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Thread: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164, 712]

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    Extreme right already losing it lol

    Essay:Lessons from Ham-Nye Debate - Conservapedia



    Thanks for the entertaining link.

    Someone there seems to have missed a very glaring detail regarding complexity and the second law of thermodynamics.

    "Bill Nye insisted that "evolution is a process that adds complexity" - even though that is contrary to the Second Law of Thermodynamics, which Bill Nye admitted is an absolute truth without contradiction."

    Apparently they are not that bright.. no gold star for this stellar example of being oblivious to the light shining directly in their face. The blindness.. it burns!

    edit: wow! talk about living in a cave: "he seemed unaware that the vast majority of people do not watch the Super Bowl..."
    Last edited by marduc; 02-05-14 at 12:37 PM.
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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Which is absolutely true, that's why the whole day-age nonsense is just that, nonsense. Since we know the universe was not created in 6 literal days, that also makes the YEC's beliefs complete nonsense. So now that we've established that the Biblical creation story is crap, now what?
    We've established no such thing. So now what? Nothing, that's what. Nothing has changed.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    We've established no such thing. So now what? Nothing, that's what. Nothing has changed.
    You already acknowledged that the Bible does not support a day-age interpretation, the Hebrew is very specific about what it means and since science completely and totally discredits a 6-day creation, then we have completely established that the Bible is a steaming pile of crap with regards to it's creation claims.

    Whether or not you acknowledge reality is irrelevant.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    You already acknowledged that the Bible does not support a day-age interpretation....
    I never said any such thing

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    I never said any such thing
    Wasn't it you that said that the Hebrew word used, "yom", only referred to literal 24-hour days?
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    I watched part of it. As a Chrisian, here's my view ---- I don't really care how old the Earth is, nor do I think it really matters in terms of spirituality. I do not believe in a literal interpretation of Scripture and I do think many of the stories in the OT are fables. The "mystery," as Nye kept saying, is how the original matter and consciousness came to be. I found the parts that I watched to be very interesting (although I tuned in in the middle of Nye's argument and it seemed to go on and on forever).


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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    I've no problem with anyone's religion. More power to you. However it's the Ken Ham's and Kent Hovind's that give religious folks with reason and have no problem accepting reality along with their spiritual beliefs a bad name. These biblical literalist, YEC's are a bunch of willfully ignorant yayhoo's
    Give a man a fish and he can eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he can sit in a boat, drinking beer all day while you fool around with his Woman.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Everything evolves, even religion.
    Exactly, especially creationist rationalizations.

    You start with an unshakable idea, the bible is 100% true. You add "proof": (2 Timothy 3:16). the bible says it's 100% true, and because it's 100% true it must be 100% true.

    Then you start to read it, and you come across a passage like
    Isaiah 38:8: I will make the shadow cast by the sun go back the ten steps it has gone down on the stairway of Ahaz.'" So the sunlight went back the ten steps it had gone down.
    Joshua 10:12-14: On the day the Lord gave the Amorites over to Israel, Joshua said to the Lord in the presence of Israel: “Sun, stand still over Gibeon, and you, moon, over the Valley of Aijalon.” 13 So the sun stood still, and the moon stopped,till the nation avenged itself on[a] its enemies, as it is written in the Book of Jashar.

    There's no mention of earthquakes or people falling down, so God is obviously revealing his divine design through Isaiah and Joshua. God is telling us that the sun orbits the earth. He didn't just mention this once, he mentioned it twice. God doesn't lie. People who disagree are evil and must be burnt.

    The Church didn't resolve Galileo of wrongdoing until 1992! Think about that. Men were walking on the surface of the moon, taking pictures like this: and the Church still refused to admit that they were wrong.
    earth-from-the-moon.jpg

    Now creationists by in large ignore these passages. They were important enough to the veracity of Christianity to torture and murder people before, but now it's just not that big of a deal. Either God used magic to inertially shield everyone on Earth, or these are just poetic versus that shouldn't be taken as literal truth. Or whatever, don't think to hard about it. We like having GPS so planetary physics is acceptable science.

    Instead, the real problem is "Evilution". The Bible clearly states that God created the Earth in 6 DAYS... Oh... that doesn't work?? Shoot... hmmm..... Did I say days? I meant ERAS.


    The problem with Religion masquerading as science is that Religion already knows the answer. There's no room for intellectual pursuits. There's no place for debate. Don't challenge what we know, we already know it. Why are you trying to cause other people to doubt? Is your faith too weak? Don't let the devil gain a foothold!

    We have people spending their lives in intellectual pursuits, measuring things, making predictions, defending their ideas. On the other hand we have people like Mr Hamm who teach that his interpretation of a verse from a 3000 year old manuscript is more reliable than lifetimes of research. Science is "brainwashing".

    What are we doing to our kids? Is it any wonder that our education system is failing when children are taught to supplant critical thinking with religious dogma?

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Give a man a fish and he can eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he can sit in a boat, drinking beer all day while you fool around with his Woman.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Josie View Post
    I watched part of it. As a Chrisian, here's my view ---- I don't really care how old the Earth is, nor do I think it really matters in terms of spirituality. I do not believe in a literal interpretation of Scripture and I do think many of the stories in the OT are fables. The "mystery," as Nye kept saying, is how the original matter and consciousness came to be. I found the parts that I watched to be very interesting (although I tuned in in the middle of Nye's argument and it seemed to go on and on forever).
    These are my thoughts as well. It always puzzles me when YECs and militant atheists go at it as if there is no actual middle ground. Science and Religion are not designed to answer the questions posed by the other and people who try to use science to disprove God are just as misguided as those who try to use scripture to establish the age of the Earth.

    I do find a lot that is of interest in the book of Genesis as one of the oldest stories ever recorded, and in it is a lot to be learned about really the dawn of human civilization.

    I've mentioned it here before, but it is worth saying again: YEC scholarship is not as easily disregarded as many seem to think, even if their eventual conclusions are (because their biblical scholarship tries, in the end to impose scripture on science.. see my first point). But ignoring the "and therefore that is when the Earth was made" part, it is compelling to see that the Genesis story, if tallied chronologically, puts Adam and Eve's genesis smack in the middle of the birth of human civilization. When you look at it in that light, Genesis, for me, becomes extremely poignant.

    This is a story, written at a time when man was leaving his largely animalistic past and beginning the application of his vast reasoning abilities towards civilization. Today, for me at least, I can't help but see the lives of the more remote tribes of humans who still live at that cusp between civilization purely natural existence and how content they seem to be. The film THE GOD'S MUST BE CRAZY deals with this well, I think, in a funny way. But the story of Genisis and Adam and Eve is a story that imparts that same regret of our oldest civilizations for having taken that next step towards civilization. The Greek story of Pandora does this as well, but it came thousands of years after the Genesis story was already being commonly taught.

    Also very interesting to me is the simple fact that so much of the Genesis creation story up to Adam can loosely be tied to what we currently believe about the formation of the Universe itself. "Let there be light" is the big bang, followed by a "formless void" from which matter was formed, and coalesced into planets, and so on.

    Of all the creation stories of all the religions in all the world, those that draw from Genesis are easily the most accurate in their order wording even after discounting the idea of an Intelligent Designer being the drive of each stage of creation.
    Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he stops voting for the Free Fish party.

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