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Thread: Tom Coburn: Obama 'Getting Perilously Close' To Standard For Impeachment

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    Re: Tom Coburn: Obama 'Getting Perilously Close' To Standard For Impeachment

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    Very interesting article! for providing. Some of the comments made at the conclusion of this article are, if true, frightening!
    The supposed waiving of welfare work requirements was completely false. In fact, what happened was giving more freedom to states than they had before, a request made by several "red" states in the first place. Ask Democrats for something, attack them for giving it to you, typical right-wing.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: Tom Coburn: Obama 'Getting Perilously Close' To Standard For Impeachment

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    The supposed waiving of welfare work requirements was completely false. In fact, what happened was giving more freedom to states than they had before, a request made by several "red" states in the first place. Ask Democrats for something, attack them for giving it to you, typical right-wing.
    The requirement certainly was waived. The question is not who asked for it, but whether granting it was legal.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Tom Coburn: Obama 'Getting Perilously Close' To Standard For Impeachment

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    The requirement certainly was waived. The question is not who asked for it, but whether granting it was legal.
    No, not at all accurate. You were straight-up lied to.

    A state could apply for a waiver from the work requirement to test out their own substitution for that requirement. The state would then have to show improved work outcomes or they'd lose their waiver. A 20% improvement in work outcomes was required.

    And yes, it's legal.
    Last edited by Deuce; 08-24-13 at 08:10 PM.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: Tom Coburn: Obama 'Getting Perilously Close' To Standard For Impeachment

    Meh, I see the "impeachment" talk the last act of a desperate party. Republicans see the writing on the wall. They know there is a very real division in their ranks, a division which has turned off many people in this country. They know the economy is getting better, unemployment is going down and the deficit is decreasing. All of the scare tactics they've used for the last five years could likely ring hollow very soon, regardless of whether Obama deserves credit or not.

    And if those things do come true, AND if Hilary decides to run, Republicans know they might as well concede the election before it starts. Right now, "impeachment" may be their best chance to undermine the Democrat who is President, and by association, the next Democrat, much like they did to Clinton and Gore.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dooble View Post
    Pointing your finger and calling me names isn't helping your defense. That list gives good reason to suspect violations. In light of what's below, one should be suspicious every word or action taken by Barack Obama.

    President Obama’s top 10 constitutional violations | The Daily Caller


    When the very first thing on your list is a joke, you should not use that list as a source.

    1. The individual mandate
    No list of President Obama’s constitutional violations would be complete without including the requirement that every American purchase health insurance, on penalty of civil fine. The individual mandate is unprecedented and exceeds Congress’s power to regulate interstate commerce. If it is allowed to stand, Congress will be able to impose any kind of economic mandate as part of any kind of national regulatory scheme. Fortunately, the Supreme Court has a chance to strike this down during its current term.


    Ignoring for a moment the Supreme Court already decided it wasn't a Constitutional violation, if you would read your Constitution you'd know the President is not capable of creating laws. Thus, it would be a violation of the powers of Congress (which the Supreme Court said it wasn't) and not a Constitutional violation by President Obama.


    What an absolutely asinine list. And I didn't even read #2.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    The supposed waiving of welfare work requirements was completely false. In fact, what happened was giving more freedom to states than they had before, a request made by several "red" states in the first place. Ask Democrats for something, attack them for giving it to you, typical right-wing.
    It really does suck people can be so uneducated on the issues and yet have their vote count as much as yours, doesn't it?

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    Re: Tom Coburn: Obama 'Getting Perilously Close' To Standard For Impeachment

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    No, not at all accurate. You were straight-up lied to.

    A state could apply for a waiver from the work requirement to test out their own substitution for that requirement. The state would then have to show improved work outcomes or they'd lose their waiver.

    And yes, it's legal.
    Well, now that you've pronounced on the legal question I guess there's no need for further discussion.

    The difference of course is that states have been relieved of the requirement to show improved outcomes.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Tom Coburn: Obama 'Getting Perilously Close' To Standard For Impeachment

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    The difference of course is that states have been relieved of the requirement to show improved outcomes.
    While the TANF work participation requirements are contained in section 407, section 402(a)(1)(A)(iii) requires that the state plan “[e]nsure that parents and caretakers receiving assistance under the program engage in work activities in accordance with section 407.” Thus, HHS has authority to waive compliance with this 402 requirement and authorize a state to test approaches and methods other than those set forth in section 407, including definitions of work activities and engagement, specified limitations, verification procedures, and the calculation of participation rates. As described below, however, HHS will only consider approving waivers relating to the work participation requirements that make changes intended to lead to more effective means of meeting the work goals of TANF.

    Moreover, HHS is committed to ensuring that any demonstration projects approved under this authority will be focused on improving employment outcomes and contributing to the evidence base for effective programs; therefore, terms and conditions will require a federally-approved evaluation plan designed to build our knowledge base. TANF funds may be used to fund an approved evaluation and state funds spent on an approved evaluation may be considered state maintenance-of-effort (MOE) expenditures. In addition, terms and conditions will require either interim targets for each performance measure or a strategy for establishing baseline performance on a set of performance measures and a framework for how interim goals will be set after the baseline measures are established. The terms and conditions will establish consequences for failing to meet interim performance targets including, but not limited to, the implementation of an improvement plan and, if the failure to meet performance targets continues, termination of the waivers and demonstration project.
    TANF-ACF-IM-2012-03 (Guidance concerning waiver and expenditure authority under Section 1115) | Office of Family Assistance | Administration for Children and Families

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    Re: Tom Coburn: Obama 'Getting Perilously Close' To Standard For Impeachment

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Well, now that you've pronounced on the legal question I guess there's no need for further discussion.

    The difference of course is that states have been relieved of the requirement to show improved outcomes.
    Feel free to show some evidence of that.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: Tom Coburn: Obama 'Getting Perilously Close' To Standard For Impeachment

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    The supposed waiving of welfare work requirements was completely false. In fact, what happened was giving more freedom to states than they had before, a request made by several "red" states in the first place. Ask Democrats for something, attack them for giving it to you, typical right-wing.
    Deuce, I was responding to an article in the Washington Post provided by Jack Hays that was discussing impeachment.. I have no idea what you are referring to here. Sorry.

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    Re: Tom Coburn: Obama 'Getting Perilously Close' To Standard For Impeachment

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Feel free to show some evidence of that.
    "Moreover, HHS is committed to ensuring that any demonstration projects approved under this authority will be focused on improving employment outcomes and contributing to the evidence base for effective programs; therefore, terms and conditions will require a federally-approved evaluation plan designed to build our knowledge base. TANF funds may be used to fund an approved evaluation and state funds spent on an approved evaluation may be considered state maintenance-of-effort (MOE) expenditures. In addition, terms and conditions will require either interim targets for each performance measure or a strategy for establishing baseline performance on a set of performance measures and a framework for how interim goals will be set after the baseline measures are established. The terms and conditions will establish consequences for failing to meet interim performance targets including, but not limited to, the implementation of an improvement plan and, if the failure to meet performance targets continues, termination of the waivers and demonstration project."

    Blah blah blah. The long way to say that the requirement was waived.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Tom Coburn: Obama 'Getting Perilously Close' To Standard For Impeachment

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    "Moreover, HHS is committed to ensuring that any demonstration projects approved under this authority will be focused on improving employment outcomes and contributing to the evidence base for effective programs; therefore, terms and conditions will require a federally-approved evaluation plan designed to build our knowledge base. TANF funds may be used to fund an approved evaluation and state funds spent on an approved evaluation may be considered state maintenance-of-effort (MOE) expenditures. In addition, terms and conditions will require either interim targets for each performance measure or a strategy for establishing baseline performance on a set of performance measures and a framework for how interim goals will be set after the baseline measures are established. The terms and conditions will establish consequences for failing to meet interim performance targets including, but not limited to, the implementation of an improvement plan and, if the failure to meet performance targets continues, termination of the waivers and demonstration project."

    Blah blah blah. The long way to say that the requirement was waived.
    .....you have to be joking. Seriously, you have to be putting us on right now. There is no way you can read what is written there and stick to your position.

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