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Thread: Gang of NYPD cops beating up on 84 year-old man for jaywalking [W:129]

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    re: Gang of NYPD cops beating up on 84 year-old man for jaywalking [W:129]

    Quote Originally Posted by Buck Ewer View Post
    The cops had to beat the crap out of him... The reason it took so many of them is the old man was a secret Ninja with the Kung Foo grip.

    oh, what a pitty, if he was black you could have made a comment about fried chicken and water melon ...

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    re: Gang of NYPD cops beating up on 84 year-old man for jaywalking [W:129]

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    Jaywalking is NOT a crime. At most it's a simple violation of traffic ordinance like a parking ticket. You don't go to spend a day in jail, the most is you pay a fine.

    You don't know what actually transpired between the cops and the old man and you talked about the old man fighting the cops as if it's a proven fact.

    I've an 84 year-old parent who also walks about to the stores and visiting friends. If some able body cops would put my elderly parent through such bloody situation, rest assure I'd find them cops and beat the crap out of their lives and go to jail if I have to. Apparently, you would blame your elderly parent or grandparent if they failed to obey the police officers.
    It is against a law. There are laws against it.

    The problem is you are going off of what you have in one report that is most definitely skewed against the police and making a decision on this entire situation based on that. I blame who is responsible. I haven't seen any evidence that the police did anything wrong. I don't trust the stories of people who would sue a city for millions without some other evidence, more than just their word, their story of what happened.
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    re: Gang of NYPD cops beating up on 84 year-old man for jaywalking [W:129]

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    It is against a law. There are laws against it.

    The problem is you are going off of what you have in one report that is most definitely skewed against the police and making a decision on this entire situation based on that. I blame who is responsible. I haven't seen any evidence that the police did anything wrong. I don't trust the stories of people who would sue a city for millions without some other evidence, more than just their word, their story of what happened.
    Going over a few second on the parking meter is also against the law. But it's not a crime.

    Did you not pay attention to what I had quoted from the article you linked that said police officer at Time Square let a horde of patently jaywalkers crossed despite the "NO Walking" light? So, tell me, why must the cop be so be dead set to give this 84 year-old man who was actually crossing at the intersection? Or was the cop racist too?

    You don't trust the victim but you are eager to make up stuffs to defend the police at every turn. But, no matter what the report, it doesn't take several police officers to arrest an octogenarian let alone having him ended up in a hospital bloodied.

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    re: Gang of NYPD cops beating up on 84 year-old man for jaywalking [W:129]

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    What an absurd thing to say. Total exaggeration.
    Yeah, but it fuels the emotional fire.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    re: Gang of NYPD cops beating up on 84 year-old man for jaywalking [W:129]

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    Going over a few second on the parking meter is also against the law. But it's not a crime.

    Did you not pay attention to what I had quoted from the article you linked that said police officer at Time Square let a horde of patently jaywalkers crossed despite the "NO Walking" light? So, tell me, why must the cop be so be dead set to give this 84 year-old man who was actually crossing at the intersection? Or was the cop racist too?

    You don't trust the victim but you are eager to make up stuffs to defend the police at every turn. But, no matter what the report, it doesn't take several police officers to arrest an octogenarian let alone having him ended up in a hospital bloodied.
    First of all, cars get tickets when they are parked near expired parking meters all the time. The cop doesn't care if the flag just went up or the time just expired, if they are see it, they can give a ticket. And that is what this cop was doing, ticketing someone for jaywalking.

    Second, they have already said that different precincts of NYC have complete authority to do as they wish (within the law) to try to help prevent pedestrians from getting run over. The precinct this man lives in decided to include heavier enforcement of jaywalking (a ticketable offense) in their overall plan. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that, and it doesn't matter what any other precinct in NYC decides to do about the problem.

    I don't trust the victim because there is a lot missing from this story. Plus, there is a lot of contradictions, including between many articles that in fact take the old man's side. One claims that the cop stopped the old man from walking away, and that was why the cop laid a hand on him to begin with, while another says the old man claims he didn't try to walk away at all, but rather attempted to retrieve his ID card (something that you do not do to a cop, and it makes even less sense to attempt this when you know that you are not able to communicate effectively with the officer).

    Obviously it does take several officers to arrest a resisting octogenarian that refuses to cooperate and cannot effectively communicate with the majority of the officers there. Especially if they are looking to minimize injury to the man. If they really wanted to, they could have simply tazed the old man, and he likely wouldn't have been bleeding at all. (Mind you, that would have been excessive force.) But instead they merely handled him. The injury cannot be even proven (at least not yet) to be due to the handling rather than a simple accidental fall. With a man of that age, had the police officers truly been rough on him, he would not have had only one fairly minor cut (my son had as many staples for an injury to his head a couple years ago, 2 at the time, and yes, it bled a lot, but it was a simple in and out to get it taken care of) and some soreness in his arms (likely from struggling with the cops).
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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    re: Gang of NYPD cops beating up on 84 year-old man for jaywalking [W:129]

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    See above post.
    You don't need to go hog wild into parking meter flag being going up or down, it's just a distraction from the point you made regarding jaywalking being a crime. Jaywalking is a simple offense of city ordinance regulating non-crime violation.


    A crime is that when committed rendered the person a criminal when convicted and jail or prison time is most likely the punishment.


    An offense, such as parking violation or jaywalking, is that when committed rendered the person in violation of an offense and the most is a fine when guilty.


    I shouldn't have to go through hoops and several posts just to point this out to your understanding.


    This old man worked his way up since 19, traveling to Cuba and then America with only the clothes on his back to New York to later became a successful owner of a restaurant. He raised three sons and had no run-ins with the law for the five decades he was in New York. The police and detectives used to come to his restaurant all the time. So, what is it in his history to cause you to be so suspicious of this old man's statement while at the same time indulging in making up stuffs not on records to villify the victim?


    Your appeal to missing link doesn't mean a thing let alone proof that this old man lied. He probably did all that you claimed were contradiction when reporters only reported certain aspects of what transpired from different witnesses.


    Therefore, he could have given his ID to the officer and then later asking it back. When he got back his ID, he just walked away not knowing he was accused of doing something wrong while the officer thought he refused to sign the ticket and attempted to walk away. This could be what one witness saw regarding your statement "the cop stopped the old man from walking away". Could this be the reason the officer stood him up against the wall to handcuff him that caused the victim to struggle and push away the officer as witnesses said they saw?


    Therefore, all the events that seemed contradictory to you could be sequential but you rather jumped in to convict the old man as liar while making up stuffs in favor of the police.


    Bottom line is that what this octogenarian was accused of doing is a very minor infraction that was just a recent implementation by that local precinct in reaction to recent car accident involving pedestrians. It's as if NY drivers are so well behaved and faultless. The strict enforcement of jaywalking wasn't even publicized and it was a Sunday for crying out loud.

    If the police officer at Time Square was able to let a horde of jaywalkers had a pass, why must this police handling of an octogenarian for alleged jaywalking result in him on the ground and going to the hospitals receiving staples for his head injuries be tolerated?


    The cops in question were just mean and that's my opinion of course.
    Last edited by dolphinocean; 01-29-14 at 05:26 PM.

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    re: Gang of NYPD cops beating up on 84 year-old man for jaywalking [W:129]

    Who dat say we don't live in a police state?

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    re: Gang of NYPD cops beating up on 84 year-old man for jaywalking [W:129]

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    You don't need to go hog wild into parking meter flag being going up or down, it's just a distraction from the point you made regarding jaywalking being a crime. Jaywalking is a simple offense of city ordinance regulating non-crime violation.


    A crime is that when committed rendered the person a criminal when convicted and jail or prison time is most likely the punishment.


    An offense, such as parking violation or jaywalking, is that when committed rendered the person in violation of an offense and the most is a fine when guilty.


    I shouldn't have to go through hoops and several posts just to point this out to your understanding.


    This old man worked his way up since 19, traveling to Cuba and then America with only the clothes on his back to New York to later became a successful owner of a restaurant. He raised three sons and had no run-ins with the law for the five decades he was in New York. The police and detectives used to come to his restaurant all the time. So, what is it in his history to cause you to be so suspicious of this old man's statement while at the same time indulging in making up stuffs not on records to villify the victim?


    Your appeal to missing link doesn't mean a thing let alone proof that this old man lied. He probably did all that you claimed were contradiction when reporters only reported certain aspects of what transpired from different witnesses.


    Therefore, he could have given his ID to the officer and then later asking it back. When he got back his ID, he just walked away not knowing he was accused of doing something wrong while the officer thought he refused to sign the ticket and attempted to walk away. This could be what one witness saw regarding your statement "the cop stopped the old man from walking away". Could this be the reason the officer stood him up against the wall to handcuff him that caused the victim to struggle and push away the officer as witnesses said they saw?


    Therefore, all the events that seemed contradictory to you could be sequential but you rather jumped in to convict the old man as liar while making up stuffs in favor of the police.


    Bottom line is that what this octogenarian was accused of doing is a very minor infraction that was just a recent implementation by that local precinct in reaction to recent car accident involving pedestrians. It's as if NY drivers are so well behaved and faultless. The strict enforcement of jaywalking wasn't even publicized and it was a Sunday for crying out loud.

    If the police officer at Time Square was able to let a horde of jaywalkers had a pass, why must this police handling of an octogenarian for alleged jaywalking result in him on the ground and going to the hospitals receiving staples for his head injuries be tolerated?


    The cops in question were just mean and that's my opinion of course.
    Why are you going off on whether or not it is a crime? It is against the law to jaywalk. You can be ticketed. That is what is important.

    If the head injury is due to a fall, as reported that witnesses believed it was, then it couldn't be blamed on the police. Even if the police caused the man to hit the ground, it is not very likely that they meant to cause him to bleed. It is called "an accident".

    Except it is kind of hard to ask for the ID back when you can't effectively communicate with the officer. That is the main problem and it was the old man's fault for not learning at least enough English in his 50 years living here to be able to communicate with police officers or other emergency personnel, including being able to ask for his ID back or know what the officer wished to talk to him about.

    I'm not calling the man a liar. It is possible he simply does not understand what exactly happened. Plenty of people believe that they were pushed when they actually just fell or, given his age, it could be simple confusion over what actually did happen. Overall though, I don't see that the police did anything wrong here. Not unless more info comes out.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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    re: Gang of NYPD cops beating up on 84 year-old man for jaywalking [W:129]

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Why are you going off on whether or not it is a crime? It is against the law to jaywalk. You can be ticketed. That is what is important.

    If the head injury is due to a fall, as reported that witnesses believed it was, then it couldn't be blamed on the police. Even if the police caused the man to hit the ground, it is not very likely that they meant to cause him to bleed. It is called "an accident".

    Except it is kind of hard to ask for the ID back when you can't effectively communicate with the officer. That is the main problem and it was the old man's fault for not learning at least enough English in his 50 years living here to be able to communicate with police officers or other emergency personnel, including being able to ask for his ID back or know what the officer wished to talk to him about.

    I'm not calling the man a liar. It is possible he simply does not understand what exactly happened. Plenty of people believe that they were pushed when they actually just fell or, given his age, it could be simple confusion over what actually did happen. Overall though, I don't see that the police did anything wrong here. Not unless more info comes out.
    Are you kidding me? You were the one calling jaywalking a crime and I merely responded to that point of yours. Here was what you said in your previous post:

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Jaywalking is a crime...


    You said that it was reported that witnesses believed the head injury is due to a fall. I've read more than a dozen news sources and had yet to come across a news report of even a single witness saying that. Mind providing me the link to the news report or are you just making things up yet again?

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    re: Gang of NYPD cops beating up on 84 year-old man for jaywalking [W:129]

    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinocean View Post
    Are you kidding me? You were the one calling jaywalking a crime and I merely responded to that point of yours. Here was what you said in your previous post:

    You said that it was reported that witnesses believed the head injury is due to a fall. I've read more than a dozen news sources and had yet to come across a news report of even a single witness saying that. Mind providing me the link to the news report or are you just making things up yet again?
    A much earlier post, and in some places, it is. But it absolutely is against the law. You are arguing over semantics. That is basically where you are with this "crime" argument.

    I already provided where it says that the "impression" of witnesses was that he fell. This is an open investigation. That means that many things about the case cannot be released to the public via public officials. Private citizens, such as the man suing the city don't have to follow such rules when it comes to information release. Unfortunately that also means that the private citizen also has an advantage in getting to give his/her side of the story without much rebuttal or evidence to the contrary to avoid contaminating any evidence or saying something wrong (which a city official can get into more trouble for doing than a private citizen). This is also why I have a lot of skepticism of anyone who brings lawsuits against the city or police without much more information. Because it is almost always skewed in the citizen's favor to begin with, then normally more information comes out (usually during the trial or the weeks prior to) that shows that the police weren't at fault or didn't do anything wrong.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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