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Thread: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164, 712]

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    This is an absolute lie! Only an unreasonable person would believe that matter created itself.
    This response makes no sense.
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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    The lie I was referring to was the statement that evolution has been proven beyond a reasonable doubt. If this were true, there wouldn't be nearly as much discussion about this topic throughout the Internet and the world.
    This statement makes only marginally more sense.

    People talk about lots of stupid stuff on the Internet.

    Do you think the existence of Disney cartoons means there is a reasonable doubt that dogs can't talk?
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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Fallenangel View Post
    Indeed, and that's all we have at this point of our scientific knowledge and understanding.

    As long as the unc. principle is true, in our Universe it does. (so far we haven't seen any other Universes/examples)



    Vacuum energy is a property of the vacuum that is "caused" by the unc. principle which is as far as we understand is universally true (in our Universe), hence all my previous points stand;
    a. The vacuum isn't "nothing" as you defined it previously.
    b. Unfortunately, the mechanism to why exactly it has energy can not be simply answered with "Because of the unc. principle and it always has" - mostly because we do not fully understand this mechanism till this day.
    c. The following creationist questions would be "Where it came from? (i.e the unc. principle) and "Why it acts the way it is and not in other ways?"

    ...and indeed, other Universes may have other unc. principles, other vacuum properties (some time ago, I read somewhere that there is even a theoretical possibility of a solid vacuum), other constants, etc.
    However, in our Universe vacuum is what it is, and it isn't "nothing".



    Sorry, didn't read it.

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    Fallen.
    Again, vacuum is defined by a density of particles in a volume. A perfect vacuum would be totally devoid of particles within a defined volume. Vacuum energy is the background energy of the universe which permeates all space. It's not caused by a vacuum, but exists throughout it. Vacuum being defined the absence of particles in a volume does not cause vacuum energy, it merely contains it. What contributes to the vacuum energy isn't entirely known. Certainly random vacuum fluctuations can contribute, the curvature of spacetime, gravity, etc.

    So again, vacuum is defined by the number of particles in a volume and when people talk of vacuum, it is to that property to which they are referring.
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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Texmex View Post
    The lie I was referring to was the statement that evolution has been proven beyond a reasonable doubt. If this were true, there wouldn't be nearly as much discussion about this topic throughout the Internet and the world.
    then why did you tack on a statement that has nothing to do with evolution???

    Only an unreasonable person would believe that matter created itself.
    The above statement refers to the big bang or abiogenesis, neither of which is evolution.

    Evolution is both fact and theory. It is fact that changes to living things do happen. They have observed speciation as well. Speciation is when two groups can only produce sterile offspring. Think donkeys and horses creating sterile mules. Or tiger and lion creating ligers that are sterile. The theory part is the ability of evolution to account for the observed variety of lifeforms since the beginning of life on earth.
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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Again, vacuum is defined by a density of particles in a volume. A perfect vacuum would be totally devoid of particles within a defined volume.
    Partially agree, as there is no such thing as a true "perfect vacuum" - thought there is a scientific definition of number of particles per volume that would be considered as "perfect".

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Vacuum energy is the background energy of the universe which permeates all space. It's not caused by a vacuum, but exists throughout it.
    Vacuum energy isn't the "background energy" of the Universe - I don't really know what you exactly mean by that.
    But an inherent property of vacuum in our Universe as caused by the existence of the unc. principle.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Vacuum being defined the absence of particles in a volume does not cause vacuum energy, it merely contains it. What contributes to the vacuum energy isn't entirely known. Certainly random vacuum fluctuations can contribute, the curvature of spacetime, gravity, etc.
    Vacuum is the absence of "normal" matter particles, but it is filled with virtual particles that pop into existence and disappear according to the unc. principle which in turn among other things attribute energy to the vacuum.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    So again, vacuum is defined by the number of particles in a volume and when people talk of vacuum, it is to that property to which they are referring.
    When people talk about vacuum they are normally not aware of things like Heisenberg's unc. principle, vacuum energy, etc. so yes to a degree they would be correct to say that there is no "regular" matter in a theoretic perfect vacuum.
    However, this doesn't mean that vacuum is "nothing", as matter isn't the only "something", there are also various forms of energy, fields, etc. including vacuum energy.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Aekos View Post
    What's the purpose of faith if its conclusions cannot be proven, deciphered, explained?

    Science gives us a tool to understand the world conclusively, and at the same time improve our quality of life and give some meaning to our life on this little rocky planet among billions of little rocky planets.
    The purpose of Faith is to remind us that there are powers I. The Universe which are more important and powerful than human understanding can ever comprehend.

    Science gives you a tool to try and tell yourself that everything can be explained so you don't have to deal with the idea that there might be something out there that you can't explain.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    The purpose of Faith is to remind us that there are powers I. The Universe which are more important and powerful than human understanding can ever comprehend.

    Science gives you a tool to try and tell yourself that everything can be explained so you don't have to deal with the idea that there might be something out there that you can't explain.
    The computer you're typing on is entirely due to science and the scientific method.

    What's the point of God if it merely invites more questions and more mysteries? Because let's face it, historically, the purpose of the (human) invention of God was to try and explain various physical phenomena. We understand most of said phenomena. What's the modern purpose of Organized Religion?

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Yeah, well that's sort of how science works. If you want to do science, you have to play by science rules.
    That's why I won't play by science's rules. Science wants to ignore the idea that there might be something out there which it cannot explain.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    As for the rest of your post, a lot of us have seen or experienced some strange things, but there really isn't much point in talking about them in any concrete sense, in my opinion, as there's no real world context to apply them to. So I don't deny that I saw what I saw, but I just sort of quietly accept them and sit on them. Anyway, if what we call paranormal is in fact real, scientific methods will evolve to the point that they can study it. You can't blame science for not being as advanced as you would like it to be. It can only move as as quickly as people can learn.
    So if science can't prove you saw what you know you saw you won't believe it. That's quite sad so far as I'm concerned.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Aekos View Post
    What's the point of God if it merely invites more questions and more mysteries? Because let's face it, historically, the purpose of the (human) invention of God was to try and explain various physical phenomena. We understand most of said phenomena. What's the modern purpose of Organized Religion?
    Your question shows your lack of belief. We didn't create God. The Gods created us.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    Your question shows your lack of belief. We didn't create God. The Gods created us.
    I don't believe in things I cannot prove. I don't understand God and I don't see the function of Organized Religion which has, historically, only led to oppression and conflict.

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