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Thread: who killed these babies ?

  1. #21
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    Re: who killed these babies ?

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    That al depends. If there's a vettable "good guy", then we should become involved. In the case of Syria, we would be helping the bad guys, no matter who we sided with.

    Personally, I believe that if we did become involved, I would like to see us target government AND rebel units.
    I disagree. We've done exactly that time and again and it's only gotten us into trouble. If there is a "vettable good guy" then the people will support him and he will eventually succeed on his own. If not, then maybe the next "good guy" who tries will. The best way to deal with any situation involving internal strife is to let the citizen's settle it on their own. IMO eventually they'll get it right, even if the government isn't one we'd approve of.

    Meanwhile we would not have made any enemies like we have from past interference.
    If I stop responding it doesn't mean I've conceded the point or agree with you. It only means I've made my point and I don't mind you having the last word. Please wait a few minutes before "quoting" me. I often correct errors for a minute or two after I post before the final product is ready.

  2. #22
    feckless bon vivant

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    Re: who killed these babies ?

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Saddamn needed a hiding place.
    -----------

    Why would he bother?
    The invasion was going to happen and exporting his WMD's wouldn't have saved his sorry ass.
    No matter how cynical I become toward politicians, it's never enough.

  3. #23
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    Re: who killed these babies ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post
    I can respect your opinion without agreeing with it.
    Thank you, I respect your opinion as well.
    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post
    Each society is responsible for it's own internal affairs without hindrance.
    I agree totally.
    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post
    Your appeal to emotion would have us involved in conflicts all over the world, and even where we won we'd need to stay in place a significant period of time in order to "rebuild" their civil affairs. That is not our job.
    Genocide is not a global problem. Thank goodness. Nation building is not what the military is for. We have USAID and other parts of our government that can help with that. We have been in that business since the turn of the last century. We've only recently began to use the military to do so. Even after WWII, the military wasn't the part of our government that rebuilt Europe of Japan, even though MacArthur thought he was.

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post
    If we see genocide we can offer sanctuary to refugees, we can boycott and take other political and economic measures against the offending government.
    And I agree with this as well. This should be our first, longest and most focused effort.
    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post
    IMO we should NOT intervene militarily.
    99.9% I would agree with that. But realistically, there may come a time in every event in life, where force is the last remaining option. That is why we have civilian police here at home. Negotiating sometimes works, like when Antoinette Huff talked down that shooter in the Georgia school other day. But there are other times, when SWAT has to go in. I hate use the police analogy, since you and I agree our military isn't the world's police force. But it is an apropos analogy regarding force.

    I'm not beating the military intervention drum. And I hope that a stand-off launching of cruise missiles at Assad's military targets will get the point across to stop the genocide. If they stop the chemical warfare, but continue the civil war, then we stand down and let them fight it out. If the Syrian military starts using conventional means to restart the genocide, like what happened in the Balkans in the '90's, then we must step up again.

    I know we don't agree on this. I would like to to tell you though that I appreciate and respect both your opinion and the way you put it forth in this thread.

  4. #24
    Canadian Conservative
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    Re: who killed these babies ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    Well, considering that Saddam sent his weapons to Assad....however, that part of the world is just crawling with insane Salafists so who knows.
    I've been suggesting this possibility for years, but since there's no way to prove it it's usually dismissed and laughed at. One possible benefit of the Syrian civil war is that we may get an answer in the future unless, of course, they get moved to Lebanon.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

  5. #25
    global liberation

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    Re: who killed these babies ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    Poison Gas isn't the only thing Saddam took there. Syria didn't import it. They hid it for Saddam, and helped spread it across the region, where some of it ended up in Libya, as was found by a CNN news team.
    Citation?

  6. #26
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    Re: who killed these babies ?

    Quote Originally Posted by radioman View Post
    -------------
    Is that right?
    Since poison gas is easily manufactured, how would anyone know it originated in Iraq?
    I'm really not trying to be difficult here, but poison gas can be made by anyone.
    You're not being difficult. You're voicing your opinion and debating in a respectful manner, so I have no problem.

    I didn't mean to insinuate that the gas being used now is the same gas from Saddam's regime. And you're correct. All you need is a little Freon and a flame to pass it through and you can have some Phosgene gas. Pretty simple.

  7. #27
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    Re: who killed these babies ?

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Citation?
    Do you remember the Yellow Cake that was found in an abandoned building in the desert by a CNN crew?

  8. #28
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    Re: who killed these babies ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post
    I disagree. We've done exactly that time and again and it's only gotten us into trouble. If there is a "vettable good guy" then the people will support him and he will eventually succeed on his own. If not, then maybe the next "good guy" who tries will. The best way to deal with any situation involving internal strife is to let the citizen's settle it on their own. IMO eventually they'll get it right, even if the government isn't one we'd approve of.

    Meanwhile we would not have made any enemies like we have from past interference.
    Doing it in 1941 didn't get us in trouble. In fact, waiting until 1941 cost far more American lives.

    There were vettable good guys in Iraq after Desert Storm. Did we support them? No. The Result? The invasion of Iraq in 2003.

    There were vettable good guys in Iran a few years ago. Did we support them? No. The result? That remains to be seen, as Iran's nuclear capabilities grow everyday.

    There were vettable good guys in Rwanda. Did we act? No. The result? Nearly a million innocent people were murdered.

    The notion that we should turn a blind eye to EVERY crisis is nave, at best.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  9. #29
    global liberation

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    Re: who killed these babies ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Beaudreaux View Post
    Do you remember the Yellow Cake that was found in an abandoned building in the desert by a CNN crew?
    I would like a citation proving that Saddam moved chems through Syria. While you're not obligated to provide such, I would find it useful in future debates.

  10. #30
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    Re: who killed these babies ?

    Quote Originally Posted by radioman View Post
    -----------

    Why would he bother?
    The invasion was going to happen and exporting his WMD's wouldn't have saved his sorry ass.
    US forces finding the weapons sure as hell wouldn't help his cause, on the international scene.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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