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Thread: Whole Foods employees striking over requirements to work Thanksgiving

  1. #221
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    Re: Whole Foods employees striking over requirements to work Thanksgiving

    Quote Originally Posted by Mason66 View Post
    That is not what I was replying to.

    The other poster said Thanksgiving is for family and nothing else.

    I replied that some people do not have family so what are they going to do. If they want to go to a movie on that day they should be able to do that and there should be employees working that day to accommodate them.
    I would only agree to this IF those employees agree they are willing to work the holiday. One's person's rights should not trump another.

  2. #222
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    Re: Whole Foods employees striking over requirements to work Thanksgiving

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    And even with at will employment arrangement, current employment law bars employers from disclosing false information about one's employment. If an employee did call in sick on a specific day, and can prove it in court, and the employer claimed that the employee quit, it's law$$uit time.
    Nonsense. What you describe does not constitute giving false information about employment. Quite simply, the employer can end emplyment whenever they will, again - AT WILL. That includes ending your employment when you don't show up for work. If you know your employer historically ends employment of those who do not show up for work, even with a "good" excuse on their part, then not showing up for work is defacto quitting.

    Now, in terms of unemployment insurance, a board will decide whether you are eligible. If you quit or were fired and if you are thus eligible for unemploment benefits. I've seen it go both ways.

  3. #223
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    Re: Whole Foods employees striking over requirements to work Thanksgiving

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil_Osophy View Post
    Could you post a link to an example of such a lawsuit being successful?
    Reason 4: There's always a big cost associated with firing an employee. Here is where I appeal to your selfish nature. Even if you don't give a second thought to the employee's feelings (and I know you really do), here are a few of the costs, itemized for your convenience:

    *Disruption and cost associated with recruiting, hiring, and training a replacement.

    *Unemployment compensation for terminated employee.

    *If you fight on unemployment, cost and disruption associated with that.

    *Grievance administration.

    *Disruption and cost associated with arbitration, if you have that.

    *Possibility that arbitrator will reinstate employee with back pay, anyway.

    *Cost of severance package, if you're lucky and employee takes it.

    *Cost and disruption associated with inevitable charge of discrimination if you don't offer severance or employee refuses to take it. Or complaint filed with the U.S. Department of Labor, or some other government agency. Or belated workers' comp claim. Or dealing with local personal injury lawyer who has taken employee's case.

    *Disruption and expense of litigation or defense of administrative complaint.

    *Cost of settlement, if you settle.

    *Cost of summary judgment prep, if you don't settle.

    *Cost of trial if you don't get summary judgment.

    *Potential cost if jury finds in employee's favor, including, depending on the claim, the employee's attorneys' fees.

    Four reasons your employment lawyer thinks firing should be a last resort : Employment and Labor Insider : Constangy Brooks and Smith: Insight into workplace, affirmative action, workers' compensation, occupational safety, class action, and wage and
    It may not be the way it should be, but that's the way it is.

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    Re: Whole Foods employees striking over requirements to work Thanksgiving

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Nonsense. What you describe does not constitute giving false information about employment. Quite simply, the employer can end emplyment whenever they will, again - AT WILL. That includes ending your employment when you don't show up for work. If you know your employer historically ends employment of those who do not show up for work, even with a "good" excuse on their part, then not showing up for work is defacto quitting.
    That arrangement would have to be well-documented, on paper, and accessible to the employee.

    Even it were legal, no one would want to work for such a place. The smart employee would just post the agreement online somewhere on some blog (likely anonymously) to discredit the employer. Similar things have happened before. . .

    Fired Amy's Baking Company Employee Reportedly Gives Reddit AMA, Calls Owner 'Demonic'

  5. #225
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    Re: Whole Foods employees striking over requirements to work Thanksgiving

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    It may not be the way it should be, but that's the way it is.
    None of what that link says (which is itself a bunch of fluffy generalized nonsense coming from someone with a horse in the race) shows any of what you are saying. Again, the individual state board can just as easily rule that the employee quit by not showing up for work. But they are most likely to rule (at least from my experience here in Oregon) for the employer. In California, most likely not. It depends upon the state and the county board and the nature of the employment contract.

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    Re: Whole Foods employees striking over requirements to work Thanksgiving

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    None of what that link says (which is itself a bunch of fluffy generalized nonsense coming from someone with a horse in the race)
    About the author of that article. . .

    Robin Shea has more than 20 years' experience in employment litigation, including Title VII and the Age Discrimination in Employment Act, the Americans with Disabilities Act (including the Amendments Act), the Genetic Information Non-Discrimination Act, the Equal Pay Act, and the Family and Medical Leave Act; and class and collective actions under the Fair Labor Standards Act and state wage-hour laws; defense of audits by the Office of Federal Contract Compliance Programs; and labor relations.

    Robin E. Shea: Constangy, Brooks & Smith, LLP

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    Re: Whole Foods employees striking over requirements to work Thanksgiving

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    That arrangement would have to be well-documented, on paper, and accessible to the employee.

    Even it were legal, no one would want to work for such a place. The smart employee would just post the agreement online somewhere on some blog (likely anonymously) to discredit the employer. Similar things have happened before. . .

    Fired Amy's Baking Company Employee Reportedly Gives Reddit AMA, Calls Owner 'Demonic'
    More nonsense and shows a total ignorance as to what At Will employment entails. Not to mention, the former employee's posts may be actionable. However, I see no evidence in the matter that Amy's Baking Company is At Will employment.

    Btw:

    At-will employment is a term used in U.S. labor law for contractual relationships in which an employee can be dismissed by an employer for any reason (that is, without having to establish "just cause" for termination), and without warning.[1] When an employee is acknowledged as being hired "at will", courts deny the employee any claim for loss resulting from the dismissal. The rule is justified by its proponents on the basis that an employee may be similarly entitled to leave his or her job without reason or warning.[2] In contrast, the practice is seen as unjust by those who view the employment relationship as characterised by inequality of bargaining power.[3]

    Source
    Be sure to read on at the source for state by state exclusions and exemptions.

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    Re: Whole Foods employees striking over requirements to work Thanksgiving

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    About the author of that article. . .
    Precisely, Robin has a stake in one side of the game. That's probably why, instead of citing legal reason for not firing employees she couches the whole thing in flowery language that won't mean a thing when you meet before the unemployment board for your state/county.

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    Re: Whole Foods employees striking over requirements to work Thanksgiving

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    More nonsense and shows a total ignorance as to what At Will employment entails.
    The "at will" arrangement doesn't absolve an employer from employment termination suits. Any employer that fired an employee for calling in sick, and then later claimed, without documentation, that the employee quit, while the employee could prove the sick call, can be sued.

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    Re: Whole Foods employees striking over requirements to work Thanksgiving

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Precisely, Robin has a stake in one side of the game.
    what side would that be? Explain. FYI, she's a lawyer, you're not.

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