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Thread: US Police arrest Florida pastor

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    Re: US Police arrest Florida pastor

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    As I've already said, you can criticize America and our constitution until you are blue in the face. We will not give up our constitutional rights to please murderous enemies who already want us dead... nor will we give them up because you want us to.
    Then pull back your forces...Your not this backwater country from the 1700's anymore your the most powerful country in the world by your own making but yet you seem to get confused by how certain actions by your citizens can directly effect your troops and allied troops in combat? You can't just say what you want anymore your the big kid in the playground which is something your government understands fully.
    ‘This is not peace, it is an armistice for 20 years.’ (Ferdinand Foch. After the Treaty of Versailles, 1919).

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    Re: US Police arrest Florida pastor

    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    Then pull back your forces...Your not this backwater country from the 1700's anymore your the most powerful country in the world by your own making but yet you seem to get confused by how certain actions by your citizens can directly effect your troops and allied troops in combat? You can't just say what you want anymore your the big kid in the playground which is something your government understands fully.
    Then by all means, we should start asking for their governments to jail every single person that rails against Americans in a demonstration. Then, at home, we should start looting and becoming dogs because of a youtube video.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

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    Re: US Police arrest Florida pastor

    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    Then pull back your forces...Your not this backwater country from the 1700's anymore your the most powerful country in the world by your own making but yet you seem to get confused by how certain actions by your citizens can directly effect your troops and allied troops in combat? You can't just say what you want anymore your the big kid in the playground which is something your government understands fully.
    I tire of you telling us what we and our government should do. Tell Cameron to take it up with Obama. This one-way whinefest now bores me.

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    Re: US Police arrest Florida pastor

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    You actually don't have a say anyway. What other Constitutional rights would you like to see us "sacrifice" so as not to offend your sensibilities?
    well none of us have a say because this a debate forum and I am merely offering my opinion not trying to enforce anything. Trust me if had that kind of power I would tear the Webster dictionary up and make you speak the Queens English
    ‘This is not peace, it is an armistice for 20 years.’ (Ferdinand Foch. After the Treaty of Versailles, 1919).

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    Re: US Police arrest Florida pastor

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    As I've already said, you can criticize America and our constitution until you are blue in the face. We will not give up our constitutional rights to please murderous enemies who already want us dead... nor will we give them up because you want us to.
    Damn right!!!!

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    Re: US Police arrest Florida pastor

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    I tire of you telling us what we and our government should do. Tell Cameron to take it up with Obama. This one-way whinefest now bores me.
    As always Dianna the debate has gone over your head even though on many occasions I mentioned the fact your government would agree with me based on their actions over the last 10 years and apparently have agreed with me given the fact the Good pastor was unable to burn the books.
    ‘This is not peace, it is an armistice for 20 years.’ (Ferdinand Foch. After the Treaty of Versailles, 1919).

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    Re: US Police arrest Florida pastor

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    So should we suspend our constitutional rights whenever someone around the world might take offense and retaliate? That kind of fear would keep us from putting Muslim mass murderers like Hassan on trial, because some Muslim group might threaten to kill Americans if we do. You can see how that would snowball: Release everyone from Gitmo in two hours or Americans will die; release convicted Islamists terrorist or Americans will die; drop bombs on Tel Aviv or Americans will die... and on it goes. The constitution, as I've said, is not a suggestion. It protects the rights of all Americans, even those we despise. If we start picking out people we don't want to have free speech because of fear or offense, then none of us will ever have free speech again.

    I understand your point but I question whether this instance is not consistent with other situations where we have chosen to put limitations on an individuals First Amendment rights.

    IE:
    Speech that involves incitement, false statements of fact, obscenity, child pornography, threats, and speech owned by others are all completely exempt from First Amendment protections
    United States free speech exceptions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    The consistencies I see here is when harm is likely to be done to innocent bystanders because of your actions. This seems like it would fall inline with this criteria. I do not advocate or take lightly the notion of limits to our rights but life has taught us that there are times when we must and have chosen to do so. Like I said before, if his actions only put HIM as risk then say whatever you want, but he is making that choice for others and I don't believe he has that right. Also, I don't see Americans surrendering their rights easily. I don't think it is sensible to fear an exception for situations like this would lead us to a greater loss or larger compromise of our rights.
    "Judge a man by his questions rather than his answers" - Voltaire
    "There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow men. True nobility lies in being superior to your former self" -Hemingway

  8. #328
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    Re: US Police arrest Florida pastor

    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    No its wasn't insurgents shooting at us it was regular people who turned to the insurgents who had before that had been very co-operative however they turned violent because of this particular story and the pictures showing British troops torturing local prisoners. Yes you expect to be shot at in a hostile environment but you don't expect your own country to make the situation worse which was the point I was trying to make.

    ( I was in basra Iraq not afghan sorry might of been confusing).
    Ahh, so you were dealing with civil riots and protests. I thought about that after I posted the prior response. Hmmm, this is actually about another problem I've always had concerns with in recent uses of military forces...soldiers are not really "policemen" and we should never be used like that. Occupying forces yes, but only until we can transition government back to the people we've defeated ASAP. Sitting there for years trying to be cops is not right.

    Police are trained to deal with civilian issues, and the sooner local government can take over, the less likely civilians will riot. But as long as foreign forces are there to be targeted, insurgents will use any excuse to incite public support and hurt troops. Unfortunately, our governments are slow learners.

    I feel for you and understand what you are saying. The problem doesn't lie with exercising freedoms back home though. It really lies with governments automatic use of military intervention without a clearly defined and rapidly executed exit plan.
    If I stop responding it doesn't mean I've conceded the point or agree with you. It only means I've made my point and I don't mind you having the last word. Please wait a few minutes before "quoting" me. I often correct errors for a minute or two after I post before the final product is ready.

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    Re: US Police arrest Florida pastor

    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    As always Dianna the debate has gone over your head even though on many occasions I mentioned the fact your government would agree with me based on their actions over the last 10 years and apparently have agreed with me given the fact the Good pastor was unable to burn the books.


    If you really want to insult me, you'll have to do better than accusing me of not understanding the argument, when everyone watching can see it's the other way around.

    I'm done here. Or am I....


  10. #330
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    Re: US Police arrest Florida pastor

    Quote Originally Posted by Higgins86 View Post
    well none of us have a say because this a debate forum and I am merely offering my opinion not trying to enforce anything. Trust me if had that kind of power I would tear the Webster dictionary up and make you speak the Queens English
    Why? Does it include a bunch more words for "capitulation" that I'm not familiar with?

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