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Thread: Conn. lawmakers consider e-cigarette ban

  1. #61
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    Re: Conn. lawmakers consider e-cigarette ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    Do you understand the concept that I can put anything I want into my body??? lets call it motor oil for a ****ing second... If I want to smoke motor oil what business is it of yours??

    You'll sit there and eat twinkies all day with way more Propylene Glycol concentrate than my e-cigs but you're talking about "studies?"

    Once again tho - you don't know the first thing about Propylene Glycol considering you obviously associate it as industrial grade Propylene Glycol.... The difference between consumer grade PG and industrial grade PG is about the same as rubbing alcohol and expensive Vodka...

    Sorry to explain to you that just about every food product needs preservatives unless you buy the product fresh....

    Progressive amaze me - anti-preservative progressives want to ban guns.... So how are you going to ship the food to me without the preservatives if I cannot hunt for myself and kill my own food??

    I suppose that was a bit off topic to some extent but it makes sense here considering your concerns about individuals ingesting preservatives...

    And YES I understand some "natural flavors" aren't "natural" they're sugared down with minimal concentrate hence "natural."

    Regardless of any of this - that still doesn't change the fact that you have absolutely no ****ing right to tell me what I can and cannot ingest...
    Yes. I just don't understand why you defend companies that lie to the public.

    You can't make an informed decision about what to put in your body, if you don't know what it is, or you are being misled about what it is.

    I know a lot about PG. More than you do. Where have I associated the PG in e-juice with industrial grade? As a matter of fact, where have I said anything negative about PG at all?

    You don't even read my posts. You swallow whatever propaganda you're fed. In this case, you've been fed -- by people like CASAA -- the belief that anyone who speaks negatively about the e-cig industry is the sort of ignorant person who thinks PG is anti-freeze.

    You cannot even look past it for long enough to realize that not only am I not one of those people, but I know more about these substances than you do, and I know the people feeding you that BS personally.

    I don't give a crap what you put in your body. I only think you deserve to know what it actually is.

    It's amazing the way people will argue against their own self-interest if you lie to them just right.

  2. #62
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    Re: Conn. lawmakers consider e-cigarette ban

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors
    You can't make an informed decision about what to put in your body, if you don't know what it is, or you are being misled about what it is.
    My understanding of e-cigarettes entering the scene is that they had rushed FDA approval, like most products these days. If you have the money or business connections with someone in the FDA, you can get virtually any product pushed through the approval process without the rigorous testing that was required 20 years ago.

    I think the metal nanoparticle issue is serious. We don't allow construction workers or laboratory scientists to be exposed to inhalable metalic compounds because it can cause permanent lung damage, so it makes no sense to me whatsoever that a product that causes you to directly inhale these metals is met with approval by regulators.

    If the FDA still conducted its own impartial trials like it used to, instead of letting big businesses provide the doctored research, I really doubt e-cigarettes would be on the market.

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    Re: Conn. lawmakers consider e-cigarette ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Light View Post
    My understanding of e-cigarettes entering the scene is that they had rushed FDA approval, like most products these days. If you have the money or business connections with someone in the FDA, you can get virtually any product pushed through the approval process without the rigorous testing that was required 20 years ago.

    I think the metal nanoparticle issue is serious. We don't allow construction workers or laboratory scientists to be exposed to inhalable metalic compounds because it can cause permanent lung damage, so it makes no sense to me whatsoever that a product that causes you to directly inhale these metals is met with approval by regulators.

    If the FDA still conducted its own impartial trials like it used to, instead of letting big businesses provide the doctored research, I really doubt e-cigarettes would be on the market.
    You've given them too much credit.

    Frighteningly, e-cigarettes are not FDA approved, and neither the FDA nor the industry itself has done any substantial research.

    Yes, it's pretty damn serious, and it's only one of the things that is pretty damn serious. The "spin" that takes place in the e-cigarette world is just unbelievable.

    Based on everything I have seen, there is no quit-smoking aid on the planet that works better than e-cigarettes.

    Imagine how bad this industry must be for me to have such a negative opinion of it, and to go from almost selling them to routinely recommending people avoid them like the plague.

    Hell, I wouldn't take that chance on myself either. I relapsed due to the stress of whistle-blowing in the industry. When I quit again, I went cold turkey. I'd rather smoke tea than go back to e-cigs.

    All I want is for the industry to tell the truth to customers. If they can't do that, for the FDA to step up to the plate and MAKE them tell the truth.

    As I said, you cannot make an informed decision about what to put in your body if you don't know what it is.

    And I get castigated as though I'm some kind of R.J. Reynolds plant. That's all part of the lie they tell: "Anyone who's against us is part of big tobacco, or part of the FDA that's losing out on all this money and they want it for themselves." Or, alternatively, as Mr. Nick just did: "They're just ignorant anti-smokers who are trying to persecute us." It's so predictable. It's the same bull**** lines every time, almost word-for-word.

    They've used this line to get people to ignore all kinds of things. Here's a few I remember from my days in it:
    1. Tanks that arrived smelling and tasting like noxious fumes.
    2. Juices being found to contain an additive that causes popcorn lung.
    3. Impure/rotten/just-not-right nicotine juice being sold to consumers even though the company knew it was bad.

    I could go on forever, I'm sure. They just make it all go away with the same old lies.

    It's just amazing, the bull**** they have people believing. And the reason is because a lot of the e-cigarette take-off has taken place online. It's not just the regular stuff -- forums, YouTube videos, etc. There are actual online shows about this stuff. Seriously. There are people who make a living freelancing, reviewing, and shilling in the internet e-cig community.

    It's a 24/7 bull**** stream, in a way TV commercials never could be. And everyone's making too much money to let the whole ethics thing bother them too much.

    This, my friend, is what a totally unregulated, very lucrative marketplace looks like.
    Last edited by SmokeAndMirrors; 09-12-13 at 07:52 AM.

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    Re: Conn. lawmakers consider e-cigarette ban

    Quote Originally Posted by sbrettt View Post
    I'm going back to Marlboro's.
    There's lots of other ways to go. If you simply cannot do without, there are lots of harm reduction methods. There's the typical stuff like patches and gum, but also other tobacco products that are pretty low harm. Snus and snuff work well for some people.

    We do what we can with where we are. But there's lots of options besides "e-cigs or cigarettes."

    And if you've been doing the e-cig thing for a while, you might be in for a surprise.

    For a lot of people, it is shockingly easy to quit e-cigarettes cold. Try it.
    Last edited by SmokeAndMirrors; 09-12-13 at 07:52 AM.

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    Re: Conn. lawmakers consider e-cigarette ban

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    There's lots of other ways to go. If you simply cannot do without, there are lots of harm reduction methods. There's the typical stuff like patches and gum, but also other tobacco products that are pretty low harm. Snus and snuff work well for some people.

    We do what we can with where we are. But there's lots of options besides "e-cigs or cigarettes."

    And if you've been doing the e-cig thing for a while, you might be in for a surprise.

    For a lot of people, it is shockingly easy to quit e-cigarettes cold. Try it.
    I haven't been smoking them too long, and I use the cheap gas station ones so sure those are the worst. I've tried the gum, it actually works pretty well so I will probably go back it.
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    Re: Conn. lawmakers consider e-cigarette ban

    Quote Originally Posted by SmokeAndMirrors View Post
    Yes. I just don't understand why you defend companies that lie to the public.

    You can't make an informed decision about what to put in your body, if you don't know what it is, or you are being misled about what it is.

    I know a lot about PG. More than you do. Where have I associated the PG in e-juice with industrial grade? As a matter of fact, where have I said anything negative about PG at all?

    You don't even read my posts. You swallow whatever propaganda you're fed. In this case, you've been fed -- by people like CASAA -- the belief that anyone who speaks negatively about the e-cig industry is the sort of ignorant person who thinks PG is anti-freeze.

    You cannot even look past it for long enough to realize that not only am I not one of those people, but I know more about these substances than you do, and I know the people feeding you that BS personally.

    I don't give a crap what you put in your body. I only think you deserve to know what it actually is.

    It's amazing the way people will argue against their own self-interest if you lie to them just right.
    I read your posts.....

    I just don't understand why you give an ounce of **** about what other people ingest..... You're sticking your nose in other peoples business - and your nose doesn't belong there..

    I've already pointed out the PG is in numerous other products that people actually eat.....

    PG is the only "debatable" ingredient in "e-juice."

    There is no debate here and there should be no debate here considering one can either a) choose to smoke or use "e-juice" or b) choose not to....

    Anyone who advocates a ban is a tyrant hence an insult to the idea of freedom.

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    Re: Conn. lawmakers consider e-cigarette ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    I read your posts.....

    I just don't understand why you give an ounce of **** about what other people ingest..... You're sticking your nose in other peoples business - and your nose doesn't belong there..

    I've already pointed out the PG is in numerous other products that people actually eat.....

    PG is the only "debatable" ingredient in "e-juice."

    There is no debate here and there should be no debate here considering one can either a) choose to smoke or use "e-juice" or b) choose not to....

    Anyone who advocates a ban is a tyrant hence an insult to the idea of freedom.
    I don't. You'd know what I care about if you read my posts.

    Here's a hint: if you have to either lie about or block out what is being said to you in order to deal with it, there is something wrong with your mindset.

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