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Thread: California's brown signs bill permitting non-physician abortions [W:307]

  1. #61
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    Re: Liberals war on women takes big advance

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    no, the limitations are very key. Hence why I cited them in my post where I asked the question
    no, since those limitations have no impact on the meds/procedure according to the medical community. hence why they are meaningless and the question has been answered.
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    Re: California's brown signs bill permitting non-physician abortions

    I took my car to a guy today to get inspected, he is certified to do car inspections but hey i know, im going to worry about if he is also qualified to rebuild BMW engines from scratch.
    WHo cares he is certified to do inspections if he cant build a engine from scratch my car is in extra danger. lol
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    Re: Liberals war on women takes big advance

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    not only is it written into the bill and the bill as already been quoted here TWICE and this training referred too THREE times it excised BEFORE the bill.
    1)Did you read the entire bill when it was cited here? I doubt it, so let's not act like you did

    2) if it is in the bill, then simply cite the text

    no concern needed unless one is concerned the whole medical system is broken regulations, training, certification wise.
    are you kidding me? We had a case in PA where the entire medical safety net was hijacked in the name of ideology and patient safety was totally thrown out the window with multiple deaths simply being ignored. So concern here is more than warranted

  4. #64
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    Re: Liberals war on women takes big advance

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    In what circumstances would an anesthesiologist would be working without a doctor?

    PS they're schooling on the subject is also very specialized and the type of situations they can operate is very limited. In such circumstances that is completely acceptable, because concern is clearly being shown for the potential risk. No one has shown an equal concern here
    Well they would be in the same building but the Nurse Anesthesiologist would pretty much handle the patient from start to finish. They are cheaper than paying a full MD anesthesiologist. They do have a crap ton of extra training but it's also much riskier than a first trimester abortion.

    This is written into the bill cited into the OP, or just some general statement that might not even apply here? If it's the former I am ok with that. But after the Gosnell case, I am very skeptical of initiatives that attempt to further access to abortion, witthout explicite measures taken for safety
    It's written in the bill. Per the LA Times only a handful of Nurse Practitioners have received the required training in order to perform abortions currently.

    I think the midwife system is completely archaic. So citing it does little to alleviate my concerns here
    They are still Nurse Practitioners. It involves certifications and tests but calling them a Midwife is just archaic terminology.

    It's just my belief that Nurse practitioners are about to being doing a lot in our medical system that they didn't do before. The Baby Boomers retiring will see to that.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: California's brown signs bill permitting non-physician abortions

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    I took my car to a guy today to get inspected, he is certified to do car inspections but hey i know, im going to worry about if he is also qualified to rebuild BMW engines from scratch.
    WHo cares he is certified to do inspections if he cant build a engine from scratch my car is in extra danger. lol
    1) your junker isn't a BMW regardless of what your scrawl on the side.

    2) People need to get certified, specifically to do inspections.

    3) Inspections are nowhere as complicated as doing the mechanical work on the individual components

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    Re: Liberals war on women takes big advance

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    1)Did you read the entire bill when it was cited here? I doubt it, so let's not act like you did

    2) if it is in the bill, then simply cite the text

    3.)are you kidding me? We had a case in PA where the entire medical safety net was hijacked in the name of ideology and patient safety was totally thrown out the window with multiple deaths simply being ignored. So concern here is more than warranted
    1.) there you go making stuff up again and failing and getting destroyed again, did say i read the entire bill but the parts quoted referred to the training, when i quoted it i even bloded it, colored it and underlined it.

    did you even read this thread? guess not so dont act like you did

    2.) sure no problem go to posts 4# and 24$ , your mistake and your welcome for the education

    3.) nope, extra concern isnt needed because people BREAKING THE LAW can happen no matter what they are. Especially based on your example.
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    Re: Liberals war on women takes big advance

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    Well they would be in the same building
    exactly my point. And training to be an anesthetist is very demanding and technical.

    but the Nurse Anesthesiologist would pretty much handle the patient from start to finish. They are cheaper than paying a full MD anesthesiologist. They do have a crap ton of extra training but it's also much riskier than a first trimester abortion.
    Hey, if there is adequate training here I am cool with it, but no one has cited anything to show that is the case. And with recent events in PA, one thing we know without a doubt, is that pro-abortion interests that totally over run legitimate concerns for patient safety

    So I am not going to simply assume adequate safety measures have taken place until I see proof of such.

    Sorry, my first concern is patient safety, not pushing my views on abortion


    It's written in the bill. Per the LA Times only a handful of Nurse Practitioners have received the required training in order to perform abortions currently.
    But what is the training and certification process? I did not see anything covering such, besides the statement that a certification existed. Does that mean they showed up at an office, or something more demanding?


    They are still Nurse Practitioners. It involves certifications and tests but calling them a Midwife is just archaic terminology.

    It's just my belief that Nurse practitioners are about to being doing a lot in our medical system that they didn't do before. The Baby Boomers retiring will see to that.
    I know a few midwives. They are not well supervised by the state.

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    Re: Liberals war on women takes big advance

    [QUOTE=AGENT J;1062409665]1.) there you go making stuff up again and failing and getting destroyed again, did say i read the entire bill but the parts quoted referred to the training, when i quoted it i even bloded it, colored it and underlined it.[/quoted]

    merely citing that they received 'training does not mean it was adequate. Example: Gosnell was subject to state oversight. But how it was leveraged meant such was meaningless

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    Re: California's brown signs bill permitting non-physician abortions

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    1) your junker isn't a BMW regardless of what your scrawl on the side.

    2) People need to get certified, specifically to do inspections.

    3) Inspections are nowhere as complicated as doing the mechanical work on the individual components
    1.) nice try but it is but please further expose yourself though
    2.) sure do that why i said it and people need certifications to give out certain meds and do procedures, THANK YOU for proving my point
    3.) very very true thats why the education/training for medical procedures/certs is even more intense and thier are even over-site orgs that regulate this stuff which must be followes. WOW thanks for even further proving the facts and making my point

    very good!
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    Re: Liberals war on women takes big advance

    Quote Originally Posted by DrunkenAsparagus View Post
    I thought that as a conservative, Breitbart would love the free market being allowed to work. Greater competition means that consumers will be even more protected, because patients will have more options when it comes to their abortions. Bad practitioners will be pressured to improve or go out of business. Even then if he didn't agree with this, the same safety standards apply. And don't tell me that his line isn't just him editorializing. He didn't actually cite anyone, and it was the only opinion in the article. It's his opinion, which he never bothers to back up with evidence.

    If you oppose abortions, talk about restricting abortions. Advocating for these extra "safety regulations" and then claiming that you are only looking out for women's safety is a complete load of horse****. If you oppose abortion, fine, talk about that, but the vast majority of laws currently being passed and advocated by pro-lifers goes far and away from keeping women safe and only seeks to restrict abortions.
    First of all, Breitbart didn't write the article, he died [RIP] back in 2012. The article was written by Joel Pollak. For another thing, cited in the article was this Sacramento Bee piece

    Another View: Abortion access bill is misleading and unnecessary - Viewpoints - The Sacramento Bee


    "What is the real motive behind AB 154?

    The University of San Francisco Bixby Center for Global Reproductive Health study the authors cite as demonstrating that lower-level clinicians can safely perform surgical abortions specifically targets “low-income and minority women” for increased “access” to abortion. Since Medi-Cal pays for abortion, clinics have a financial incentive to expand abortions in poor neighborhoods. It also cites the Affordable Care Act, which will vastly expand the number of people on Medi-Cal. Abortion providers hope to tap this new market by expanding the number of clinicians and clinics that can provide surgical abortions.

    Meanwhile, the abortion industry is thriving. According to 2010 tax records, nine “nonprofit” Planned Parenthood affiliates in California spent $1.8 million on lobbying alone. "


    So, yes, everyone has their opinions, along with you and yours...and if you think Pro lifers are ONLY looking out for children and not looking out these mainly young and manipulated women, well...speaking of opinions, IMO, what they say about opinions certainly applies in spades to yours in this case...
    "...But resist we much, we must and we will much, about that be committed..." --- the right Reverend Alfred Charles "Al" Shaprton, Jr.

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