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Thread: Corporations Aren't People

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    Re: Corporations Aren't People

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    The business owner is being made to decide between violating their religious beliefs or hurting their business.
    Why do you believe that to be the case? Simply making something available to secular and temporal, but civil Persons in our republic, is not violating your religious beliefs as long as you, yourself are willing to abstain.

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    Re: Corporations Aren't People

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    1.)The business owner is being made to decide between violating their religious beliefs or hurting their business.
    2.) Individual liberty for the employee is not being damaged in anyway.
    3.) If the employer does not purchase it for them, they can purchase it for themselves.
    4.) Individual liberty does not include having someone else purchase BC for you. That is the opposite of individual liberty.
    1.)This is simply not true at all, it doesnt violate thier religious beliefs they are still free to have them
    2.) yes it is they are forced to see coverage elsewhere BECAUSE of the owners religion so the owners religion, this directly effect their liberty and liberties that are not effect for any other reason except the owner make the decision based on his religion regardless of how it effects others. You have it completely backwards
    not to mention the employer isnt purchasing anything
    3.) the employer isny buying it and see #2
    4.) see 2 and 3 you have it completely backwards.
    the employee will have to do something different than other employees and something outside of the rule based on the owners religion.

    again Hobby Lobby simple doesnt get special rules for it, its not a church its a company and it must play by the same rules as us all
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    Re: Corporations Aren't People

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Thought this was worth a view:

    Watch The Daily Show definitively prove that corporations are not people

    This time, Stewart summed up the fines these banks are paying for their lucrative wrongdoing in his best Brooklyn mobster voice: "I'm sorry I committed systemic fraud for 10 years. How about I give you a cut of it?" The mantra in white-collar banking, he added, is "Don't do the crime if you can't pay the nominal fine."

    But banks aren't the only bad actors in the corporate world. Stewart pointed out a recent $2 billion fine Johnson & Johnson paid to settle charges they bribed doctors to prescribe useless drugs to the elderly, the disabled, and infants "You're not even allowed to do that in Grand Theft Auto!" he protested.

    Watch The Daily Show definitively prove that corporations are not people - The Week
    Sigh..I don't watch the daily show and I don't plan to start now.

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    Re: Corporations Aren't People

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.)This is simply not true at all, it doesnt violate thier religious beliefs they are still free to have them
    Being forced to pay for something that is against your religion, is being forced to violate your religion. It is one of the reasons abortion is specifically excluded from federal funding.

    2.) yes it is they are forced to see coverage elsewhere BECAUSE of the owners religion so the owners religion, this directly effect their liberty and liberties that are not effect for any other reason except the owner make the decision based on his religion regardless of how it effects others. You have it completely backwards
    not to mention the employer isnt purchasing anything
    The employer is purchasing and providing coverage to the employee. Not receiving free birth control paid for by another, is simply not a violation of individual liberty of the employee.

    the employee will have to do something different than other employees and something outside of the rule based on the owners religion.
    Doing something different then other employees is not a violation of liberty. Some employees prior to the ACA, had to seek BC outside of their plan. Some didn't. Some employees are paid differently then other employees. There are many things that some employees of one firm have to do differently then other employees of another firm. Just because they have do do "something different", is not a violation of individual liberty.

    The SC will ultimately decide. I suspect it will be 5-4 decision whichever way. We'll see shortly.

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    Re: Corporations Aren't People

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Sigh..I don't watch the daily show and I don't plan to start now.
    Your loss. It was spot on.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Corporations Aren't People

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    If government is not there as a force to control large powerful billion dollar corporations, who is going to do it?
    the people who should

    the shareholders



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    Re: Corporations Aren't People

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    Being forced to pay for something that is against your religion, is being forced to violate your religion.
    No. That's an issue of moral convictions, not subjection of your religious freedom. BIG difference.

    It is one of the reasons abortion is specifically excluded from federal funding.
    Wrong again! That's an issue of tax dollars being spent on a personal choice.

    The employer is purchasing and providing coverage to the employee.
    It's a joint venture. If the employee chooses NOT to participate in the employer-sponsored insurance plan, the business owner is not harmed. Thus, we're right back to my standing position: If the employer doesn't want to provide insurance to his employees under the law, pay the fine and be done with it!

    Not receiving free birth control paid for by another, is simply not a violation of individual liberty of the employee.
    Agreed considering there are other avenues whereby the employee/individual could obtain needed birth control, i.e., local public health department.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Sigh..I don't watch the daily show and I don't plan to start now.
    I watched the Daily Show clip and it's spot on!

    If corporations really were people, then they'd be prosecuted to fullest extent of the law when they, in fact, violate the law. But few corporations face "jail time" or are forced to close their doors because they committed a criminal act. In fact, few corporate exec. ever see jail time. The last big corporation exec. I recall to ever face prison time was ENRON's President, Jeff Skilling.

    If a corporation does do harm to the public, generally speaking the worse penalty they face to atone for their misdeed is pay a fine and usually said fine is far less than the actual cost of the wrongdoing that was committed. Moreover, the corporation doesn't even have to admit to committing any wrongdoing. A slap on the wrist is generally all they get and they get to walk away relatively unscathed. But if a real person commits a crime, that individual very likely will go to jail and pay a fine. Seems to me, WE, THE PEOPLE, should be the ones feeling victimized here, not the corporation.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 12-06-13 at 09:47 PM.
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    Re: Corporations Aren't People

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    the people who should

    the shareholders
    The shareholders are only interested in money and money knows no Patriotic Allegiance. Money is loyal to the strong currency. It's bean counters, profit , loss, liabilities, and glossy portfolios and don't let them see Nuke Waste that will last half a million years and discuss their operating plans to discharge this liability. It is simple. When liability exceeds profit, it is time for bankruptcy because that is what the vehicle/corporation is designed for. Skip out on the responsibility. Leave that to real persons.

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    Re: Corporations Aren't People

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    The shareholders are only interested in money and money knows no Patriotic Allegiance. Money is loyal to the strong currency. It's bean counters, profit , loss, liabilities, and glossy portfolios and don't let them see Nuke Waste that will last half a million years and discuss their operating plans to discharge this liability. It is simple. When liability exceeds profit, it is time for bankruptcy because that is what the vehicle/corporation is designed for. Skip out on the responsibility. Leave that to real persons.
    government bureaucrats are interested only in power. trying to limit corporate power by increasing government power is an idiotic concept.



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    Re: Corporations Aren't People

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    government bureaucrats are interested only in power. trying to limit corporate power by increasing government power is an idiotic concept.
    How so? Please provide some evidence for this claim.
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