Page 49 of 75 FirstFirst ... 39474849505159 ... LastLast
Results 481 to 490 of 749

Thread: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164, 712]

  1. #481
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    United States
    Last Seen
    01-21-16 @ 12:21 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    51,124

    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by beefheart View Post
    So you agree that the story is a fable?
    The flood? That's what an "epic" is, it's a legend, a fable, a story which might be based in a grain of truth but blown way out of proportion for entertainment or propagic value.

    Basically there was some major geological **** going down and yeah there were big floods, tons of people died, and an rich guy made a big boat and brought a bunch of animals. But the flood wasn't global. The animals on the ark weren't all animals from allover the earth, they were local, maybe within a thousand miles or so. It was a traumatic event, and that shows in the story as the writer refers to the whole world being covered in water. That's not literal, that's the writer's point of view, because the writer probably never knew of anything outside the Mesopotamian area. People usually didn't back then.

    There's no indication that the Epic of Gilgamesh was intended to be a literal technical account of an event. Something big did happen, but it wasn't a literal global flood.

  2. #482
    Almost respectable

    Cardinal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    35,036

    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    I should have clarified what I meant by aggressive, I wasn't talking in a Bill O rielly sense aggressive but I think Bill should have been more wiling to say things like

    "what you're saying is patently false"

    Instead of

    "that's an extraordinary claim"

    Which he repeatedly did throughout the debate.

    A global flood and the idea the world is 6000 years old is in every single way imaginable absolutely false and he should have been more assertive of that fact.
    There were others, such as, "You failed to answer my question," or "that is unconvincing," and "I find that implication troubling," (that last one stated after, if I recall correctly, his question that if humans die because of sin, then did that mean that all the animals died because of sin as well?)

    What people are not appreciating about Bill Ny's performance tonight is that rather than exhaust himself in trying to correct Hamm's outrageous claims about what evolution and science entails, he actually stayed on the offensive the entire time by demonstrating that Creationism is completely incompatible with what we observe and know of the age of the planet. I found him to be very organized and he did not allow himself to be thrown off course.

    ...with the exception of that one terrible joke.
    Last edited by Cardinal; 02-05-14 at 02:24 AM.

  3. #483
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    United States
    Last Seen
    01-21-16 @ 12:21 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    51,124

    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by beefheart View Post
    So you agree that the story is a fable?
    The literalist version of the creation story you keep referring to, which is not the one I posted, is also false. it's not even a fable, it's false.

    You post a pic about the sun being made on the 4th day, but the bible never says the sun was created on the 4th day. It says "let there be", not "God created".

    The bible never says the earth is flat, either. Things like "the four corners of the world" are figures of speech we still use today. Referring to Earth's foundation....the Earth has a foundation, it's a solid iron core spinning fast generating a magnetic field. Saying man can't move the Earth from it's foundation is true, we can't remove the core nor can we change Earth's orbit around the sun.

  4. #484
    Bat Chain Puller
    beefheart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    The burning sands of the desert southwest.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    19,352

    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    The flood? That's what an "epic" is, it's a legend, a fable, a story which might be based in a grain of truth but blown way out of proportion for entertainment or propagic value.

    Basically there was some major geological **** going down and yeah there were big floods, tons of people died, and an rich guy made a big boat and brought a bunch of animals. But the flood wasn't global. The animals on the ark weren't all animals from allover the earth, they were local, maybe within a thousand miles or so. It was a traumatic event, and that shows in the story as the writer refers to the whole world being covered in water. That's not literal, that's the writer's point of view, because the writer probably never knew of anything outside the Mesopotamian area. People usually didn't back then.

    There's no indication that the Epic of Gilgamesh was intended to be a literal technical account of an event. Something big did happen, but it wasn't a literal global flood.
    Ham literally believes that this happened, all over the earth, all landmasses covered in water, 4000 years ago. It is a great story, but there is no proof, all the animals on earth today did not descend from ark survivors 4000 years ago, to believe or even entertain that story is pure hogwash.

    Here, this might put things in perspective:

    circle.jpg
    "Those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it." George Santayana

  5. #485
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    United States
    Last Seen
    01-21-16 @ 12:21 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    51,124

    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by beefheart View Post
    Ham literally believes that this happened, all over the earth, all landmasses covered in water, 4000 years ago.
    Ham is an idiot.

    YEC is rationalisation after-the-fact to validate an idea critical to their personal character reform. It's just validation. It's like talking to someone who's been through AA. Exactly the same.

  6. #486
    Guru

    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Columbus, OH
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:49 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    4,484

    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    The flood caused the splitup of the continents????!!!!
    You know, when he said that continental drift used to be a much faster process than it is today I couldn't help but laugh. I mean, does he really expect us to believe that the land mass we call South America went sailing by at 1 mile per year and no one noticed?

  7. #487
    Bat Chain Puller
    beefheart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    The burning sands of the desert southwest.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    19,352

    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    The literalist version of the creation story you keep referring to, which is not the one I posted, is also false. it's not even a fable, it's false.

    You post a pic about the sun being made on the 4th day, but the bible never says the sun was created on the 4th day. It says "let there be", not "God created".

    The bible never says the earth is flat, either. Things like "the four corners of the world" are figures of speech we still use today. Referring to Earth's foundation....the Earth has a foundation, it's a solid iron core spinning fast generating a magnetic field. Saying man can't move the Earth from it's foundation is true, we can't remove the core nor can we change Earth's orbit around the sun.
    Semantics...he said let there be light and there was light...so he didn't create light?

    Bible says earth is flat, fixed on its foundations, the sun hurries back to where it rises, that the moon generates light...

    It is a book of fables, not a science book. Ham takes it literally, says earth is 6000 years old, yet ignores the mounds of tested evidence to the contrary, that is ignorance to the point of complete, willful stupidity.
    "Those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it." George Santayana

  8. #488
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    United States
    Last Seen
    01-21-16 @ 12:21 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    51,124

    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by beefheart View Post
    Semantics...
    Semantics: "the branch of linguistics and logic concerned with meaning. There are a number of branches and subbranches of semantics, including formal semantics, which studies the logical aspects of meaning, such as sense, reference, implication, and logical form, lexical semantics, which studies word meanings and word relations, and conceptual semantics, which studies the cognitive structure of meaning." link

    Quote Originally Posted by beefheart View Post
    ....he said let there be light and there was light...so he didn't create light?
    "Let there be" is not de 'novo creation, no. The creation event is presented from the point of view from the planet's surface, not objective observation. When the story records "let there be light" on the first day, it's recording the removal of the dense cloud layer and allowing light to shine where it didn't before. When the story records God making something, it says outright "God created _____".

    Quote Originally Posted by beefheart View Post
    Bible says earth is flat, fixed on its foundations, the sun hurries back to where it rises, that the moon generates light...

    It is a book of fables, not a science book. Ham takes it literally, says earth is 6000 years old, yet ignores the mounds of tested evidence to the contrary, that is ignorance to the point of complete, willful stupidity.
    You aren't accurate or correct about anything you're citing here. You don't even know what the bible says, you're objecting to what you were told it says.

    That's exactly what YEC does, believe what they're told to.

    So I guess that's the end of our exchange

  9. #489
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    United States
    Last Seen
    01-21-16 @ 12:21 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    51,124

    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Napoleon View Post
    You know, when he said that continental drift used to be a much faster process than it is today I couldn't help but laugh. I mean, does he really expect us to believe that the land mass we call South America went sailing by at 1 mile per year and no one noticed?
    What would have to occur for the continents to move at even twice their present rate?

    Not defending YEC here, just generally curious.

  10. #490
    Sage
    Cephus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    CA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:38 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    29,792

    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    I should have clarified what I meant by aggressive, I wasn't talking in a Bill O rielly sense aggressive but I think Bill should have been more wiling to say things like

    "what you're saying is patently false"

    Instead of

    "that's an extraordinary claim"

    Which he repeatedly did throughout the debate.

    A global flood and the idea the world is 6000 years old is in every single way imaginable absolutely false and he should have been more assertive of that fact.
    I agree with you. If I had been in the debate, I would have let go with a string of invectives pretty much every time Ham opened his mouth. What comes out of the mouths of creationists is complete and total %$^@$. They deserve to be called on it.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

Page 49 of 75 FirstFirst ... 39474849505159 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •