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Thread: FDA Proposes Trans Fat Ban.....

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    Re: FDA Proposes Trans Fat Ban.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    How long until government healthcare has the power to dictate what exactly we eat to control longterm healthcare costs?
    It's an important concern. The other side of that coin is that if I do have to subsidize healthcare in this country, and I do (through hospitals, medicare, Medicaid, etc.), then I really don't want you eating **** that's known to be unhealthy in any quantity for basically business shelf-life reasons. It would make no sense. If you want to be quick about the answer, it's when the U.S. becomes a dictatorship is when that would occur. Since it's not, and there are a lot of checks and balances, a lot of politics and public involvement and it does slowly appear to adapt to more modern culture and science (too slowly for some, too fast for others), I don't think there is any real risk of government controlling what we eat. I don't think anyone would stand for it, it's outrageous and we are in now way realistically close to that.

    Using that as rhetoric to whip up conservatives may have benefit in politics, but I would hope 90% of democrats/liberals would likewise reject government dictating exactly what we eat under normal circumstances.

    If something is demonstrably unhealthy, banning it in the U.S. as a food additive seems reasonable.

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    Re: FDA Proposes Trans Fat Ban.....

    Quote Originally Posted by SMTA View Post
    It doesn't list poisons and Agent Orange either - do you want to make them readily available also?
    Apples and oranges.
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    Re: FDA Proposes Trans Fat Ban.....

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    "This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding."

    That's from Article 6 of the US Constitution, which does allow the Federal government to pass whatever laws it feels appropriate. Without that provision, people would still be killing people with snake oil remedies. Transfat is just another kind of snake oil.
    Talking about a broad interpretation. Note the first part that you bolded, particularly the "made in pursuance thereof". What exactly do you think that means?
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    Re: FDA Proposes Trans Fat Ban.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Talking about a broad interpretation. Note the first part that you bolded, particularly the "made in pursuance thereof". What exactly do you think that means?
    This goes to the general welfare clause. And, of course, people dying due to heart attacks caused by food additives comes under general welfare. This is no different than the government shutting down those who sold snake oil remedies that injured and killed people in the 1800's and early 1900's.
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    Re: FDA Proposes Trans Fat Ban.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Apples and oranges.
    The FDA isn't telling you what you can and can not eat. It is telling businesses what they can't add to food.

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    This goes to the general welfare clause. And, of course, people dying due to heart attacks caused by food additives comes under general welfare. This is no different than the government shutting down those who sold snake oil that injured and killed people in the 1800's.
    It goes to the govts' power to protect my rights, particularly my right to life. Putting poison in my food infringes on my right to life

    It also goes to the govt's power to regulate interstate commerce.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: FDA Proposes Trans Fat Ban.....

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    This goes to the general welfare clause. And, of course, people dying due to heart attacks caused by food additives comes under general welfare. This is no different than the government shutting down those who sold snake oil remedies that injured and killed people in the 1800's and early 1900's.
    1: The General Welfare Clause has to do with taxes. Not the welfare of the people. If it had meant the "welfare of the people" then it would have said just that "of the people".

    2: The US government did not try to stop snake oil hucksters until 1906 with the Food and Drugs act. So kiss the 1800's bye bye. Now why do you figure they waited over 100 years before trying to stop such? Why didn't the 1st or 2nd or even 3rd Congress try to stop such things? Assuming that is what the General Welfare Clause actually meant of course. Do you think that they didn't have such hucksters back then?

    3: Trans Fat occurs naturally in many foods. For example most any dairy products and meat. If they ban companies from selling it what happens to those foods?
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    Re: FDA Proposes Trans Fat Ban.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    1: The General Welfare Clause has to do with taxes. Not the welfare of the people. If it had meant the "welfare of the people" then it would have said just that "of the people".

    2: The US government did not try to stop snake oil hucksters until 1906 with the Food and Drugs act. So kiss the 1800's bye bye. Now why do you figure they waited over 100 years before trying to stop such? Why didn't the 1st or 2nd or even 3rd Congress try to stop such things? Assuming that is what the General Welfare Clause actually meant of course. Do you think that they didn't have such hucksters back then?

    3: Trans Fat occurs naturally in many foods. For example most any dairy products and meat. If they ban companies from selling it what happens to those foods?
    Trans fats occur naturally in very small quantities. The transfats that are being banned occur in hydrogenated vegetable oils, which are artificially produced, and these trasfats are in very large quantities. Just like snake oil. They kill people, which gives the government the right to regulate them.
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    Re: FDA Proposes Trans Fat Ban.....

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Trans fats occur naturally in very small quantities. The transfats that are being banned occur in hydrogenated vegetable oils, which are artificially produced, and these trasfats are in very large quantities. Just like snake oil. They kill people, which gives the government the right to regulate them.
    How many miles to the gallon did they say they get from Vegetable Oil?

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    Re: FDA Proposes Trans Fat Ban.....

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    The FDA isn't telling you what you can and can not eat. It is telling businesses what they can't add to food.
    Sophistry is all that is. Who is the end target for such laws? The people.

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    It goes to the govts' power to protect my rights, particularly my right to life. Putting poison in my food infringes on my right to life
    Trans Fat occurs naturally in dairy products and meat. Do you want the government to ban all those too?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    It also goes to the govt's power to regulate interstate commerce.
    The Federal government was never meant to ban products even with the interstate commerce clause. That particular clause was just originally meant to make it to where the prices were basically the same. IE They prevented one state from selling to one state really cheap while charging another state outragously and putting huge taxes on another states imported product. The fact that it got expanded to what it is now has hurt this country more than any other expansion of government power.
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    Re: FDA Proposes Trans Fat Ban.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Sophistry is all that is. Who is the end target for such laws? The people.
    Nope. The FDA can't forbid people from eating anything.


    Trans Fat occurs naturally in dairy products and meat. Do you want the government to ban all those too?
    This has already been addressed and the FDA is not even considering a ban on natural occurring trans fats; just the addition of manufactured trans fats.




    The Federal government was never meant to ban products even with the interstate commerce clause. That particular clause was just originally meant to make it to where the prices were basically the same. IE They prevented one state from selling to one state really cheap while charging another state outragously and putting huge taxes on another states imported product. The fact that it got expanded to what it is now has hurt this country more than any other expansion of government power.
    Nonsense. There's nothing in the constitution that limits the govt's power to regulate interstate commerce that suggests they are not allowed to ban products nor limit that power to situations where prices were basically the same.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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