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Thread: John Boehner: Obama owns this shutdown now

  1. #261
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    Re: John Boehner: Obama owns this shutdown now

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Obama doesn't control Beohner..the tea party does and they are thrilled the gubbamint is shut down and some would like to see it made permanent. So how do you negotiate with that?
    Can you provide ONE credible source that supports ANY ONE 'Tea Partier' in Congress is thrilled?
    "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure" - 2006 Senator Obama...leadership failure indeed!

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    Re: John Boehner: Obama owns this shutdown now

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    EVERY time I see this claim it makes me want to pull my hair out! You DO realize 8 (20%) of those ~40 WERE ACA amendments that both the Senate passed AND the president SIGNED...right? Further MANY of the others were not 'trying to repeal' as you claim...
    Health Care - GOP.gov

    It NEVER ceases to amaze me how often erroneous rhetoric is believed and repeated BY ALL SIDES!
    Do you have a source besides the Republican party's website? Something a bit less biased perhaps?

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    Re: John Boehner: Obama owns this shutdown now

    Quote Originally Posted by reinoe View Post
    Do you have a source besides the Republican party's website? Something a bit less biased perhaps?
    Why would I need to? The specific points are linked within the page to the congressional record...I really cannot think of a more FACTUAL source.
    "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure" - 2006 Senator Obama...leadership failure indeed!

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    Re: John Boehner: Obama owns this shutdown now

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    Can you provide ONE credible source that supports ANY ONE 'Tea Partier' in Congress is thrilled?
    "Why would I need to?" It's on FoxNews, I'm shocked that you didn't know.....


    "This is about the happiest I've seen members in a long time....",


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    Re: John Boehner: Obama owns this shutdown now

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    "Why would I need to?" It's on FoxNews, I'm shocked that you didn't know.....


    "This is about the happiest I've seen members in a long time....",
    Now Fox News is a credible source?...seems hypocritical...

    But thank you for this. I don't watch Hannity as his 'over the top' hyperbole is intolerable...as most of Bachmann's is.
    "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure" - 2006 Senator Obama...leadership failure indeed!

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    Re: John Boehner: Obama owns this shutdown now

    Quote Originally Posted by FederalRepublic View Post
    Pretty reasonable write-up, except that you utterly ignore the other end of the negotiations. Do you think the left wing extremist democrats who are controlling the senate and the white house might suffer from a lack of proportionality? They obviously think the ACA is a BFD, otherwise they'd compromise and we wouldn't be sitting here with a government shutdown.
    Alternative paths toward addressing the ACA exist without shutting down the government and/or threatening a debt ceiling-related crisis. Those alternatives include:

    1. Funding (if that's the path the GOP wants to take): Restrict funding when it comes to the HHS appropriations legislation.
    2. Review: Work to establish an independent body or ask the GAO to review the ACA within a year to see where the problems exist, its impact on the insurance market, its impact on reducing the number of uninsured persons, its fiscal impact, etc.
    3. Legislate reforms: Reform proposals could be introduced and pursued. Those based on empirical data would be strongest (option #2 is one such approach that would provide useful data).
    4. Build a Senate majority and win the Presidency: That way, the GOP would be in a position to reform, even repeal, the ACA.

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    Re: John Boehner: Obama owns this shutdown now

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    Alternative paths toward addressing the ACA exist without shutting down the government and/or threatening a debt ceiling-related crisis. Those alternatives include:

    1. Funding (if that's the path the GOP wants to take): Restrict funding when it comes to the HHS appropriations legislation.
    2. Review: Work to establish an independent body or ask the GAO to review the ACA within a year to see where the problems exist, its impact on the insurance market, its impact on reducing the number of uninsured persons, its fiscal impact, etc.
    3. Legislate reforms: Reform proposals could be introduced and pursued. Those based on empirical data would be strongest (option #2 is one such approach that would provide useful data).
    4. Build a Senate majority and win the Presidency: That way, the GOP would be in a position to reform, even repeal, the ACA.
    Option number 1 is the reason why the government shut down. Republicans decided not to provide funding for implementation of a bad law and democrats refuse to go along with anything that doesn't have said funding included. It's a political game and both sides are doing it because that's the way the game is played.

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    Re: John Boehner: Obama owns this shutdown now

    Quote Originally Posted by FederalRepublic View Post
    Option number 1 is the reason why the government shut down. Republicans decided not to provide funding for implementation of a bad law and democrats refuse to go along with anything that doesn't have said funding included. It's a political game and both sides are doing it because that's the way the game is played.
    Option 1 only deals with HHS funding, not appropriations for the whole federal government. Moreover, it should be noted that the ACA has mandatory elements with their own revenue stream. Hence, it does not rely mainly or wholly on the appropriations process for funding. Therefore, the shutdown has not prevented its implementation.

    http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R43246.pdf

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    Re: John Boehner: Obama owns this shutdown now

    Quote Originally Posted by reinoe View Post
    So then why aren't these Republicans holding Medicare's funding hostage? F.y.i. if it was the government offering the insurance and not private companies would you be ok with it? Because single-payer was on the table during the drafting period and Republican opposition killed it.
    One thing at a time. Besides, republicans aren't necessarily against the existence of a safety net. Do you believe it's possible to have a safety net without forcing everyone into it whether they want to be in it or not?

    Don't kid yourself on republican opposition to single payer. Non-radical democrat opposition killed single-payer. Republicans couldn't have done anything to stop it.

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    Re: John Boehner: Obama owns this shutdown now

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    Option 1 only deals with HHS funding, not appropriations for the whole federal government. Moreover, it should be noted that the ACA has mandatory elements with their own revenue stream. Hence, it does not rely mainly or wholly on the appropriations process for funding. Therefore, the shutdown has not prevented its implementation.

    http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R43246.pdf
    Which is all the republicans can do at the moment.

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