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Thread: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended [W:148:245]

  1. #211
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Rules that YOU consider as idiotic. The school does not consider them as idiotic but rather as essential to the safety and security of the population they have been entrusted with.
    Sorry but there is nothing dangerous to anyones safety or the security of the school by pointing your finger and saying "Bang!". Nothing. If you think there is then I must ask you to prove that it is dangerous.

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    If you do not like the school rules - you can
    1- lobby the school to change them
    2- lobby the school board to change them
    3- find a school with rules more to your liking
    4- home school your own children
    Lots of other ways to. Its called freedom of speech and protesting via civil disobediance.

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    DO NOT UNDERMINE THE SCHOOL BY TELLING YOUR KIDS TO DISOBEY THE RULES BECAUSE OF SOME POLITICAL ISSUES YOU HAVE.
    Has nothing to do with political issues. Has to do with common sense. There is NOTHING dangerous with a kid pointing their finger and gonig "Bang!". Nothing. Should a child also get in trouble for playing Superman and acting like his/her eyes are like lasers? How idiotic of a set of rules do you want?

    BTW: making that whole sentence capitalized does nothing for your arguement.
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    So you support parents telling their kids NOT to follow school instructions on the safety policy. So what do you do when they get suspended for not doing so? Worse yet, what happens when they macho up like you trained them to do, ignore the school rules and something bad happens as a result of their ignoring school policy?
    What "bad" is going to happen from standing up to a known bully?

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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    No, but I could probably find quite a few that were shot for pointing their middle finger.
    I call BS on that.



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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    I taught in the public school system for 33 years - the vast vast majority in high school. On the first day I would give all the kids a list of my written procedures and rules. Each kid had to sign it and then take it home and have a parent sign it. If a parent or student had an issue with a rule or procedure I was happy to talk about it but in the end - they either signed and followed or I would not accept them in the class and had the support of the administration on this issue.

    You cannot undermine the ability of the school to manage its own affairs - especially in the area of student safety.
    Yes, you can actually. And if you had been my kids teacher and had a rule that I disagreed with I would not have signed, nor would my kid. And the administration would have bowed before me I can tell you that. I've had tussles with school administrations before and I have yet to lose.

    And one more thing. Don't attempt to couch this as a safety issue because there is NO danger with a kid pointing his finger and saying bang in a game. None what so ever.
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by CRUE CAB View Post
    What "bad" is going to happen from standing up to a known bully?
    some believe that you should never make your own safety a personal responsibility. People who do are less likely to cede their rights to a nanny state and vote for nanny type government. Those who want to turn the USA into a nanny state socialist dictatorship are against this sort of personal action against a threat



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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Sorry but there is nothing dangerous to anyones safety or the security of the school by pointing your finger and saying "Bang!". Nothing. If you think there is then I must ask you to prove that it is dangerous.



    Lots of other ways to. Its called freedom of speech and protesting via civil disobediance.



    Has nothing to do with political issues. Has to do with common sense. There is NOTHING dangerous with a kid pointing their finger and gonig "Bang!". Nothing. Should a child also get in trouble for playing Superman and acting like his/her eyes are like lasers? How idiotic of a set of rules do you want?

    BTW: making that whole sentence capitalized does nothing for your arguement.
    The school felt otherwise and they have a right to do that. If you do not like the school rules - you can
    1- lobby the school to change them
    2- lobby the school board to change them
    3- find a school with rules more to your liking
    4- home school your own children

    Your reply was civil disobedience. Do you even know the purpose of civil disobedience? The whole idea is to break the law or rule, stand trial for it, let your example serve to turn the public against the policy. It is not to have your kids break the rules and then pretend they can get away with it because Macho Man back home wants them to grow an bigger pair and has trouble with authority.
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    some believe that you should never make your own safety a personal responsibility. People who do are less likely to cede their rights to a nanny state and vote for nanny type government. Those who want to turn the USA into a nanny state socialist dictatorship are against this sort of personal action against a threat
    Which has absolutely NOTHING to do with a school being able to make rules to protect the safety of its population. Your comment and the political rant which is at its core is irrelevant and does not apply to the topic or issue before us.
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Yes, you can actually. And if you had been my kids teacher and had a rule that I disagreed with I would not have signed, nor would my kid. And the administration would have bowed before me I can tell you that. I've had tussles with school administrations before and I have yet to lose.

    And one more thing. Don't attempt to couch this as a safety issue because there is NO danger with a kid pointing his finger and saying bang in a game. None what so ever.
    Sorry pal - but it did not work that way. Never in all my 33 classroom years did any parent triumph in a dispute about the rules the way you pretend you would. That is from real life.
    __________________________________________________ _
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Are you aware that schools all over the nation from coast to coast have adopted the policy of zero tolerance on threats and children are ordered by school administration and teaching staff to report any and all possible threats - no matter who they come from.

    Are you taking the position that the policy itself is flawed and the people who run our schools are somehow "cretins" for trying to protect children with this policy?

    Are you taking the position that children should be told by parents NOT to follow school instructions and to NOT report what they have been told to report?
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    that is because it removes having to use judgment and thinking from the duties of the school administrators. Its a policy tailored to fit people who have shortages of both attributes.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Is it your position then that parents like yourself should tell their children to NOT follow the school directives and NOT report incidents like this thereby directly violating the rules of the school?
    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    You responded to a post stating that the kids should be brought up as independent thinkers with common sense and not fascists saying that post was no wonder schools are having a hard time. The only rules mentioned between your two posts was idiotic rules. Not rules in general. Just idiotic rules. The only conclusion to be drawn from that is that you do not want children to be independent thinkers with common sense and want them to be fascists. Going by both posts.

    Now if you do want kids to be independent thinkers then you should have no problem with kids disregarding idiotic rules such as pointing your fingers like a gun causing suspensions. Not saying that is what happened in the OP. But the pointing fingers like a gun and getting suspended for it is most definitely an example that HAS happened...even if not in the OP's instance.
    So haymarket accused forum members of telling their kids to break the rules, when there is no evidence that they have done so. People saying that a rule is idiotic does not prove they are having their children purposely break them. Where's the proof that the kid who got suspended was told to break the rule? I'll bet the kid's parents didn't even know till the kid got suspended what he had done. You probably believe that these are conniving families who sit at home with their 10 years olds dreaming up ways to cause trouble at school.
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    Re: Ohio Student Points Finger Like Gun, Is Suspended

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    So you've accused forum members of telling their kids to break the rules, when there is no evidence that they have done so. People saying that a rule is idiotic does not prove they are having their children purposely break them. Where's the proof that the kid who got suspended was told to break the rule? I'll bet the kid's parents didn't even know till the kid got suspended what he had done. You probably believe that these are conniving families who sit at home with their 10 years olds dreaming up ways to cause trouble at school.
    No. I asked them if they would. And the answer was YES.

    Get your facts straight before you post.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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