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Thread: China could defeat US in East Pacific conflict by 2020: Russian analyst

  1. #91
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    Re: China could defeat US in East Pacific conflict by 2020: Russian analyst

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Heya Monte.....well not so with Taiwan and Vietnam and the Phillipines


    China and Vietnam fought a bloody border war in 1979, and in 1988 a naval battle close to disputed islands in the seas left 70 Vietnamese sailors dead. Disputes over fishing rights in the region have triggered occasional violent incidents and hiked up diplomatic tensions since then.....snip~


    Asian nations call for freedom of air, seas as U.S.-China maritime near-collision revealed

    Japan and Southeast Asian countries called for freedom of the air and sea on Saturday, as China's military assertiveness raises regional tensions and after U.S. and Chinese warships narrowly avoided collision in the disputed South China Sea.



    China's recent announcement of an air defense zone covering disputed islands in the East China Sea and its territorial claims in the South China Sea have raised concerns that a minor incident in the disputed seas could quickly escalate.....snip~

    Asian nations call for freedom of air, seas as U.S.-China maritime near-collision revealed
    MMC, the Chinese military isn't what it was in 1979.

    Pentagon warning over China military build-up

    China is extending its military advantage over Taiwan and increasingly looking beyond, building up a force with power to strike in Asia as far afield as the US territory of Guam, the Pentagon said.


    http://www.alternet.org/rss/breaking...itary_build-up
    Last edited by Montecresto; 12-30-13 at 06:35 PM.

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    Re: China could defeat US in East Pacific conflict by 2020: Russian analyst

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    MMC, the Chinese military isn't what it was in 1979.
    Yeah I know its not.....and neither were these guys all standing in line holding arms and making it known to China they will stand together.

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    Re: China could defeat US in East Pacific conflict by 2020: Russian analyst

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Neither side has anything to gain from it, and both have literally everything to lose.
    It's not true that they have nothing to gain. Again, there are a lot of untapped resources in the East China Sea. At some point, someone is going to try and mine them. If China was to drop an offshore drilling rig in an area claimed by Japan, what would they do? Just let it happen?

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    Re: China could defeat US in East Pacific conflict by 2020: Russian analyst

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Really, your dismissing that out of hand!
    No I'm not ... I couldn't help it. I had one of those images again! The homeless man and the hippy, railing against the establishment... it was the beard ...

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    Re: China could defeat US in East Pacific conflict by 2020: Russian analyst

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Don't know if you saw this......On Vietnam and the Phillipines. Plus South Korea has already stated they wont acknowledge China's zone nor report to them.

    US boosts maritime security aid to Vietnam.....



    The United States will boost maritime security assistance to China's smaller neighbors amid rising tensions over disputed territories in the South China Sea, U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry announced on Monday during a visit to Vietnam, where he also pressed the communist government on human rights and democratic and economic reforms.

    The U.S. will provide an additional $32.5 million to help Southeast Asian nations protect their territorial waters and secure navigational freedom, Kerry said. Vietnam alone will receive up to $18 million, including five fast patrol-boats that will be given to the Vietnamese Coast Guard, he said. With the new contribution, U.S. maritime security assistance to the region will exceed $156 million over the next two years, the State Department said.

    At a news conference Monday with Vietnam's Foreign Minister Pham Binh Minh, Kerry said the assistance was not a "quickly conceived reaction to any events in the region" but rather part of a "gradual and deliberate expansion" in such aid. But he made clear that the aid is designed to help nations defend their waters from encroachment.

    "Peace and stability in the South China Sea is a top priority for us and for countries in the region," Kerry said. "We are very concerned by and strongly opposed to coercive and aggressive tactics to advance territorial claims."

    Kerry's visit to Vietnam, to be followed by a stop in the Philippines on Tuesday, comes as tensions over conflicting claims to territory in the South China Sea have risen dramatically, and many of China's neighbors are seeking assurances from Washington that it will remain a guarantor of maritime security in the Asia-Pacific region.

    Both Vietnam and the Philippines are involved in disputes with China. Monday's announcement was likely to rankle Beijing and calm concerns in Vietnam and other countries that the United States might be acquiescing to China's shows of strength.....snip~

    US boosts maritime security aid to Vietnam
    Oh I'm sure Vietnam would love assistance with shoring up it's interest in the South China Sea. But we're not talking about the South China Sea. And I don't see Vietnam risking alienating China over Japanese interests. Would that be a smart move? No. But that's how I see it.

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    Re: China could defeat US in East Pacific conflict by 2020: Russian analyst

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Naval battles are about as relevant as the Calvary. We need to cut back on big ships that are sitting ducks.


    For the U.S. Navy it might be irreverent but our admirals are now saying maybe the Navy made the wrong turn during the 50's and 60's and depended on carriers to much and all of it's cruisers and destroyers were built as escorts for the carriers to protect the carrier instead of sinking an enemy fleet. The U.S. Navy has neglected naval surface warfare. They also neglected NSFS but that's another topic.

    Where as Russia never neglected naval surface warfare and it looks like the PLA-Navy are going the same way.

    The U.S. Navy just hasn't neglected naval surface warfare but has become to dependent on high technology. Knock out a few satellites or if the enemy uses EW and our ships just can no longer fight but can't even defend themselves. (Damn I hope our naval officers still know how to use a sexton so they don't find themselves lost at sea.)

    Both Russia and China's navies have supersonic ant-ship missiles. What does the U.S. Navy have ? Only sub-sonic Harpoon and Tomahawk cruise missiles. And both Russia and China have ballistic anti-ship missiles coming on line.

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    Re: China could defeat US in East Pacific conflict by 2020: Russian analyst

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    It won't be a ground war that we will have to wage with China though. What it will probably become is an attempt to assert it's rights and aggressively defend it's claims in the East and South China Sea. The US and Japan won't tolerate this, and that's when war would break out. Not a world war scale, but a naval/air force action which they have been preparing for the last 20 or so years. At that point, it will probably devolve into a blockade of some sort to try and starve out the country of energy and food, because China doesn't have the force projection capabilities they won't be able to break it. In response, they'll probably send out their diesel sub fleet and start hitting our shipping and oil rigs that we rely on. Then it just be a question of who is willing to suffer the longest, odds are that the US would cave first, as public opinion will probably see it as just another war "over there" and Japan doesn't have the resources to wage that kind of war for a prolonged period of time.
    LOL It's like you don't know that we have the nuclear capability to destroy China entirely with the push of a button. Conventional war between major powers is as extinct as the dinosaur. The Chinese are merely responding to our presence. They would never attempt to use ANY of their warships against us or our allies.

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    Re: China could defeat US in East Pacific conflict by 2020: Russian analyst

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    LOL It's like you don't know that we have the nuclear capability to destroy China entirely with the push of a button. Conventional war between major powers is as extinct as the dinosaur. The Chinese are merely responding to our presence. They would never attempt to use ANY of their warships against us.
    First off, I'm glad that we have this thread... everything else on this forum right now is abortions and duck dynasty... both of which I have no interest in. Back to post, why is it people think their can't be small scale conflicts between large nuclear powers? China's done it with both Russia and India... and Russia definitely had nukes at that time. I'm just saying that when fighting over interests, limited to an area like the East China Sea, you could have a small scale conflict.

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    Re: China could defeat US in East Pacific conflict by 2020: Russian analyst

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Really! Ok, I'll go back to the MASH reruns then.
    Yes, really. There's a distinct difference. I can win the lottery, but I can say with a great deal of confidence that I wont.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    It's not true that they have nothing to gain. Again, there are a lot of untapped resources in the East China Sea. At some point, someone is going to try and mine them. If China was to drop an offshore drilling rig in an area claimed by Japan, what would they do? Just let it happen?
    The resources gained from that rig are overwhelmed by the expense of fighting over it. You've seen the outrageously high cost of our fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan. Imagine the cost of actually having naval assets at risk. Modern fighter aircraft are hideously effective at destroying large, slow moving targets. Once an aircraft carrier sinks, it's not going to be a small conflict.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: China could defeat US in East Pacific conflict by 2020: Russian analyst

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    Oh I'm sure Vietnam would love assistance with shoring up it's interest in the South China Sea. But we're not talking about the South China Sea. And I don't see Vietnam risking alienating China over Japanese interests. Would that be a smart move? No. But that's how I see it.
    The Vietnamese hate the Chinese and always have. They even fought (and won) a skirmish with them over borders soon after the US left them alone.

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