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Thread: US and Englad preparing to attack Syria?

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    Re: US and Englad preparing to attack Syria?

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Things took a turn for the worse just 4hrs ago with the Russians.....we had better think things out before attempting to launch any strike on Syria.


    Russia, West on collision course over Syria.....

    Russia's two-and-a-half year dispute with the West over the conflict in Syria hit a new peak Monday as Moscow warned against military action without UN approval and cast doubt over the regime's involvement in a claimed chemical weapons attack.

    A telephone call Monday between Russian President Vladimir Putin and British Prime Minister David Cameron underlined how far apart Moscow and the West were.
    With clamour growing in Western states for military action against Assad, Russia warned such intervention would destabilise the entire Middle East and be based on false reasoning.

    "If force is used without a UN resolution it will lead to very serious consequences in relations between Russia and the United States and its NATO partners," said Alexander Filonik, a Middle East expert at the Institute of Oriental Studies of the Russian Academy of Sciences.

    At a hastily called news conference Monday, Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said any use of force against Syria without UN approval would be a "very grave violation of international law."

    He said ideas floated in the West about knocking out the regime's military infrastructure and helping hand victory to rebels were not just an "illusion" but a "grave mistake that will not lead to any peace, but only mark a new, even bloodier stage of the war in Syria."

    Taking military action against Assad would be a clear sign from the West that it does not want to take account of Moscow's opinion, Maria Lipman of the Carnegie Centre in Moscow told AFP.

    "Moscow could not let that go by without a response," she said, adding that Russia could hit back by strengthening military cooperation with the Assad regime.
    "London and Washington... just need a guilty verdict (on Assad). Any other verdict will be rejected," the head of the lower house of Russian parliament's foreign affairs committee, Alexei Pushkov, wrote on Twitter......snip~

    Russia, West on collision course over Syria
    AFP – 4 hrs ago<<<<<More here.
    And the thing is, Russia is right about this.

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    Re: US and Englad preparing to attack Syria?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    And the thing is, Russia is right about this.
    I keep thinking all Russia has to do is put up a blockade. Do a return favor over Cuba likes. Wont even have to fire a shot. No one in the West will want to Start off WWIII. Already Russia is telling them China will back them. So they wont have the Vote on the Council.....to make a Move.

    So when the Brits said there wouldn't need to be a UN mandate. Putin got on the phone. Said what he had to say. Then let Lavrov take it from there. Plus Iran then chimed in and told us. The Red Line in the Sand for us. Is Syria.

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    Re: US and Englad preparing to attack Syria?

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    I keep thinking all Russia has to do is put up a blockade. Do a return favor over Cuba likes. Wont even have to fire a shot. No one in the West will want to Start off WWIII. Already Russia is telling them China will back them. So they wont have the Vote on the Council.....to make a Move.

    So when the Brits said there wouldn't need to be a UN mandate. Putin got on the phone. Said what he had to say. Then let Lavrov take it from there. Plus Iran then chimed in and told us. The Red Line in the Sand for us. Is Syria.

    Yep. Now if they'll only put their money where their mouth is and stand firm.

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    Re: US and Englad preparing to attack Syria?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Yep. Now if they'll only put their money where their mouth is and stand firm.
    That's true.....as Russia could be just playing Assad even though they had him on Russian TV live today. You don't think they would tricks him like that now, do ya?

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    Re: US and Englad preparing to attack Syria?

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    That's true.....as Russia could be just playing Assad even though they had him on Russian TV live today. You don't think they would tricks him like that now, do ya?

    Well any things possible but then it wouldn't be skin off our teeth. Syria has been a Russian ally for a long time though. And have you ever seen Russia stand as strong on anything as they have Syria in the last couple years?

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    Re: US and Englad preparing to attack Syria?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Rarely.
    What would be your litmus? What would it take for you to say, "Ok, yeah, we really need to do something." Or, if not us, then someone else with the ability.
    "Political speech and writing are largely the defense of the indefensible. . . . Thus political language has to consist largely of euphemism, question-begging and sheer cloudy vagueness."
    ~Orwell, Politics and the English Language

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    Re: US and Englad preparing to attack Syria?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gonzo Rodeo View Post
    What would be your litmus? What would it take for you to say, "Ok, yeah, we really need to do something." Or, if not us, then someone else with the ability.
    Someone else with the ability would always be nice. A consensus from the permanent members of the security council a must. In a case like Syria, everybody has to agree with what's going on. Presently, with Russia accusing the US of pre arranging a chemical attack to frame the Assad government, all bets are definitely off. And in this case at hand, had their not been under the radar assistance to the insurgents, Assad most likely would have crushed the uprising early on and we wouldn't be wringing our hands over 100,000 dead right now. But again with the US waiting for an opportunity to realise a long held goal, toppling the Assad government, the covert involvement disables Assad's ability to quell the uprising and it perpetuates until the US can say, look he's killed (never mind the fact that half or more are killed by the insurgents) 100,000 people, oh dear, we must do something. How many times do we have to see the same picture again before we call bs on our government? The Russians are jumping up and down and calling it, its so blatantly obvious.

    Oh yes. And lets not forget the fact that the Assad government accepted Un inspectors to the site where chemical weapons were used, eager for the world to see that they hadn't used them, but it was insurgent snipers that opened fire on the teams causing them to retreat! So, who is it that's not interested in the truth here?
    Last edited by Montecresto; 08-27-13 at 02:17 AM.

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    Re: US and Englad preparing to attack Syria?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    So, who is it that's not interested in the truth here?
    That is a great big question, right there.

    Is not the involvement of Iran and/or Russia patently obvious in Afghanistan and Iraq? This seems to be something all major nation-states do. Is it "as wrong" when we do it as when the other guy does it? I'd like to think we could safely call a spade a spade and realize the same tactics used in the Korean and Viet Nam wars are still in full swing... but I'm not so sure everyone sees both sides of the picture.

    It seems as if you're saying the US is complicit in supporting the rebels, and that this is wrong. If so, does this mean all support of all rebels is always wrong? Or is it only wrong when the UN doesn't acknowledge it, maybe? I'm trying to get a sense of what "wrong" means to someone taking the entire geopolitical landscape into consideration.
    "Political speech and writing are largely the defense of the indefensible. . . . Thus political language has to consist largely of euphemism, question-begging and sheer cloudy vagueness."
    ~Orwell, Politics and the English Language

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    Re: US and Englad preparing to attack Syria?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gonzo Rodeo View Post
    That is a great big question, right there.

    Is not the involvement of Iran and/or Russia patently obvious in Afghanistan and Iraq? This seems to be something all major nation-states do. Is it "as wrong" when we do it as when the other guy does it? I'd like to think we could safely call a spade a spade and realize the same tactics used in the Korean and Viet Nam wars are still in full swing... but I'm not so sure everyone sees both sides of the picture.

    It seems as if you're saying the US is complicit in supporting the rebels, and that this is wrong. If so, does this mean all support of all rebels is always wrong? Or is it only wrong when the UN doesn't acknowledge it, maybe? I'm trying to get a sense of what "wrong" means to someone taking the entire geopolitical landscape into consideration.
    I understand your points here, and your concern. Is all support of all rebels always wrong? I think there's a lot of variables that would make multiple answers to that question, but generally, I'm going to say yes. If we genuinely want peace, happiness and security for all involved. So Syria is the topic at hand, ill use it. Russia has declared publicly that Syria is a sovereign country with a sovereign legitimate government, the US doesn't quite see it that way. One thing is for certain, if a homegrown insurgency occurred in a US ally state, lets say Great Britain, and Russia was covertly arming and training the insurgents to help them topple the British government, how do you think we would view such involvement? It must be acknowledged that this is the way it is in Syria. And Russia has stood steadfast in their declaration that they are not going to allow the US to do to Syria what they've done elsewhere in the ME. And then of course, sense there are al Qaida elements throughout the syrian insurgency, its INSANITY that the US has and apparently will continue to support them.

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    Re: US and Englad preparing to attack Syria?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Is all support of all rebels always wrong?
    Yes, unless the rebels attack the U.S. or U.S. interests. We should always avoid getting involved in the internal business of other countries. We aren't even very good at it.

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