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6 Million Americans Without a Voice

Tigger said:
Then he's a hypocrite. In fact he's the divine example of this nation.... lots of laws and either no enforcement or no real penalty for those who break the rules.



Just based upon my personal life experiences.... If the things I've had to deal with are the LESSER of the evils, I'd have been better off if I'd just died and been done with it.
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Damnation is a quite significant penalty.

Is there no one in the world worse off than you?
 
Cardinal said:
As for "state's rights," this is just code for "the states having the right to discriminate against its citizens."
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Cool deal, can you inform me of what other things i say are code. Thank god you know what I really mean by words I and others say, because otherwise what would we do if you weren't here to inform us what we really mean. Thank god for your mutant powers of mind reading!

And yeah...states and the federal government are allowed to discriminate in various ways towards various groups of people. Happens all the time.
 
Cardinal said:
No, what you want is to simplify my argument to the point that it's stripped of its content. Sorry if I won't indulge you.
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That must be "code words" for "I don't want to answer because it will make me look ridiculous". Wow, it's fun just deciding you can ignore what people say and claim they're saying something entirely different and justify it by claiming its "code words"
 
Do any Americans have a voice? I thought the voice belonged solely to the top 2% of earnings and the politicians.
 
Cardinal said:
Do you believe that people who've served their sentences should lose their right to vote for the rest of their lives, or are you more concerned that ex-felons might vote Democrat?
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The loss of their "right" to vote was part of the sentence. Has been for a longtime now. No different than sex offenders having to register, it is automatically part of the sentence when convicted.
 
Cardinal said:
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/12/o...ans-without-a-voice.html?hp&rref=opinion&_r=0

It's about goddamn time that such laws that fly hilariously in the face of the spirit of the constitution are confronted at the higher levels of government. While I doubt there's currently any political momentum to create Federal laws that overturn state disenfranchisement laws, maybe this will help start the public dialogue needed to do so. Voter disenfranchisement laws are are an utter travesty.
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Cant vote or own a gun because you is a felon, well should have thought about that before becoming a felon. Get a lawyer, get your rights back, cant or wont? Too bad.
 
The Disenfranchisement of convicted felons from permanently losing voting rights, jury service and firearm possession, seems a little excessive and prohibitive.

The bar should be set higher for such drastic penalties, especially if you've served a sentence.
 
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grip said:
The Disenfranchisement of a convicted felons from permanently losing voting rights, jury service and firearm possession, seems a little excessive and prohibitive.

The bar should be set higher for such drastic penalties, especially if you've served a sentence.
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My heart bleeds. Before becoming a felon, did any of those things matter to them? No, obviously not.
 
CRUE CAB said:
My heart bleeds. Before becoming a felon, did any of those things matter to them? No, obviously not.
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You would hope most people would want a sense of fairness applied in all rules, regulations, laws and penalties. Unless you're flawless?
 
grip said:
You would hope most people would want a sense of fairness applied in all rules, regulations, laws and penalties. Unless you're flawless?
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Define "fairness". What is fair is often defined by the perceptions of the person claiming unfairness. Is it fair that people have to be victims of felons? Will the murdered get their right to vote back when the felon is released from custody? Will the nightmares and mental problems of rape victims just magically disappear when the rapist has finished their sentence? Victims have to live forever with their victimization, so how is it "unfair" that the victimizer must also live forever with the loss of certain "rights" as the result of their victimizing others?
 
DVSentinel said:
Define "fairness". What is fair is often defined by the perceptions of the person claiming unfairness. Is it fair that people have to be victims of felons? Will the murdered get their right to vote back when the felon is released from custody? Will the nightmares and mental problems of rape victims just magically disappear when the rapist has finished their sentence? Victims have to live forever with their victimization, so how is it "unfair" that the victimizer must also live forever with the loss of certain "rights" as the result of their victimizing others?
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You define fairness? Sounds like permanent punishment for temporal crimes are within your definition. Are you flawless?
 
grip said:
You define fairness? Sounds like permanent punishment for temporal crimes are within your definition. Are you flawless?
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It is a permanent punishment and should be, felons are people that have proven themselves to not be trusted.
 
grip said:
You define fairness? Sounds like permanent punishment for temporal crimes are within your definition. Are you flawless?
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No human is flawless. But I do accept that I should suffer just punishment if I commit a crime. I am willing to accept the consequences of my actions. The consequences of committing a felony are the loss of certain "rights", I fully accept that if I choose to commit a felony.
 
Deuce said:
Here's a question:

What terrible thing do people expect an ex-con would vote for?
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so you are all for them getting all of their Constitutional privileges back...right?
 
Zyphlin said:
That must be "code words" for "I don't want to answer because it will make me look ridiculous". Wow, it's fun just deciding you can ignore what people say and claim they're saying something entirely different and justify it by claiming its "code words"
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This is code for "I like to jump in and comment without reading through the whole thread."
 
MaggieD said:
The 14th Amendment, Section 2:



SCOTUS ruled denying felons the right to vote was indeed Constitutional...based on the above. In thirteen states and DC, one's right to vote is re-asserted after incarceration.

It's obviously a state issue. Holder! Keep your nose out of it!
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I think an arguement could be made for the 15th supercedeing the 14th in this instance and the word "servitude" also being applied to those in prison as prisons often have work programs that they force inmates to go through. ....Just saying...

Amendment 15: The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.

The Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.
 
Kal'Stang said:
I think an arguement could be made for the 15th supercedeing the 14th in this instance and the word "servitude" also being applied to those in prison as prisons often have work programs that they force inmates to go through. ....Just saying...

Amendment 15: The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.

The Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.
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This is an earlier point I was making, though better said.
 
Cardinal said:
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/12/o...ans-without-a-voice.html?hp&rref=opinion&_r=0

It's about goddamn time that such laws that fly hilariously in the face of the spirit of the constitution are confronted at the higher levels of government. While I doubt there's currently any political momentum to create Federal laws that overturn state disenfranchisement laws, maybe this will help start the public dialogue needed to do so. Voter disenfranchisement laws are are an utter travesty.
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You just can't vote when you're in jail or prison... When you get out you can vote.
 
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