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Thread: Pippi Longstocking and 6 other supposedly racist children's characters

  1. #131
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    Re: Pippi Longstocking and 6 other supposedly racist children's characters

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    Ummm... You realize that they're actually 100% correct, right?

    The Chronicles of Narnia is a notoriously unsubtle Christian allegory.

    Likewise, Avatar is "white guilt" driven propaganda, which simply happens to have some rather racist undertones running through its plot.
    Which simply goes to prove that some people will fabricate whatever they want to see, presume they are correct, then run around preaching the "gospel of their personal beliefs" as if it was actually worth something.

    Avatar was the story of the human race, it's greed, it's narcissism, it's arrogance, and how after ruining its own planet, and dumping members of their own species who were not "perfect" to languish in the shadows of poverty... (i.e. in a wheelchair)... it flew to distant planets, intent on plundering the wealth of others and taking it for themselves. Humans found a planet where intelligent beings lived in perfect physical and spiritual harmony. Humans then ridiculed the "religion" of the inhabitants, murdered them, tore up the flora and fauna for its own use, and eventually learned that even the most peaceful, spiritual of beings will kick the humans' self-indulgent, planet-destroying ass when they have ****ing had enough, because *gasp!* the inferior "natives" were stronger and smarter than the entirety of the human race, and unlike humans, found goodness and value on the inside rather than judging by physical usefulness.

    And you managed to turn that into "white guilt" propaganda, with racial undertones? Good lord. Get thee to a literary class immediately, then fall on your knees and beg the professor to forgive your foolish transgressions and teach you how to understand what another individual is actually trying to say via his writings instead of fabricating your own twisted version that coincides with your personal beliefs and lets you sleep at night.

    Now I shall quietly beat my head on the keyboard, and weep for my species.

  2. #132
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    Re: Pippi Longstocking and 6 other supposedly racist children's characters

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobie View Post
    Avatar is basically Dances With Wolves in space.

    The Chronicles of Narnia draw pretty heavily on Christian allegory. C.S. Lewis was a pretty devout Anglican.
    Not to mention CS Lewis himself said Aslan was what Jesus would be in an alternate reality.

    Avatar was Billy Jack in Space. Heavy handed and apparent to seemingly everyone but a few.

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    Re: Pippi Longstocking and 6 other supposedly racist children's characters

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    And you managed to turn that into "white guilt" propaganda, with racial undertones? Good lord. Get thee to a literary class immediately, then fall on your knees and beg the professor to forgive your foolish transgressions and teach you how to understand what another individual is actually trying to say via his writings instead of fabricating your own twisted version that coincides with your personal beliefs and lets you sleep at night.

    Now I shall quietly beat my head on the keyboard, and weep for my species.
    the irony of posting this after totally missing the whole christian angle of the chronicles is worth the admission alone

  4. #134
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    Re: Pippi Longstocking and 6 other supposedly racist children's characters

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    Why should race alone be the crux of the issue here? Do you think the Europeans would have been any less inclined to conquer the native peoples they encountered if they had been light skinned, rather than dark?

    I highly doubt it. Frankly, the history of Russian colonialism proves otherwise anyway (Ever notice how you never hear anything about that either? ).

    I myself objected to the overtly racist elements being depicted in the book (the art style, the native character's broken English, etca). What Hat was referring to had nothing to do with those problems. It was concerning the idea that a European would be held in high honor by natives, and that a European should teach native peoples about his culture as if it were their own.

    I'm sorry, but that has nothing to do with "race." That is an issue of culture, and assumed cultural superiority.

    The Romans were basically all about that kind of thing.



    And Belgium is?

    The book in question is almost one hundred years old!



    You're picking and choosing what can and cannot be considered to be "offensive" by the measure of how much "butt hurt" it is capable of causing alone.

    You can be that way if you want, but don't pretend like it is in any sense rational.
    You're the one who is picking and choosing as much as anyone else is. You're just "butt hurt" because you disagree with the consensus and don't have a problem with the racist and colonialist depictions of the past.



    He effortlessly tames the untamable bird monster that has never been tamed, unites all of the tribes together, and is instrumental in bringing down the imperialist forces that the natives would've never had the courage to fight head on before he arrived.

    Deny it all you want, the guy is basically a purple Paul Atreides.
    You're delusional. Taming an animal doesn't make him a leader, he doesn't unite the tribes, nor is he instrumental in bringing down the invaders. And he didn't become a leader, as you falsely claimed.
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    Re: Pippi Longstocking and 6 other supposedly racist children's characters

    PS Avatar was a pretty **** film once you got past the cgi and 3d

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    Re: Pippi Longstocking and 6 other supposedly racist children's characters

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    Which simply goes to prove that some people will fabricate whatever they want to see, presume they are correct, then run around preaching the "gospel of their personal beliefs" as if it was actually worth something.

    Avatar was the story of the human race, it's greed, it's narcissism, it's arrogance, and how after ruining its own planet, and dumping members of their own species who were not "perfect" to languish in the shadows of poverty... (i.e. in a wheelchair)... it flew to distant planets, intent on plundering the wealth of others and taking it for themselves. Humans found a planet where intelligent beings lived in perfect physical and spiritual harmony. Humans then ridiculed the "religion" of the inhabitants, murdered them, tore up the flora and fauna for its own use, and eventually learned that even the most peaceful, spiritual of beings will kick the humans' self-indulgent, planet-destroying ass when they have ****ing had enough, because *gasp!* the inferior "natives" were stronger and smarter than the entirety of the human race, and unlike humans, found goodness and value on the inside rather than judging by physical usefulness.

    And you managed to turn that into "white guilt" propaganda, with racial undertones? Good lord. Get thee to a literary class immediately, then fall on your knees and beg the professor to forgive your foolish transgressions and teach you how to understand what another individual is actually trying to say via his writings instead of fabricating your own twisted version that coincides with your personal beliefs and lets you sleep at night.

    Now I shall quietly beat my head on the keyboard, and weep for my species.
    Are you really telling me that you fail to see the obvious Left Wing symbolism behind a film where evvvvviiilllll capitalist and imperialist white men descend upon (quite literally) "perfect in every way" peaceful communist natives living in harmony with nature, and are then all mercilessly slaughtered by (again, quite literally) the "power of nature" in the end?

    It is nothing less than blatant eco-nut post-colonialist wish fulfillment fantasy.

    The "racial overtones" come in the form of the main character. He is an open minded white man (i.e. a proxy for the film's intended audience) who "throws off the shackles" of his oppressive society (i.e. he stops being an evil white man) so he can become one with nature and with the natives. He also just so happens to magically be better at everything the natives do than the natives themselves (again, because he's an audience proxy), and he saves everyone from the rest of his "evil white man" compatriots at the climax of the story.

    The hilarious (and undoubtedly unintentional) implication of this is that the natives ultimately required a self-loathing white man to save them from all the other white men.

    I'm sorry, but that is sort of racist.
    Last edited by Gathomas88; 12-04-13 at 01:07 AM.

  7. #137
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    Re: Pippi Longstocking and 6 other supposedly racist children's characters

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    Are you really telling me that you fail to see the obvious Left Wing symbolism behind a film where evvvvviiilllll capitalist and imperialist white men descend upon (quite literally) "perfect in every way" peaceful communist natives living in harmony with nature, and are then all mercilessly slaughtered by (again, quite literally) the "power of nature" in the end?

    It is nothing less than blatant eco-nut post-colonialist wish fulfillment fantasy.
    Which is why your description of the movie as "invincible almighty white man teaching helpless natives and becoming their leader" is so frigging hysterical!

    The "racial overtones" come in the form of the main character. He is an open minded white man (i.e. a proxy for the film's intended audience) who "throws off the shackles" of his oppressive society (i.e. he stops being an evil white man) so he can become one with nature and with the natives. He also just so happens to magically be better at everything the natives do than the natives himself (again, because he's an audience proxy), and he saves everyone from the rest of his "evil white man" compatriots at the climax of the story.

    The hilarious (and undoubtedly unintentional) implication of this is that the natives ultimately required a self-loathing white man to save them from all the other white men.

    I'm sorry, but that is sort of racist.
    Except that he's so inept that he needs to be saved by a native woman...

    ..because he's "magically better at everything the natives do"
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  8. #138
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    Re: Pippi Longstocking and 6 other supposedly racist children's characters

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    Holy crap!!! Avatar is one of my favorite movies of all time, and reading your interpretation of it is making me want to poke out my eyes with a pickle fork!! It's worse than when my born-again daughter and her husband tried to convince me that The Chronicles of Narnia was actually a Bible story, only Jesus was played by a lion! (No, I'm not kidding... sadly)

    Dude. Whatever you're smoking, please share.
    Avatar was a film that I completely, without shame, wanted the colonizers to win.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

  9. #139
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    Re: Pippi Longstocking and 6 other supposedly racist children's characters

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Perhaps, but I think you would be running into the relativist extreme of a valid historical orientation toward historicism. I mean, we certainly instruct young people differently about popular culture regarding slavery, and I do not think outside of Gone with the Wind we tolerate happy portrayals of the so-called "peculiar institution."

    I'm not entirely making value judgments so much as showing how in the 1940s, certain value judgments were placed from the Belgians onto the Congo colony and its peoples. The fact that post-colonialists frequently have an agenda themselves is something you should certainly keep in mind, but it is frequently not my concern.

    I certainly do not advocate that we eradicate the existence of historical documents (in fact I'm still weeping over just that over my own research topic), however, what you and I tried to bring up needs further examination.

    If we can accept the concept that acculturation of Belgians, Europeans, and North Americans to accept various precepts of colonialism existed everywhere from popular culture to the schools, then let's not toss aside the virtues of indoctrination so quickly. Afterall, you're more or less defending the existence of these materials in public view, partially in deference to it being historical, and partly because to toss them aside induces cultural self-loathing. Doesn't this indicate that you are in favor, to some extent, in indoctrination as the post-colonialists are?

    My own perspective is perhaps to some extent opposite of what the post-colonialists want, but I still use their insights to argue in favor of what I may accept as perhaps "benign" nationalism. As Orwellian as that may sound, I learned from the post-structuralists and the post-modernists that indoctrination is everywhere anyhow.
    Agreed. I'm certainly not going to deny that the themes to which you refer existed in the book. I was simply arguing that they didn't necessarily need to be viewed as being "offensive" in and of themselves simply because they disagreed with "politically correct" modern socio-political norms.

    As you said, other works expressing highly dated values and social perspectives are allowed to remain in circulation (i.e. Gone with the Wind, the Merchant of Venice, and the Taming of the Shrew, to name just a few). There is really no reason to single out "colonialist" works in particular.

    If all that was wrong with "Tin Tin Goes to the Congo" were the scenes Hatuey posted (and not the racist art style, or the depiction of the native peoples as being unintelligent and worthy of ridicule), I would actually argue that it could probably be left on the shelf. It would simply be a relic of a different era, and would be explained to children as such.

  10. #140
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    Re: Pippi Longstocking and 6 other supposedly racist children's characters

    Unobtainium and giant arrows, enough said.

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