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Thread: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164, 712]

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    If you have a point you should expound on it. Of course there is more to evolution than natural selection. There is gene flow, random mutations as DNA is replicated and so on. Or do you mean some supernatural force at work? If so, what positive empirical evidence can you cite for that one?

    Natural selection simply means that changes in an organism are accumilated gradually as different traits result in different success rates for an organism in its environment. If it's not natural selection then its something supernatural and that is not science.
    If it's not natural selection than it's something supernatural??? Huh? I'm not really sure what you are referring to when you say "it," but if it's "changes in an organism" surely you don't believe that this occurs solely through natural selection?

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    except that we do know how evolution works (in general) but we have no idea how live was created on earth. Most often biology will not talk about that side of the issue (where I live) but only talked about the here and now of biology and how we as human got where we have through evolution.

    If someone wants to discuss the origins of how life started here on earth they should do so in religious studies and not in scientific studies.
    Well, sure we have ideas about how life was created, we just haven't gathered enough evidence to be more certain of which of the ideas is the right direction to be thinking in. I think it's too bad if biology textbooks won't even cover the matter of abiogenesis. They wouldn't have to make decisive conclusions about what form that abiogenesis would take, but there's nothing wrong with saying that this is an area of mystery and ongoing scientific investigation. As for the comment about how origins of life belong in a religious studies class, you'll have to tell that to all the scientists conducting (sometimes successful) experiments creating proteins from inorganic matter. Point being, it can be done, so it's not at all impossible for it to have happened in some manner or another on earth 3.5 billion years ago.
    Last edited by Cardinal; 01-05-14 at 01:29 AM.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    I will save you the time now and let you know that I believe the world was created by a Higher Power and nothing will ever c hanger my view on that.
    Why did you demand proof of evolution if you never had any intention of accepting it from the very start?

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by GJ Flash View Post
    And bigot is about the nicest word I'd use to describe Bill Nye.

    My first question would be, how far do people expect to get in a philosophical discussion that begins with insults? Not far, I hope.

    I'm not one of those people who believes in a strictly literal interpretation of the book of Genesis, but what is so unbelievable about the prospect of a creative intelligence?
    I ignored the rest of your post because I think the answer to your first question is the only thing worth responding to. There simply is no basis to intelligent design other than a faith based argument that can only live within the confines of the ignorance of science. When I say, ignorance of science, I mean the intricacies not yet discovered, to be discovered. Even if we knew the answers, we will never know the fine details. And that is where ignorance and deception will live.
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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Has Bill Nye ever been in a formal debate?
    Just wondering. There are several videos when he is part of a panel but I have not found anything formal a la william lane craig versus richard dawkins
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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by RogueWarrior View Post
    So don't mix the common parlance form of 'theory' with the scientific form of the word!
    I don't mix, in threads related to science I always use the latter.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    I don't believe most high school students have the same level of intellect or understanding that even I had in the early 1990. I wouldn't teach creation in schools. What I would do us to teach the scientific theories on the beginning of the world as theories instead if as the only acceptable option in the discussion.
    Well, good news: they are taught as theories.


    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    True. However you (or at least the school departments) can choose not to wave a red flag in front of the bull by suggesting there are no alternatives.
    Can't be helped. As of present there are no scientific theories that pose as alternatives to evolution. To the contrary, everything we learn only adds to the theory of evolution rather than weakening it any way. Sure, you'll see a story with some frequency like, "Hominid A is ancestor to hominid B and not the reverse!" (or whatever) but this only ever corrects the timeline or other details of evolution instead of dismantling it altogether. Indeed, the more knowledge we gain and add to evolution the increasingly less likely it seems the theory will ever be tossed out in favor of another. I suppose anything's possible, but the idea of something altogether different which serves as a superior explanation is pretty damn bleak at this point.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    Quote Originally Posted by RogueWarrior View Post
    Has Bill Nye ever been in a formal debate?
    Just wondering. There are several videos when he is part of a panel but I have not found anything formal a la william lane craig versus richard dawkins
    I'm sure that Bill Nye has been exposed to the occasional evolution/creation debate, and has a pretty good idea of what's coming.

    I hope.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    You down right embarrassed yourself in that discussion and you didn't have the capacity to realize it. You can't school anybody on theories, when you don't even grasp that plate tectonics is a theory.

    The only stick you had to swing in that discussion was playing semantics and quoting definitions.

    My biggest mistake was to to continue the conversation thereby granting you legitimacy, but I was new to the site then. I'm not making your arguments for you anymore. You want say the other poster is wrong about biology, then illustrate that he's wrong.

    Don't be coy. You complain that another poster is being short sighted when discussing evolution and you want more mentioned than natural selection, then do it. What do you feel so strongly about that nobody else is mentioning??

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    Are you saying that the "two fundamental laws of biology" that were posted are accepted scientific laws?

    Do you believe that evolution through natural selection is a scientific law? I had hoped that you learned something from our exchange on the difference between laws and theories.
    Last edited by SheWolf; 01-05-14 at 02:02 AM.

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    Re: Bill Nye the Science Guy to debate Creation museum founder Ken Ham[W:164]

    You down right embarrassed yourself in that discussion and you didn't have the capacity to realize it. You can't school anybody on theories, when you don't even grasp that plate tectonics is a theory.

    The only stick you had to swing in that discussion was playing semantics and quoting definitions.

    My biggest mistake was to to continue the conversation thereby granting you legitimacy, but I was new to the site then. I'm not making your arguments for you anymore. You want say the other poster is wrong about biology, then illustrate that he's wrong.

    Don't be coy. You complain that another poster is being short sighted when discussing evolution and you want more mentioned than natural selection, then do it. What do you feel so strongly about that nobody else is mentioning??
    So... you don't want to defend what you said in that last post? Totally understandable, I'd be embarrassed too.

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