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Thread: Federal court halts Christian prayers at North Carolina county meetings [W:656]

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    re: Federal court halts Christian prayers at North Carolina county meetings [W:656]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    That doesn't make any sense...

    You do realize that forbidding an individual from praying anytime anywhere would violate the First Amendment?
    If you wanna pray on the floor of the legislator you can do it all you want be it in your head, in your voice to yourself, it cannot however be apart of the official legislative business on the record to open up the session. Wanna pray in the leigslator before with a group go ahead, wanna do it outside the doors go ahead, it cannot be apart of the official legislative business. This isnt "authoritatrian" or "tyrranical" or whatever you wanna call it. Its respecting liberty and having respect for others religions.


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    re: Federal court halts Christian prayers at North Carolina county meetings [W:656]

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Yes there is. "In the words of Thomas Jefferson, the clause against establishment of religion by law was intended to erect a wall of separation between church and state."-Justice Hugo Black
    You have clearly never read the Jefferson letters - I have.

    You do realize Jefferson was making reference to theocracies? not that any of this matters considering Jeffersons letters are not founding documents or legislation .

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    re: Federal court halts Christian prayers at North Carolina county meetings [W:656]

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    If you wanna pray on the floor of the legislator you can do it all you want be it in your head, in your voice to yourself, it cannot however be apart of the official legislative business on the record to open up the session. Wanna pray in the leigslator before with a group go ahead, wanna do it outside the doors go ahead, it cannot be apart of the official legislative business. This isnt "authoritatrian" or "tyrranical" or whatever you wanna call it. Its respecting liberty and having respect for others religions.
    Have you ever heard of the concept of freedom of speech and expression?

    Those are two more ideas protected by the First Amendment.

    BTW, I love how you're slaughtering civil liberties, more specifically our First Amendment.

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    re: Federal court halts Christian prayers at North Carolina county meetings [W:656]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    You have clearly never read the Jefferson letters - I have.

    You do realize Jefferson was making reference to theocracies? not that any of this matters considering Jeffersons letters are not founding documents or legislation .
    That wasnt jefferson that was Justice Hugo Black...


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    re: Federal court halts Christian prayers at North Carolina county meetings [W:656]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    Have you ever heard of the concept of freedom of speech and expression?
    No one is saying they cant pray! Can you not read? What they are saying is that you cannot open official legislative business by endorsing a religion by praying! They are free to pray all they want on their own.



    BTW, I love how you're slaughtering civil liberties, more specifically our First Amendment.
    Yea... Except i have various USSC documents and other lawsuits to back up that this lawsuit ensured the protection of the 1st amending.


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    re: Federal court halts Christian prayers at North Carolina county meetings [W:656]

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    That wasnt jefferson that was Justice Hugo Black...
    You don't know what the hell you're talking about and a brief google doesn't do your argument any justice considering you're wrong.

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    re: Federal court halts Christian prayers at North Carolina county meetings [W:656]

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    No one is saying they cant pray! Can you not read? What they are saying is that you cannot open official legislative business by endorsing a religion by praying! They are free to pray all they want on their own.



    Yea... Except i have various USSC documents and other lawsuits to back up that this lawsuit ensured the protection of the 1st amending.
    You do realize that the First Amendment bans religious based legislation?

    You would have a point if it was LAW to open any meeting with a prayer but it's not law - it's individuals agreeing to pray collectively.

    Do you not understand this or is free will too complicated for you to understand?

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    re: Federal court halts Christian prayers at North Carolina county meetings [W:656]

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    My point is that our earliest representatives didn't see prayer opening a meeting as a violation of church and state.
    They also allowed slavery and gave no rights to women. We are not required to continue their hypocritical behavior or beliefs, especially when it contradicts the constitution.
    Last edited by Hard Truth; 07-27-13 at 05:59 PM.

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    re: Federal court halts Christian prayers at North Carolina county meetings [W:656]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    Have you ever heard of the concept of freedom of speech and expression?

    Those are two more ideas protected by the First Amendment.

    BTW, I love how you're slaughtering civil liberties, more specifically our First Amendment.
    Am official presiding over a taxpayer-funded official meeeting has the duty to run the meeting in a religiously neutral manner. That official is no longer an individual, her is representing the city government. Elected officials have other opportunites during the course of the meeting to express their opinions or say a prayer. But while presiding over the rituals that are part of the official meeting opening, the chairperson has a moral and legal obligation to be religiously neutral. Official City Council meetings cost a few hundred dollars per hour in staff time and other expenses. Using that money for religious purposes is wrong.

    The honest fact is that most of you would not be defending this practice if it was a Muslim, Satanic or Scientology prayer or an atheist speech that was part of the official opening of the meeting every week.
    Last edited by Hard Truth; 07-27-13 at 06:00 PM.

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    re: Federal court halts Christian prayers at North Carolina county meetings [W:656]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    You do realize that the First Amendment bans religious based legislation?

    You would have a point if it was LAW to open any meeting with a prayer but it's not law - it's individuals agreeing to pray collectively.

    Do you not understand this or is free will too complicated for you to understand?
    When those "individuals" are elected officials making an agreement during, or about, the proceedings of an official meeting it is law.

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