NYC mayor's SUV caught breaking traffic laws

notquiteright · Feb 23, 2014

sangha said:
I never said a traffic code violation is criminal. I said that violating it was against the law. BTW, you can be put in jail for speeding. And I did Google the story and found one by CBS but it had no link or description of the rules concerning when and why police officers can disregard the law.

Mayor de Blasio’s Caravan Caught Speeding, Violating Traffic Laws « CBS New York

name the cases where someone can go to jail for speeding... (hint only when speeds or actions are considered reckless, eluding, failure to stop for law enforcement) this case was not one where jail would be considered unless other factors come in, so you are quibbling.

The text has the NYPD statement where it says security details have the discretion. You seem to want a list of things cops can/can't do in order to see if security details can violate traffic code. Do you know of such a list or just wanting there to be one?

sangha · Feb 23, 2014

notquiteright said:
name the cases where someone can go to jail for speeding... (hint only when speeds or actions are considered reckless, eluding, failure to stop for law enforcement) this case was not one where jail would be considered unless other factors come in, so you are quibbling.

I believe it's when someone's speed exceeds the limit by more than 15 mph.

The text has the NYPD statement where it says security details have the discretion. You seem to want a list of things cops can/can't do in order to see if security details can violate traffic code. Do you know of such a list or just wanting there to be one?

No, the text has no statement saying that the security details have the discretion to do what it did.

Wiseone · Feb 23, 2014

specklebang said:
Following your rationale, he could use illegal drugs like crack, weed, heroin etc. which just about everyone does and gets away with. Why were Barry and Ford so criticized for smoking crack, a kind of nebbish drug?

When you want to be a leader, you are supposed to set a good example.

That is my opinion©. Maybe I'm being unfair?

Well there's a difference that one is speeding and the other is using highly illegal drugs that impact a person's mental state. Apples and oranges. Just because two things are illegal doesn't mean I have to have the same standard in my tolerance of them especially if they are so different.

clownboy · Feb 23, 2014

ludin said:
wrong it doesn't matter if they are on duty or not. unless they are responding to an emergency or a call they are still required to obey any and all traffic laws.

Protection detail, on duty, is considered be "on a call". Lights and sirens are not necessary for police to meet this bar.

clownboy · Feb 23, 2014

sangha said:
I have already posted the link which shows it is illegal to go through stop signs, speed and change lanes without signalling

Article 30 - NY Vehicle and Traffic Law - Speed Restrictions

As I've already informed you, your link is inaccurate. It shows A PORTION of NY STATE law, NYC has exemptions and get to make their own traffic code.

ludin · Feb 23, 2014

clownboy said:
Protection detail, on duty, is considered be "on a call". Lights and sirens are not necessary for police to meet this bar.

no they are not. they are only allowed to do so if the situation calls for them to exit in a hurry. there was no such cause for such action.
ON DUTY doesn't matter one bit, and no it doesn't mean on a call. you can be on duty but not on a call or responding to a call.

specklebang · Feb 23, 2014

Wiseone said:
Well there's a difference that one is speeding and the other is using highly illegal drugs that impact a person's mental state. Apples and oranges. Just because two things are illegal doesn't mean I have to have the same standard in my tolerance of them especially if they are so different.

No difference at all if someone else is driving. Or speeding is worse and worse yet if drugs are influencing the driver.

Why would anyone be concerned about another person's mental state unless they were directly affected? I walk around during moments of homicidal rage but I never kill anybody. Apples and orages, eaten wile driving and under the influence of drugs are much more dangerous than I am.

sangha · Feb 23, 2014

clownboy said:
As I've already informed you, your link is inaccurate. It shows A PORTION of NY STATE law, NYC has exemptions and get to make their own traffic code.

I have yet to see anyone post a link to those exceptions.

Besides, the security angle is nonsense anyway. Our previous mayor used to ride the subway to work and back. There's no need to run stop signs and speed, especially while the mayor is engaged in a highly publicized campaign to improve road and pedestrian safety

One has to be politically naive to not recognize how negatively that would be perceived

ludin · Feb 23, 2014

clownboy said:
As I've already informed you, your link is inaccurate. It shows A PORTION of NY STATE law, NYC has exemptions and get to make their own traffic code.

those exceptions only apply to emergency situations.

clownboy · Feb 23, 2014

ludin said:
he ran through 2 or 3 stop signs and was speeding 15 mpg over the speed limit in is breaking the law traffic laws.
they are not responding to an emergency situation they do not have permission to break traffic laws.

Not accurate at all. Emergency responders must have lights and sirens going to qualify under every jurisdiction I can find, however police do not. As already stated, police in on duty protection detail are considered on a call.

clownboy · Feb 23, 2014

ludin said:
those exceptions only apply to emergency situations.

No, they do not. NYC gets to roll it's own traffic code. This isn't unusual. Large cities in many states get the same exemption.

ludin · Feb 23, 2014

clownboy said:
No, they do not. NYC gets to roll it's own traffic code. This isn't unusual. Large cities in many states get the same exemption.

you are wrong sorry you can't accept it. they do not get to write their own traffic code, and no many large cities do not get the same exemptions.
you have provided 0 evidence and any cop will tell you that they are required unless in emergency situation or responding to a call they have to obey traffic laws.

on call =/= responding to a call.

his driver broke the traffic laws by running stop signs and speeding up to 15 mph over the speed limit in a non-emergency situation he should be handed the appropriate fines and violation for such reckless driving.

clownboy · Feb 23, 2014

sangha said:
I have yet to see anyone post a link to those exceptions.

Besides, the security angle is nonsense anyway. Our previous mayor used to ride the subway to work and back. There's no need to run stop signs and speed, especially while the mayor is engaged in a highly publicized campaign to improve road and pedestrian safety

One has to be politically naive to not recognize how negatively that would be perceived

Once again, NOT exceptions. Not talking exceptions in the post you're responding to. The City has exemption from the state code in favor of their own. The make their own traffic law.

Don't care if you think there's a need for them to drive the way they do. They are on duty, on a call and exempt from traffic law, NYC or state. They however, must follow department and city policy.

You are correct as to perception. So I should check those recent Obama is a hypocite gotcha threads to ensure you are saying the same about that?

Wiseone · Feb 23, 2014

specklebang said:
No difference at all if someone else is driving. Or speeding is worse and worse yet if drugs are influencing the driver.

Why would anyone be concerned about another person's mental state unless they were directly affected? I walk around during moments of homicidal rage but I never kill anybody. Apples and orages, eaten wile driving and under the influence of drugs are much more dangerous than I am.

Because as the mayor of New York and the way drugs like cocaine or heroine affect the brain, it would be impossible for him to not impact the lives of others if he were using those drugs. Purchasing drugs also fuels criminal organizations within the city which makes crime worse.

Speeding doesn't equate to drug use, don't try to make that argument.

clownboy · Feb 23, 2014

ludin said:
you are wrong sorry you can't accept it. they do not get to write their own traffic code, and no many large cities do not get the same exemptions.
you have provided 0 evidence and any cop will tell you that they are required unless in emergency situation or responding to a call they have to obey traffic laws.

on call =/= responding to a call.

You haven't a clue.

(e) State law provisions superseded.
Pursuant to authority provided by §1642 of the Vehicle and Traffic Law, the following provisions of such law shall not be effective in the City of New York: §§1112, 1142(b), 1150, 1151, 1152, 1153, 1156(b), 1157, 1171, 1201, 1202, and 1234.

Emergency vehicle (authorized). An "emergency vehicle (authorized)" shall mean every police vehicle, fire vehicle, emergency ambulance service vehicle, and every other emergency vehicle as defined in §101 of the Vehicle and Traffic Law.

Law enforcement officer. A "law enforcement officer" shall mean a police officer or any authorized agent of the Department of Transportation.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dot/downloads/pdf/trafrule.pdf

On a call and responding to a call are exactly the same thing where it comes to traffic law. And no, any cop, of which there are many in my immediate family will not tell you that. Just as the CHP officers I've grew up with and known for decades won't.

They won't tell me that, because it just isn't the case.

sangha · Feb 23, 2014

clownboy said:
Once again, NOT exceptions. Not talking exceptions in the post you're responding to. The City has exemption from the state code in favor of their own. The make their own traffic law.

You are being pedantic.

I have yet to see anyone post a link to those exemptions.

Don't care if you think there's a need for them to drive the way they do. They are on duty, on a call and exempt from traffic law, NYC or state. They however, must follow department and city policy.

I have not seen any evidence that they are exempt from traffic laws.

You are correct as to perception. So I should check those recent Obama is a hypocite gotcha threads to ensure you are saying the same about that?

Go right ahead. You won't find me defending any of his statements as being legal to make (or defending them in any way), the way you are doing here.

clownboy · Feb 23, 2014

sangha said:
You are being pedantic.

No, two different subjects, you just misread the post you were responding to in this case.

sangha said:
I have yet to see anyone post a link to those exemptions.

Just posted portions of the NYC code.

sangha said:
I have not seen any evidence that they are exempt from traffic laws.

See above

sangha said:
Go right ahead. You won't find me defending any of his statements as being legal to make (or defending them in any way), the way you are doing here.

Thanks, I will. And nonsense, you're Mr Semantics. You just don't like it when the foo ****s on the other foot.

sangha · Feb 23, 2014

clownboy said:
No, two different subjects, you just misread the post you were responding to in this case.

Just posted portions of the NYC code.

Those portions do not say that NYC police officers make their own rules, or that they do not have to stop for stop signs, or can speed

See above

Wrong.

Thanks, I will. And nonsense, you're Mr Semantics. You just don't like it when the foo ****s on the other foot.

Go ahead. You will not find one word from me defending any lie anyone has told.

Meanwhile, I'll wait for you to post some evidence that cops can speed and run stop signs whenever they choose to

clownboy · Feb 23, 2014

sangha said:
Those portions do not say that NYC police officers make their own rules, or that they do not have to stop for stop signs, or can speed

Heh, now who is being pendantic? :mrgreen:

The code defines police on a call, on duty, as authorized emergency vehicles. The code also exempts authorized emergency vehicles under that definition from ALL traffic law and regulation. That includes speeding and red lights.

sangha said:
Wrong.

Huh? How am I wrong about saying I posted the NYC code? You just now responded to the post where I did.

sangha said:
Go ahead. You will not find one word from me defending any lie anyone has told.

Not the point and your typical semantic weasel.

sangha said:
Meanwhile, I'll wait for you to post some evidence that cops can speed and run stop signs whenever they choose to

Already done. You obviously neither read nor understood the code yet felt compelled to respond to it regardless. Hilarious.

specklebang · Feb 23, 2014

Wiseone said:
Because as the mayor of New York and the way drugs like cocaine or heroine affect the brain, it would be impossible for him to not impact the lives of others if he were using those drugs. Purchasing drugs also fuels criminal organizations within the city which makes crime worse.

Speeding doesn't equate to drug use, don't try to make that argument.

Speeding is much worse than drugs. Don't try to apply logic to my preconceived notions.

Criminal organizations employ unskilled labor. Speeders employ none. Apples and oranges are fruits.

sangha · Feb 23, 2014

clownboy said:
Heh, now who is being pendantic? :mrgreen:

The code defines police on a call, on duty, as authorized emergency vehicles. The code also exempts authorized emergency vehicles under that definition from ALL traffic law and regulation. That includes speeding and red lights.

The referenced codes do not say what you claim they say.

Huh? How am I wrong about saying I posted the NYC code? You just now responded to the post where I did.

You are wrong to say that code exempts the police from obeying laws concerning speed, stop signs, etc

Not the point and your typical semantic weasel.

It is the point. You're defending behavior that is wrong. I don't defend behavior that is wrong.

Already done. You obviously neither read nor understood the code yet felt compelled to respond to it regardless. Hilarious.

Wrong

TacticalEvilDan · Feb 23, 2014

sangha said:
I implied nothing. You said you were done, and that *was* a surrender. That's not an implication; It's a statement of fact

Saying you're sick of someone's crap and refuse to deal with it is hardly surrender, liar. Have fun with that.

TacticalEvilDan · Feb 23, 2014

ludin said:
this is common knowledge i don't have to point out anything. you have to point out where they can break the law which they can't. they are under the same laws as everyone else unless they are responding to an emergency.

it doesn't matter if they are on protection detail or not. they are still required to follow any and all traffic laws.

Okay, great, it's common knowledge and you don't have to prove it because you say so.

Wiseone · Feb 23, 2014

specklebang said:
Speeding is much worse than drugs. Don't try to apply logic to my preconceived notions.

Criminal organizations employ unskilled labor. Speeders employ none. Apples and oranges are fruits.

Speeding is not worse than drugs, the rapid deline of your argument into trolling tells me you've just given up.

TacticalEvilDan · Feb 23, 2014

clownboy said:
You haven't a clue.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dot/downloads/pdf/trafrule.pdf

On a call and responding to a call are exactly the same thing where it comes to traffic law. And no, any cop, of which there are many in my immediate family will not tell you that. Just as the CHP officers I've grew up with and known for decades won't.

They won't tell me that, because it just isn't the case.

Thank you, I had been hunting for that and just couldn't get my keyboard around it for some reason.

NYC mayor's SUV caught breaking traffic laws

notquiteright

sangha

Wiseone

clownboy

clownboy

ludin

specklebang

Discount Philosopher

sangha

ludin

clownboy

clownboy

ludin

clownboy

Wiseone

clownboy

sangha

clownboy

sangha

clownboy

specklebang

Discount Philosopher

sangha

TacticalEvilDan

Shankmasta Killa

TacticalEvilDan

Shankmasta Killa

Wiseone

TacticalEvilDan

Shankmasta Killa