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http://www.businessinsider.com/13-people-including-3-year-old-boy-shot-at-a-chicago-s

Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Is it possible for this forum to have a discussion about tragic murders without going off on a gun control debate? Ever?

Guns or no guns, we gotta get to the root of the problem. Poverty, illicit drugs, and the military-industrial complex fuel this violence far more than the presence or absence of gun control ever could.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Oh, I agree with you.

The biggest problem I see, outside of the obvious issue of an embarassing lack of responsible fathers, is that they do not promote and hold up people that should be seen as pillars of the community. Anyone within who speaks up and lives an exemplary life is shunned, silenced, and ridiculed.

Not only do they kill their own, they sabotage anything positive around them.

Like-Like-Like
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

The solution will never come top pass as long as there are;
Drugs
No education
No parents
No "friends"
No counselor
No youth clubs
No respect
No belief there is a way out
Call it "The Formula"
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Exactly. I cannot understand why good people choose to live in these war zones. Why they don't rise up enmass and kick the bangers out of the neighborhood. Why they don't step up and identify these thugs and get rid of them. The Wild West did it with vigilante law enforcement

As much as I despise them, one of the few thing the NOI did that could be describes as "great" was their work to push criminals and drug dealers out of black ghettos. Unfortunately they're racist scumbags and don't carry enough influence these days to make a real impact.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Exactly. I cannot understand why good people choose to live in these war zones. Why they don't rise up enmass and kick the bangers out of the neighborhood. Why they don't step up and identify these thugs and get rid of them. The Wild West did it with vigilante law enforcement.

Because they can't. A person will be more assailed by the the criminal justice system than the criminals they are trying to run off.

So slogans are so drilled to people that they are accepted as truism. Vigilantes the worst criminals of all is one of those. The legal and criminal justice system will not tolerate competition with their industry.

If GZ has shot and killed Martin while robbing Martin, wouldn't even make a mention in national news. If GZ has been a Latino gang member who shot Martin because he was a random killing or because Martin was black, that also wouldn't make the news. But a looks-white neighborhood vigilante shoot's black kid? OMG!!!

You are completely right the only solution is to just get out of there.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

True. And missing persons (even if they are missing for LONG time) aren't counted there too. These are just reported murders.

Rahm Emanuel must be proud. I wonder if Obama will have him over for Christmas or Hannukah celebrations at the WH to congratulate him on his bang up job.

True, murdered people whose bodies are not fund are just counted as "missing."
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Because they're at the mercy of the criminals and they know it. Because they would stand the chance of being prosecuted for defending themselves or for taking any kind of provocative action against the gangbangers in their neighborhoods. SOME people would rather we tolerate them. It also wouldn't be surprising if some law enforcement officials are bought and paid for by gangsters. Would YOU trust your local law enforcement? These people who are caught in these war zones don't know who to trust IMO.

Also, many poor people don't have the luxury to just up and move. A lot of them are stuck in these situations without many opportunities afforded to them as far as living arrangements go.

They might apply for refugee status and get into Canada??

Or we could just arm them all and let it work itself out like we do in other countries.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Is it possible for this forum to have a discussion about tragic murders without going off on a gun control debate? Ever?

Guns or no guns, we gotta get to the root of the problem. Poverty, illicit drugs, and the military-industrial complex fuel this violence far more than the presence or absence of gun control ever could.

Its way beyond the Military industrial complex that fuels this.....the divide is Right here. Almost damn near like the Sunni and Shia. But just not based on that concept. The Concept here is......the Folks and the People. Which doesn't include the Jamaicans. Although do take note of the last I listed here. These are just the 100 that top inside the City Limits. I have only put up some of the more known names. Which goes with them anywhere in the Country. East Coast, West Coast, Down South Mash-up. Any else coming here.....like the Bloods and Crips. They were forced to ride People and Folks too. Same with any out of NY.

Street gangs in Chicago, Illinois

Asian street gangs in Chicago

1.Asian Boyz
2.Black Shadow
3.Black Widows

Folk street gangs in Chicago

7.Ambrose
9.Black Disciples
12.Gangster Disciples (GD), branches include Eight ball Posse, Insane Gangster Disciples and Hellraisers
13.Gangster Party People
14.Harrison Gents
15.Insane C-Notes
16.Insane Campbell Boys

People street gangs in Chicago

46.Black P Stones (braches include Apache Stones, Jet Black Stones, Titanic Stones, Ruben Night Stones, Jabari Stones, & Black Stone Villans)
47.Four Corner Hustlers
48.Familia Stones
49.Gaylords
50.Insane Popes (South Side)
63.Spanish Lords
66.Vice Lords (Branches include the Conservative VLs, Unknown VLs, Insane VLs, Renegade VLs, Mafia Insane VLs, Imperial Insane VLs, Cicero Insane VLs, Spanish VLs, Traveler VLs, Outlaw Lunatic Traveler VLs, Ebony VLs, Gangster Stone VLs, Undertaker VLs, & 4VLs.)

72.Almighty Latin King / Queen Nation (ALKQN)
73.Aztecas
74.Aztec Souls
84.La Onda
86.Latin Mafia
93.South Deering Boys
94.Sawyer Boys
95.The Arabian Posse.....snip~

Street gangs in Chicago, Illinois | StreetGangs.Com

Note: the Kings, The Vice Lords, The Stones, and the Gangster Disciples all have political backing and all act as activists for voting.
 
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Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

This is the bulk of Chicago's Gun Problems and that of many others Major urban cities. One thing is a fact.....no amount of gun laws. Will stop these types from getting guns and weapons. Gun Control.....wont solve this problem.

Gangs and Politicians: Map of Chicago Gangs.....

Experts estimate that there are 70,000 to 125,000 gang members in Chicago—a population that, on the low end, rivals Evanston’s and, on the high end, exceeds Springfield’s. Over the years, Chicago’s street gangs have formed two loose alliances: the People and the Folks. According to information from the Chicago Police Department, which tracks gang boundaries, here are the five largest gangs and where they reign.

C201201-Gangs-and-Politics-Gang-Map.jpg
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

I heard a really good report on NPR about how violent crime is going up because El Chapo Guzman has set up Chicago as the Sinaloa Cartel's "hub" for their midwest drug distribution network.

When I first read the OP it reminded me of what happened in Ciudad Juarez where the party for a 13 year old was shot up and many were killed, but taht was Los Zetas.

The Sinaloa Cartel, at least here in Mexico, do not do things like that.

Maybe there is a connection but it is more likely a local gang problem.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Solutions:

1. Create a volunteer repeat offender exile program. Instead of prison, offer qualifying convicts the opportunity to permanently leave the United States NEVER to return again to a host country willing to accept them. The convict irrevocably loses their American citizenship, is banned from entering the US for life and must agree to live under the laws of their new country including penalties if those laws are broken that might or might not include cruel and unusual punishment by American constitutional standards. The convict gets to start fresh and turn over new leaf. The host country gets the economic boost from American money being sent from families to help the former convict get established and a new US tourist industry from family and friends of the former convict to places few Americans would ever visit.

2. Create a voluntary public employee mentoring program. For those who choose, allocate a portion of police officers' paid work week to at risk youth mentoring programs such as the Police Athletic League. I'm talking about really young kids before the gangs get to them. Possibly extend the program to other city and state employees, especially those who work in law enforcement in some capacity and first responders.

3. Unless they suffer from medical conditions that are compounded by their use or claim a faith related exemption, require people on public assistance to be on doctor prescribed birth control their use until they are gainfully employed and no longer on government assistance.

4. Make prison less pleasant. No TV. No or limited air-conditioning. No or limited heat. No hot water. Horrible food; no salt or other seasonings and room temperature food and drinks. Require prisoners to grow much of their own food on prison farms. Create prison web pages where the public may access pages where live webcams can watch various areas of each prison 24/7 and see how miserable they are.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

I heard a really good report on NPR about how violent crime is going up because El Chapo Guzman has set up Chicago as the Sinaloa Cartel's "hub" for their midwest drug distribution network.

So, basically, a ban on guns won't do anything, because if they can get the drugs in, they can get the guns in.

This is clear cut proof that a gun ban will do nothing but insure that only the bad guys will have guns.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Solutions:

1. Create a volunteer repeat offender exile program. Instead of prison, offer qualifying convicts the opportunity to permanently leave the United States NEVER to return again to a host country willing to accept them. The convict irrevocably loses their American citizenship, is banned from entering the US for life and must agree to live under the laws of their new country including penalties if those laws are broken that might or might not include cruel and unusual punishment by American constitutional standards. The convict gets to start fresh and turn over new leaf. The host country gets the economic boost from American money being sent from families to help the former convict get established and a new US tourist industry from family and friends of the former convict to places few Americans would ever visit.

2. Create a voluntary public employee mentoring program. For those who choose, allocate a portion of police officers' paid work week to at risk youth mentoring programs such as the Police Athletic League. I'm talking about really young kids before the gangs get to them. Possibly extend the program to other city and state employees, especially those who work in law enforcement in some capacity and first responders.

3. Unless they suffer from medical conditions that are compounded by their use or claim a faith related exemption, require people on public assistance to be on doctor prescribed birth control their use until they are gainfully employed and no longer on government assistance.

4. Make prison less pleasant. No TV. No or limited air-conditioning. No or limited heat. No hot water. Horrible food; no salt or other seasonings and room temperature food and drinks. Require prisoners to grow much of their own food on prison farms. Create prison web pages where the public may access pages where live webcams can watch various areas of each prison 24/7 and see how miserable they are.

There is only one solution without just going in and killing them all.

Solution.....the US takes the Sinai. Calls it the 51 state. We throw up some Military bases and a few major Prisons. We throw all these types up in there. Anything jumps off in the ME. We offer them Amnesty outside the US for going and taking care of Business. Example.....Hezbollah, Meet the People. Specifically Vice-Lords, Stones, Latin Kings. We end covering Israel's back, and any ME Countries that want to talk about the Suez. Don't!!!!!

Say goodbye to Hezbollah.....within a month. Muslim Brotherhood, Meet the Folks and the People. Say goodbye to the MB within 90 days.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Chicago Police Superintendent Garry McCarthy said it was a "miracle" no one was killed when someone opened fire with a high-powered rifle at a pick-up basketball game in the Back of the Yards, and he renewed his call for a ban on assault weapons.

13 people, including 3-year-old, shot at South Side park - chicagotribune.com

Why doesn't McCarthy get off his lazy ass and go after the goofballs that are using these weapons?
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

So, basically, a ban on guns won't do anything, because if they can get the drugs in, they can get the guns in.

This is clear cut proof that a gun ban will do nothing but insure that only the bad guys will have guns.

If they can get the guns in then they can get the drugs in. This is clear cut proof that a drug ban does nothing.

:)
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Why doesn't McCarthy get off his lazy ass and go after the goofballs that are using these weapons?

Because they could end causing a war with Little kids that have guns. How does that look for the News at 4, 5 and 9? Police killing gangbanger kids. Cops would be in the Right. But the visuals won't help.

Jesse Jackson has called for Homeland Security to come in. He has called for the National Guard to be brought in. Yet why wont he take his ass out on the streets and stay there for months. Like the Occupy people?

Especially since Jesse touts that Rainbow Push Coalition.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

If they can get the guns in then they can get the drugs in. This is clear cut proof that a drug ban does nothing.

:)

Well the Latin Kings specialize in Military Ordinance......and not just from stealing here within the Country. But from all over South and Central America. They also have People in different Militaries all throughout the same.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Here is a a map of the Gang territories and the 2011 Homicides. It has an overlay.

gang-map(1).jpg


Update: @SethLavin makes the point that the above map correlates with CPS probation schools. It's true:


CPS-probation-schools.jpg


Chicago Gang Territory vs 2011 Chicago Homicides
 
Why doesn't McCarthy get off his lazy ass and go after the goofballs that are using these weapons?
if you talk about targeting perps you are talking about blacks and Hispanics. Talking about the perps brings cries of racism. No no. Much safer to spew empty headed rhetoric about the NRA and target legal gun owners.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

if you talk about targeting perps you are talking about blacks and Hispanics. Talking about the perps brings cries of racism. No no. Much safer to spew empty headed rhetoric about the NRA and target legal gun owners.

I would say the only minority around here would be these guys. ;)

Asian street gangs in Chicago

1.Asian Boyz
2.Black Shadow
3.Black Widows
4.Hop Sing
5.Local Boys
6.Wolf Boys


Oh.....and these ones. The Muslim ones.....despite the Mickies being mixed.

Jabari Stones
57.Mickey Cobras
95.The Arabian Posse.....snip~

Street gangs in Chicago, Illinois | StreetGangs.Com
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

Sure. When we get a mass killing with swords.

Mass killings never happened before the advent of guns. Ever. It was like Utopia.
 
Re: 13 People Including a Child Shot in Chicago Last Night!!

We need to remember that a large part of the "no snitch" rule is a result of a history of being lied to and mislead by the police, as well. LE played a part in their own distrust.
 
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