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Thread: New House Resolution Calls for Declassifying Secret Portion of 9/11 Report

  1. #131
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    Re: New House Resolution Calls for Declassifying Secret Portion of 9/11 Report

    Quote Originally Posted by Jango View Post
    1) Bull****. The government also classifies information that is embarrassing or would make it look bad I.e. dirty laundry.
    Is that in the classification guide?

    2) Specific sources of foreign support
    So...sources and means and methods. Okay.
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    Re: New House Resolution Calls for Declassifying Secret Portion of 9/11 Report

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    lol no, be informed about the politicians. You don't decide policy, they do (that's why they're called politicians). Be informed about them and their stances.

    You're not getting access to classified information without a clearance though, sorry.
    What are you talking about we don't decide policy. Sure we do. Public opinion definitely helps shape and decide policy. Did you see how fast Rumsfeld left after the second GW election? Holder should be gone but the public hasn't enough information, which is not being told us with the assistance of the accessories after the fact, the MSM. You don't think Obama is going to have to regroup and retrench as his poll numbers go down down down? With the approach of election 2014, Democrats will be scrambling to find a place to hide with the debacle of the un-ACA. Think any of that would have happened if we had a black out on information as you suggest. If we knew, only had information on the politicians, had not been informed of their policy lies and misstatements, we might think them all saints.

    You were here earlier in the thread calling most of the public stupid... and you apparently want to keep the other half stupid as well. That is not how it goes. And stop with the red herring of the clearance. We have gone over that previously, you are just using that as a distractor.
    "...But resist we much, we must and we will much, about that be committed..." --- the right Reverend Alfred Charles "Al" Shaprton, Jr.

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    Re: New House Resolution Calls for Declassifying Secret Portion of 9/11 Report

    Who needs clearance to access classified information when you have Ed Snowden.

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    Re: New House Resolution Calls for Declassifying Secret Portion of 9/11 Report

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaugingcatenate View Post
    What are you talking about we don't decide policy. Sure we do.
    No, you don't.

    Public opinion definitely helps shape and decide policy. Did you see how fast Rumsfeld left after the second GW election? Holder should be gone but the public hasn't enough information, which is not being told us with the assistance of the accessories after the fact, the MSM. You don't think Obama is going to have to regroup and retrench as his poll numbers go down down down? With the approach of election 2014, Democrats will be scrambling to find a place to hide with the debacle of the un-ACA. Think any of that would have happened if we had a black out on information as you suggest. If we knew, only had information on the politicians, had not been informed of their policy lies and misstatements, we might think them all saints.
    All of those actions were executed by politicians.

    You were here earlier in the thread calling most of the public stupid... and you apparently want to keep the other half stupid as well. That is not how it goes. And stop with the red herring of the clearance. We have gone over that previously, you are just using that as a distractor.
    You're not getting that information, I'm very sorry. Vote for the politicians that you believe best support your stances. Inform yourself on their platforms. But you're not getting classified information, stop whining about it.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
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    Re: New House Resolution Calls for Declassifying Secret Portion of 9/11 Report

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    Is that in the classification guide?



    So...sources and means and methods. Okay.
    1) Yeah, because the government always follows its own rules. Are you seriously trying to suggest or argue that the government doesn't classify inconvenient information?

    2) Inside the Saudi 9/11 coverup | New York Post

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    Re: New House Resolution Calls for Declassifying Secret Portion of 9/11 Report

    Quote Originally Posted by Jango View Post
    1) Yeah, because the government always follows its own rules. Are you seriously trying to suggest or argue that the government doesn't classify inconvenient information?
    So argument is you don't know, you just have a hunch. Great.

    What? Why would you think that would refute anything I said even if true?
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
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    Re: New House Resolution Calls for Declassifying Secret Portion of 9/11 Report

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    So argument is you don't know, you just have a hunch. Great.



    What? Why would you think that would refute anything I said even if true?
    What's the point in even discussing these matters with you? I know you're not ignorant of these issues, yet you argue against them repeatedly. Your gimmick is stale, man. Everyone who has a lick of knowledge in government classification knows that government classifies in an abundance more than is necessary and it is to hide inconvenient facts, journalists know this, transparency hounds know this, government workers know this, etc.

    You claim that the reason the 28 pages are classified is because of sources, means and methods. How can that be true if you haven't read the 28 pages? You didn't even know the title of the section. But you act as if it is beyond your comprehension that in those 28 pages, it says something like Saudi Arabia officials and intelligence professionals helped facilitate and coordinate the 9/11 attacks.

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    Re: New House Resolution Calls for Declassifying Secret Portion of 9/11 Report

    Quote Originally Posted by Jango View Post
    What's the point in even discussing these matters with you? I know you're not ignorant of these issues, yet you argue against them repeatedly. Your gimmick is stale, man. Everyone who has a lick of knowledge in government classification knows that government classifies in an abundance more than is necessary and it is to hide inconvenient facts, journalists know this, transparency hounds know this, government workers know this, etc.
    lol over classification means something different than what you're talking about. But yes, it is a problem.

    You claim that the reason the 28 pages are classified is because of sources, means and methods. How can that be true if you haven't read the 28 pages?
    BECAUSE THAT'S WHY THINGS GET CLASSIFIED. That's it, as far as intelligence goes. Technology gets classified, but that's well outside the realm of intelligence (which is what the report deals with).

    You didn't even know the title of the section. But you act as if it is beyond your comprehension that in those 28 pages, it says something like Saudi Arabia officials and intelligence professionals helped facilitate and coordinate the 9/11 attacks.
    lol BECAUSE I KNOW WHY THINGS ARE CLASSIFIED. Seriously, you don't seem to know anything about intelligence community, so I'm not sure why you have such strong feelings about it. As I said, that (the Saudi thing) has nothing to do with what I'm saying, regardless of whether it'd be true or not. And I tried to explain that to you, but I guess I'll repeat it: whether or not that's what it says, it would be classified because that information would jeopardize sources or means and methods. Or both.

    For example, let's say Putin has a weird freckle on his balls and he keeps it a secret and the US knew of it. That information would end up being classified, not because people are trying to keep poor Jango in the dark and classifying pointless things, but because if it got out that the US knew it, Russia would then know that Putin's wife/girlfriend/physician/whatever had most likely been turned and was working with foreign intelligence agents. If there's a Chinese sub that sinks and China keeps it a secret, but the US finds out about it and what the last thing the radio operator said was, that information gets classified. Not to keep Jango at debatepolitics.com down, and to take away his precious freedoms, but because if it got out, it would indicate to China that the US had broken their cryptography and was listening to their transmissions.

    So 28 pages are classified. I know you think there's a good chance it's something nefarious and evil and it's a big ol cover up and if only Jango and like-minded individuals knew it, they could force this government to change and respect your god-given constitutional rights. I'm saying those pages are classified to protect sources (as would be the probable result of the Putin scenario) or means and methods (the probable result of the China example). You can talk about Saudi Arabia and Wahhabis and whatever til you're blue in the face, that's not gonna change why those pages were classified, BECAUSE THAT'S WHY THINGS ARE CLASSIFIED. I don't care if you think that's stale, I think your repeated criticism of something you know nothing about is pretty stale.

    "Hey guys, the Nissan Sonata sure does suck! That SUV is horrible! ...What? Oh it's a Hyundai? It's not an SUV? Whatever, it still sucks!" Learn about things before you jump into complaining about them, it might be helpful.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

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    Re: New House Resolution Calls for Declassifying Secret Portion of 9/11 Report

    Quote Originally Posted by OldWorldOrder View Post
    lol over classification means something different than what you're talking about. But yes, it is a problem.
    This approach will help prevent over-classification and maximize the disclosure of homeland security and other information within the scope of the Information Sharing Environment that must be disseminated to prevent and to collectively respond to acts of terrorism. To facilitate this change, this measure will accomplish several key objectives: (1) promote a common understanding among Department employees and contractors that classified markings are not to be used to protect political turf or to hide embarrassing facts from public view
    House Report 110-776 - REDUCING OVER-CLASSIFICATION ACT OF 2008

    The dangerous, if natural, tendency to hide embarrassing or inconvenient facts can mask vulnerabilities and only keeps critical information from the American people.
    - TOO MANY SECRETS: OVERCLASSIFICATION AS A BARRIER TO CRITICAL INFORMATION SHARING

  10. #140
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    Re: New House Resolution Calls for Declassifying Secret Portion of 9/11 Report

    Which doesn't refute anything I said. When you talk of overclassification, it's about compartmentalizing things between agencies. The public is a huge afterthought: because they really don't matter.
    The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.
    -GK Chesterton

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