school with rules more to your liking
    4- home school your own children

    DO NOT UNDERMINE THE SCHOOL BY TELLING YOUR KIDS TO DISOBEY THE RULES BECAUSE OF SOME POLITICAL ISSUES YOU HAVE.

    I taught in the public school system for 33 years - the vast vast majority in high school. On the first day I would give all the kids a list of my written procedures and rules. Each kid had to sign it and then take it home and have a parent sign it. If a parent or student had an issue with a rule or procedure I was happy to talk about it but in the end - they either signed and followed or I would not accept them in the class and had the support of the administration on this issue.

    You cannot undermine the ability of the school to manage its own affairs - especially in the area of student safety.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    The school felt otherwise and they have a right to do that. If you do not like the school rules - you can
    1- lobby the school to change them
    2- lobby the school board to change them
    3- find a school with rules more to your liking
    4- home school your own children

    Your reply was civil disobedience. Do you even know the purpose of civil disobedience? The whole idea is to break the law or rule, stand trial for it, let your example serve to turn the public against the policy. It is not to have your kids break the rules and then pretend they can get away with it because Macho Man back home wants them to grow an bigger pair and has trouble with authority.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    That argument is to be made when the policy is proposed. Once it has been proposed, discussed and voted on - the issue is done. You do not have the right to make a discretionary call regarding a policy adopted by the school board regarding student safety. Its done.

    If you do not like the school rules - you can
    1- lobby the school to change them
    2- lobby the school board to change them
    3- find a school with rules more to your liking
    4- home school your own children

    But you do not have the discretion to tell your kids to disobey school rules and expect they can get away with it.
    Repeating the same nonsense over and over and over and over and over and over and over again does not make it any less nonsensical.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  3. #303
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    this is a message board. and its fair game to blast mindless bots for being mindless bots.
    Especially those who, while being mindless bots, keep repeating over and over again a detailed description about how such mindless bots come to be.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  4. #304
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Some saying they were education for 3 decades lays blame on how lawsuit prone our society it as the reason for "zero tolerance." Your kid is accused of being a bully and so is my kid. The school decides that what your kid did wasn't so bad so gives a detention. The school decided what my kid was very serious, and issues I suspension.

    Next thing I'm in court suiting the school district claiming it is racial discrimination or gender discrimination or some other illegal discrimination. Even if I lose, the school district spends $50,000 in lawyer fees to win.

    His explanation for "zero tolerance" is by setting absolute rules that are applied 100% of the time then no one can claim discrimination. That makes some sense and is maybe of of 10,000 problems with the USA having a sue-em system for which there is no disincentive against bringing frivolous lawsuits. So even if someone sues you and loses - you probably lost 10s of thousands of dollars to "win." That's how lawyers want it and our government is overwhelming controlled by lawyers.

    Someone just sued McDonalds for $1.5 million claiming he didn't get enough napkins and declaring it was racist because a Latino manager allegedly said "you people" when he threw a fit about not enough napkins in the bag. It will cost that McDonald's franchise owner thousands of dollars to "win" that case.
    thing about it is that if you lose you have to pay the other person lawyers fees.

  5. #305
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Most bullies are not cowards and generally are tougher than other kids. Television has presented the fiction you tell for decades, and how the smaller kid wins because he's braver. From Opy on Andy Griffith to the Karate Kid, this is a theme told a thousand times. Good always triumphs and fights are won by courage against cowardly bullies. There is not reality in those fictions. TV and movies are not reality. Who wins a fight is the better fighter. It's that simple.

    Telling your kid to fight someone much larger than him - as young as 10? - and that you would be embarrassed of him if not is horrible parenting advise in my opinion.
    I base what I say, not on silly old TV shows, but on direct, personal experience.

    Bullies are generally cowards. They take delight in hurting others, but are unwilling, themselves, to be hurt.

    As a child, I was an unusually thin, frail, weakling—basically a bully-magnet. If a bully was looking for what seemed an easy victim, they usually zeroed in on me. I'm sure I was still in a single-digit age when I realized that if I could even get one or two good blows in, the bully would pick on someone else next time. He might kick my ass on that occasion, and I'd come out of that one fight worse than the bully; but if the bully came out having been at all hurt, he'd next time pick a different victim who he deemed less likely to fight back.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  6. #306
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    No it is not. People in a free and open society obey rules every minute of every day…
    A society in which the people blindly obey any and all rules,no matter how stupid or senseless, is the opposite of a free and open society.

    Yes, some rules are certainly needed. But the rule-making body always needs to be put in its place, with a clear understanding that it is a servant to the people, and not a master over them; and rules must be made for the good of those who are so governed, and not merely as a way of exercising power and control over them.

    What you insist on defending is the result of rule-makers who have foolishly been allowed to imagine themselves as masters rather than as servants.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  7. #307
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    No it is not. People in a free and open society obey rules every minute of every day and it has nothing to do with fascism.
    Thats funny because I havent heard any news report of an adult being arrested for pointing his finger at anyone. You know why? Because of such a law even existed cops wouldnt be STUPID enough to enforce it because they would be sued. Yet our schools somehow enforce this stupidity on our children.

    We cannot on one hand scream and rant about the schools going to hell over the last decade or two and then on the other decide we are going to have parents teach children to disobey the school rules and be able to get away with it because Daddy back home will support them and their decision. That sort of thing only leads to the weakening of the school environment and completely undermines the ability to run the school and educate large numbers of children.
    You know why schools are going to hell? Because of stupidity like this! Making ridiculous rules simply because children have no rights and they are considered possessions and so we can make any sort of rule, no matter how idiotic, and then complain when somebody stands up to it that its a breach of authority. Thats what your logic is based on. Running a a school based on stupid rules like "zero-tolerance" and "lookalike guns" is teaching our kids the wrong lessons about what society is about and what personal responsibility is about. And any teacher or school administrator who defends those kinds of idiotic things shouldnt be working in a school.

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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

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    Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended [W:148:245]OK, people, some infractions have been levied. If you do not cease the personal attacks, more will be.
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  9. #309
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended [W:148:245]

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    since he has ten, he would be in violation of the NYS 7 round limit



    We have a multiple offender here, this kid should be suspended from school for life!

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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    A society in which the people blindly obey any and all rules,no matter how stupid or senseless, is the opposite of a free and open society.

    Yes, some rules are certainly needed. But the rule-making body always needs to be put in its place, with a clear understanding that it is a servant to the people, and not a master over them; and rules must be made for the good of those who are so governed, and not merely as a way of exercising power and control over them.

    What you insist on defending is the result of rule-makers who have foolishly been allowed to imagine themselves as masters rather than as servants.
    Not at all. What I am insisting on is children obeying the rules of their school and if parents have a problem with them to pursue proper avenues to dispute those rules. We cannot run schools in an environment where children are coached by parents to disobey rules simply because of parents own socio-political agenda. that is a recipe for chaos and anarchy and nobody gets educated in that sort of environment.
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